Can you get refund ?

[darude]

Play nicely guys [two smileys dancing happily together with party hats]

 

[helmutcheese]

K Boss

 

[JBuk]

At the end of the day it's fairly academic because, as Secret_Window points out, the retailer can just ignore you and refuse to take the items back. The law may be on your side but are you really prepared to take legal action to recover the money? Perhaps you would on higher value items but on smaller value ones most people just won't bother and the retailer knows that.

retailers refusing to take goods back under the DSR are breaking the law, and yes i would take legal action to recoup my losses even if it was a low value item

 

[Vertigo]

retailers refusing to take goods back under the DSR are breaking the law, and yes i would take legal action to recoup my losses even if it was a low value item

Which is your choice, all I said is that some manufacturers will leave it to the customer to challenge them, knowing that most will capitulate. When the sums are relatively small, most people won't be bothered to take legal procedings to recover the cost - life's too short basically.

 

[The Running Man]

the law is meant to give Distance sold buyers the same opportunity to inspect the goods as a customer would do in a shop.

in my eyes it is then dependent on the product and WHETHER the shop would have actually let you open the packaging to inspect it in the shop or not.

for example say in a highstreet shop i wanted to inspect a set of headphones that are in a solid sealed plastic see through packaging, the employees probably wouldnt let you open the packaging as it could not be opened and re-sealed again.

therefore why should they have to take it back opened just because someone has purchased it over the internet?

(note other products with cardboard boxes that can be opened/closed without being damaged or reducing the value they would probably demonstrate in the shop at retail level and therefore you would expect the same over the internet...)

 

[helmutcheese]

@ Nickg, I know what you mean but it dont matter as thats the way it is.

Its safer to buy online from customers POV, esp if a LCD and it ends up with stuck/dead pixels.

Now the UK LAW on that sucks and you would have to keep a TV at say £2000 that should be flawless as new, so simply return under DSA (infact monitor section had this topic).

 

[JBuk]

Which is your choice, all I said is that some manufacturers will leave it to the customer to challenge them, knowing that most will capitulate. When the sums are relatively small, most people won't be bothered to take legal procedings to recover the cost - life's too short basically.

i have no doubt that some companys do wait until challenged, but all this would take is a phone call to trading standards and consumer direct to start the ball rolling

wouldnt companys that frequently show a complete disregard for the law get some forum of punishment?

 

[cavemanoc]

Ho-Hum

While I do enjoy the lively debates on this forum, and it its what keeps me coming back for more, this one - and the current one on the Sale of Goods Act - really is pointless. There is no room for 'opinion' or 'feelings'. There is the law, the guidelines laid down by the OFT, and it's interpretation by the courts that make up the duality that is Statute and Precedent.

If you really do want to continue discussing this might I suggest a quick read of the following:

The Consumer Protection (Distance Selling)(Amendment) Regulations 2005 (DSRs).
OFT Guidelines for the Above.
Guide To Businesses

Not much more to be said really. Below are a couple of quotes from the OFT's guidelines that I think are useful.

audio or video recordings or computer software that the customer
has unsealed

-Note that ONLY in these cases is the unsealing of the material is important - this implies that anything else can be unsealed - see also the quotes below that reinforce this argument.

We are conscious of concerns about reselling items which may raise concerns about hygiene. However, the DSRs do not link cancellation rights with a supplier’s ability to resell items as new.

-Even if breaking the seals means the item cannot be sold 'as new' you can still return it.

the consumer has a duty under the DSRs to take
reasonable care of the goods throughout the cancellation period

-BUT

What constitutes reasonable care depends on a number of things. It may be reasonable for the supplier to stipulate what they consider to be reasonable care, such as not removing hygiene seals on garments or only trying out shoes indoors. But these stipulations cannot restrict a consumer’s reasonable opportunity to inspect and assess the product. Consumers have the right to cancel even if they fail to take reasonable care of the goods; however the DSRs do give suppliers a right of action against consumers for breach of the statutory duty to take reasonable care.

-Even if you abuse the product you are still entitled to return it - it is then up to the supplier to pursue you for restitution for the damage, and your breach of duty.

You are not allowed to make any further charges, such as a stocking charge or an administration charge.

-I missed this one - must have come in with the 2005 amendment. Cool!

