BMW 123d or alternative

chet84 said:
I don't, that's why I put quoted figures! In my experience of driving large engined petrols, i've never got close to the quoted mpg in over a week of my normal driving conditions. :(
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Going by a friend's 335i, the 135i will probably average mid to high 20s, the 123d will likely average mid to low 40s so the cost gap should be smaller than the calculations using quoted figures.
 
Howard said:
18k isn't really diesel territory if you enjoy driving and want some fun. No, the 123d won't be slow but it won't have the same sparkle as a nice smooth 6 cylinder petrol either
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I wouldn't want to do 18k miles in my ST220! It costs me about £2.5k/year in fuel to do just 8,000 miles.
 
The 1 Series never got the N53 6 cylinder engines and stayed with the N52, so you don't get the suprisingly awesome economy you get from an N53. In practice the 125i isn't significantly more economical than the 135i and unless your driving is long distance biased averaging 33mpg probably isn't going to happen.

But lets be realistic - we have here a chap who wants something 'a bit fun' and thinks the answer is a 4 pot diesel. I see little reason for him to spend the extra money buying and running a large capacity petrol engined car when from his tastes it would seem he'd get all he wanted from the smaller engined stuff anyway.

Yes, I know its daft to spend £15k on a car and then obsess over fuel economy whilst ignoring things like depreciation but thats just how most people are I guess.
 
[TW]Fox;22883066 said:
The 1 Series never got the N53 6 cylinder engines and stayed with the N52, so you don't get the suprisingly awesome economy you get from an N53. In practice the 125i isn't significantly more economical than the 135i and unless your driving is long distance biased averaging 33mpg probably isn't going to happen.

But lets be realistic - we have here a chap who wants something 'a bit fun' and thinks the answer is a 4 pot diesel. I see little reason for him to spend the extra money buying and running a large capacity petrol engined car when from his tastes it would seem he'd get all he wanted from the smaller engined stuff anyway.

Yes, I know its daft to spend £15k on a car and then obsess over fuel economy whilst ignoring things like depreciation but thats just how most people are I guess.
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It's an interesting point you make. I never really thought about depreciation because I have that money in a lump sum to spend on the car (i'm not saying this is the correct way to think about it). The monthly costs are the payments that are going to hurt, and in the case of a car that would be fuel (variable and unpredictable). Everything else I can pretty much put a definitive number against and am happy with - insurance, consumables, warranty, tax etc
 
It's a rear wheeled drive 200bhp twin turbo'd 4 pot diesel that does 0-60 in 7 seconds whilst returning 50+ mpg.

On paper it is a fun car that appears to give very good economy. Other than people saying "buy a petrol", "18k per year isn't diesel territory" (which it definitely is by the way) there aren't any comprehensive arguements against the car.

The only arguement against buying the car isn't against the car, it's against the duality of the OP's requirements, on one hand he wants to save money, on the other he want's to spend £15k on a car to ruin its residuals by putting 18,000 miles per year on it.

I struggle to ever see a reason to buy an expensive diesel, as the more expensive a car becomes the less that fuel costs represent in the total cost of ownership.

I don't even know what I'm trying to argue anymore, I'm as confused as this thread and the advice within it. In short, spend £4-5K on a high spec 2.0 petrol Focus/Mondeo and save some money for your kid.
 
Malc said:
It's a rear wheeled drive 200bhp twin turbo'd 4 pot diesel that does 0-60 in 7 seconds whilst returning 50+ mpg.

On paper it is a fun car that appears to give very good economy.
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And as we both know, just because something is fun "on paper" doesn't make it so.

My 330d, with it's 6-cylinder 3 litre ~230BHP engine by your definition should have been "fun", but compared to my SLOWER 325i, it wasn't anywhere near as interesting to drive.

I'm not saying it wasn't good in its own right as a car however.
 
[TW]Fox;22883269 said:
It does not do 0-60 in 7 seconds whilst returning 50mpg :p

If you use the performance it offers you'll be seeing 35-45mpg as an average.
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What are you trying to prove? When comparing cars you quote the book specs.

The figures say it can get 55mpg combined and it can do 0-60 in 7 seconds. They're obviously all there for guidance and massively dependent on how the car is driven and that is entirely up to the driver.
 
Malc said:
What are you trying to prove? When comparing cars you quote the book specs.

The figures say it can get 55mpg combined and it can do 0-60 in 7 seconds. They're obviously all there for guidance and massively dependent on how the car is driven and that is entirely up to the driver.
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I think if you re-read his post, that isn't what he's actually saying :D
 
Imy said:
I wouldn't want to do 18k miles in my ST220! It costs me about £2.5k/year in fuel to do just 8,000 miles.
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I did roughly 15k last year and it cost roughly £3.2k. These are figures from Fuelly so I may have missed out one or two fuel-ups but I'm pretty religious with inputting them. My long term average MPG is 26.5. I'm certainly nowhere near the point at which I am considering buying a diesel.
 
Howard said:
I did roughly 15k last year and it cost roughly £3.2k. These are figures from Fuelly so I may have missed out one or two fuel-ups but I'm pretty religious with inputting them. My long term average MPG is 26.5. I'm certainly nowhere near the point at which I am considering buying a diesel.
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Over 3 years though, that's 10k. It would probably be half that in a diesel-wagon.

Could out of warranty repairs eat into your remaining 5k? They could take a fair chunk out of it I would imagine.

Paradigm put it as 20 quid a week extra or something to not have to listen to dag dag noises at idle; it's a compelling argument tbh.

Personally, I still don't know what to choose but for the moment I am erring towards older diesels that can't explode near my wallet.
 
Malc said:
What are you trying to prove? When comparing cars you quote the book specs.

The figures say it can get 55mpg combined and it can do 0-60 in 7 seconds. They're obviously all there for guidance and massively dependent on how the car is driven and that is entirely up to the driver.
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Even the most frugal of drivers would struggle to get 55mpg as a day to day average. Every 4 pot 1 series I have driven has been hugely far out from the quoted figures.
 
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