Child Benefit Cap

[Deleted member 66701]

So, essentially, me and my wife are not planning on having children, ever. It's our choice as is the choice to have kids.

Should we not have a tax discount because we are not going to be clogging up doctors, removing money via child benefit, using 'free' educational services, etc.

It's an interesting argument and I don't see any discounts for just married couples it's all about families (i.e. child benefits, working families tax credit, etc).


M.

If anything, you should be paying more tax, as having children that later turn into productive members of society puts far more back into the economy than they ever take out. We also need children to maintain an adequate labour force. We're already having to turn to immigration to offset a labour shortage in some sectors.

Some people say it's selfish to have children. Another viewpoint is that's it's selfish not to

BUT council tax charges you more or less locally based on the house you live in, it doesnt even attempt to look at ability to pay

Yes it does - check out the sections on exemptions for single occupancy and discounts for students, disabled and second adult rebates (low income households).

 

[Pug]

Being affected by this i have to say it saddened me a bit to hear about it. It won't change my families quality of life, but i do feel its a kick in the teeth. In essence, my 12 months of CB has been reduced to 8-9 months in value, so as i say hardly life changing.

WHat irks me though is that the "successful" in a work/salary sense are always the ones that are hit (at least it feels like it). My salary is pushed up due to bonus payments, primarily paid at the end of the financial year. What that means is that my income for feb (well all months, but i get a lump sum in feb so its more obvious) is going to be halved.

I'll see a tax and NI deduction of over £8k that month, leaving me with half what i "earnt". And i can live with that, it stings, but i can live with it - it's a little disingenuous to be moaning about paying too much tax, when its a by-product of earning more money. It stings, but it's fine.

However psychologically the CB being hit is a bit like the last straw. We save, every week, Albert's (my 14 month old) CB and pay it into his bank account. We then top it up so he saves a minimum of £1k/year, and we'll keep it going so he has a min of £18k when he's 18. The government earns interest on this, and it will be used to fund his higher-education when it comes around, so they'll get most of it back. And so in my head, after all the tax i pay, and the fact i am not a burden on the NHS (private health) this one last "gift" has been stripped, and i think it is one too far.

On paper what i've stated above is nonsensical, and i'm moaning about approx £220/year, but it just feels so bitter.

/prepares to be flamed, or some other retort but it's my feelings on the matter tbh.

 

[Bear]

BUT council tax charges you more or less locally based on the house you live in, it doesnt even attempt to look at ability to pay

So you should be more opposed to council tax than a local income tax surely?

I'm opposed to both, I'm only going on about local income tax as you brought it up.

 

[Mercenary Keyboard Warrior]

Yes it does - check out the sections on exemptions for single occupancy and discounts for students, disabled and second adult rebates (low income households).

Thats nothing to do with ability to pay at all, its based on the assumption that most houses have two or more people in them so a discount for those that dont.

By your logic the second home discount would be because of ability to pay, when in fact its based on the fact its not heavily used and hence has less draw on local services.

 

[{SAS}TB]

Being affected by this i have to say it saddened me a bit to hear about it. It won't change my families quality of life, but i do feel its a kick in the teeth.

....................

the CB being hit is a bit like the last straw. We save, every week, Albert's (my 14 month old) CB and pay it into his bank account. We then top it up so he saves a minimum of £1k/year, and we'll keep it going so he has a min of £18k when he's 18. The government earns interest on this, and it will be used to fund his higher-education when it comes around, so they'll get most of it back. And so in my head, after all the tax i pay, and the fact i am not a burden on the NHS (private health) this one last "gift" has been stripped, and i think it is one too far.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

We save, every week, Albert's (my 14 month old) CB and pay it into his bank account. We then top it up so he saves a minimum of £1k/year

Why do you need to top it up? 1st child rate is £20.30 per week or £1055.60 per year.

Or will you now be on a sliding scale as you earn £50k+?

 

[Pug]

Well, i basically just send a standing order over as the CB will stop anyway when he's... 16 is it? So we overpay now whilst we can (we may not always be as fortunate in the next 17 years).

Now i think i'll still receive the CB, but will have to self-assess an extra £200-250 in tax/year with these changes...

 

[Kenai]

CB shouldn't be viewed as a 'gift' though. It's a social support mechanism and quite frankly, given how much of our total expenditure as a country is on social support, dishing it out to people who don't need is just completely insane as far as I see it.