From reading up on this previously I know that it used to be true that you didn't even have to return the items in their original packaging, although I can no longer find the reference unfortunately. Again this points to the fact that, irrespective of the sellers ability to resell the item 'as new', you are entitled to take it out of the packaging to inspect it.

 

[Tooks]

Don't forget also that the DSR helps internet retailers sell as well.

How many of us would even use internet retailers if we didn't have this sort of protection?

It works for them too IMO...

 

[cavemanoc]

Don't forget also that the DSR helps internet retailers sell as well.

How many of us would even use internet retailers if we didn't have this sort of protection?

It works for them too IMO...

^^ What he said!

 

[Corasik]

Buying items over the internet is very different to buying in your local shop..........as you can't see the item/s your buying

From a buyers point of view DSR is even better than buying in a shop. Most shops that shift electrical goods, show you a demo model, but then the one you get is new and sealed in a box.

If you were buying an LCD panel in a shop you wont always be able to inspect the actual screen your buying. Just the demo model, the store wont unbox them all, so you can check for dead pixels.

Yet with DSR you can order a screen, spot a dead pixel, and return it. Like wise you could buy a CPU decide it doesnt overclock far enough and return it. You couldnt do that with a real shop.

The spirit of the law was to allow people who ordered online a chance to change their minds. EG buy a red shirt, but decide its a bit pink, and send it back. Or perhaps the shirt didnt even fit right in the first place. But the way the law is written, it goes way beyond that.

In the short term, people can gain by returning items under DSR, but if too many people use if for their own gain, all it does is eats into the retailers margins, and forces prices up for everyone else.

I would imagine that most returned items end up as "B" grade stock, I've never recieved an obviously opened item before, but if I did, I would certainly reject it if I was buying "New".

 

[straxusii]

I bought a pair of headphones from a competitor before, I simply opened the box and realised before even taking them out that they were not going to be comfortable. So I rang up the company to return this item under the DSR and that I would like to pay the difference for something else, I got told I couldn't do that, and that it had to be faulty for me to return it. Obviously I got on my high horse and told them they were breaking DSR but they were having none of it and just ignored me.

I guess that's the problem with buying stuff over the internet sometimes.

You should have just charged back the credit card in that scenario.

 

[cavemanoc]

Yep - that company has broken the law. If you have the correspondance in durable form you could probably still take them to task.

 

[peetee]

I understand the piont "The DSR is there your entitled to so why not" but if you purchased something from a shop your not entitled to use it and return it after 7 days because you don't want it

im fairly confident that if you bothered to look in the b-grade section you would find the prices are not SO different from the prices of NEW things, its moronic to think OcUK dont make a profit on the majority of b-grade stuff.

 

[dbmzk1]

I've never had to use the DSRs but I might when I get a HDTV later this year if it has any dodgy pixels. Do they refund the cost of posting it back to them as well? I'm guessing not! Could get rather expensive!

 

[straxusii]

DSR was made for dead pixels

 

[cavemanoc]

I've never had to use the DSRs but I might when I get a HDTV later this year if it has any dodgy pixels. Do they refund the cost of posting it back to them as well? I'm guessing not! Could get rather expensive!

They have to pay postage unless it specifically says otherwise in your contract - the DSR only requires you to 'make available' the item - ie they can come and pick it up, subject to the point above.

 

[Greebo]

Most likely sell it as B-grade http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=BG-047-IN&groupid=595&catid=686&subcat=

ohhhhhhh 10p off......must resist buying....too much of a bargain

 

[cavemanoc]

That made me laugh:

Originally sold at £149.99+VAT

Now: £150.97+VAT

Wow - bargain - paying extra for the priviledge of having had someone else paw over it

When did B Grade and Clearance disappear - can't find them anymore ???

EDIT: Found it - now hidden in Sale Items: Dear God:

SALE OFFER
was £149.99 ex vat
£9999.99
£11,749.99 inc VAT

I know it's overclocked - but that's a bit much for an 8800 GTS isn't it - even if the 9xxx series is pants

 

[gash2024]

Iam so glad this exists, ive just bought an acer 24 monitor and ive seen a few reviews that dont rate it all that well so if iam not happy iam gonna send it back and go for a different model.
I dont see the problem with it because iam sure most buyers would still buy but just didnt like that perticular item.