 

[LordSplodge]

Being affected by this i have to say it saddened me a bit to hear about it. It won't change my families quality of life, but i do feel its a kick in the teeth.

Kick in the teeth? No, a kick in the teeth are those being judged "fit to work" by non-medicaly trained staff at ATOS. People so unwell that they comit suicide over the decision.

You basically admit you don't need Child Benefit.



WHat irks me though is that the "successful" in a work/salary sense are always the ones that are hit (at least it feels like it).

I'll see a tax and NI deduction of over £8k that month, leaving me with half what i "earnt". And i can live with that, it stings, but i can live with it - it's a little disingenuous to be moaning about paying too much tax, when its a by-product of earning more money. It stings, but it's fine.

You earn a lot, you pay a lot of tax on it. Your point here is what?

However psychologically the CB being hit is a bit like the last straw. We save, every week, Albert's (my 14 month old) CB and pay it into his bank account. We then top it up so he saves a minimum of £1k/year, and we'll keep it going so he has a min of £18k when he's 18. The government earns interest on this, and it will be used to fund his higher-education when it comes around, so they'll get most of it back.

The last straw? What else has been taken from you? Saving for your child's future is to be lauded, but it isn't the governments job to provide you the money to do this. What is the relevance of the government getting this back? (actually university fees go to the university but don't let that get in the way of your rant)

And so in my head, after all the tax i pay, and the fact i am not a burden on the NHS (private health) this one last "gift" has been stripped, and i think it is one too far.

Never planning on having an accident and needing NHS emergency care? Tax you pay isn't put aside to pay for just the services you use.

/prepares to be flamed, or some other retort but it's my feelings on the matter tbh.

You deserved to be flamed. However in your Ivory Tower you'll probably get on with the other here - privileged others - who think they are somehow more deserving than the poor and needy.

 

[hurfdurf]

He should be thanking his lucky stars the govt only takes 34000 of his hard earned pounds? Really promotes the idea of working your ass off in education and then in your employment to then have to thank your lucky stars for it?
Seriously?
Did I miss the sarcasm in your post or are you firing a troll cannon across the thread?

Does someone who earn £100k work harder than someone who earns £20k? Does a Dr who got into private school from age 4 because of his millionaire parents work harder than a Nurse raised in a foster care home?

Or were they more often than not, born into privilege via luck, not hard work?

Does earning 3 times the average wage not satisfy? Is the person paying £34000 going without luxury because of that?

 

[hurfdurf]

Some people are just better at life than others. Just because some people are abject failures in life why should the good, successful, better evolved, most likely better looking, rich people be taxed more than required?

Because they have more to lose.

 

[FunkyCowie]

Geeze, the wife and I should have kids...

She has been out of work for several months, I only earn 18K a year, we have a mortgage on our flat and manage to pay all our bills and have zero debt. We don't claim any benefits.

Yet I pay benefits for people who earn more than twice my pay just because they have kids? That's really screwd up!.


People seem to think only as far as 'the Government pays for all this stuff' but fail to think as far as who gives the government the money to do so.

 

[hurfdurf]

Geeze, the wife and I should have kids...

She has been out of work for several months, I only earn 18K a year, we have a mortgage on our flat and manage to pay all our bills and have zero debt. We don't claim any benefits.

Yet I pay benefits for people who earn more than twice my pay just because they have kids? That's really screwd up!.

I am fairly sure you wouldn't want to swap lives or life styles with someone on benefits. Also can you source your figures?

 

[Destination]

Does someone who earn £100k work harder than someone who earns £20k?

Quite possibly yes, it depends on the job, the responsibility might be higher, and thus the remuneration.
I don't understand your point, and I don't know or care who the woman in picture you posted is. Your point seems to be suggesting a retorical 'No' answer, which isn't correct.
It is possible delusion, or potential trolling, I doubt you believe everyone in the country on a high salary was born to it, most of those truely born to it, don't actually 'work' at all.

 

[Amp34]

Who's working harder? The guy on £100k a year who spent 5 years getting a good university education (undergrad then post grad), 10 years working in a high stress environment until he reaches the upper rungs of a company and still has lots of stress, or the guy sat at the checkout at your local Tescos for the the last 20 years...?

We are doing extremes here right?

 

[zooankski]

Have they sorted out the issue with 2 parents earning just less than £50k each getting the benefit but a single parent earning just over £50k doesn't?

Until that's sorted then I don't agree with the cap.

Agreed