Day courses for pipework?

BennyC

BennyC

BennyC

Soldato
Joined
25 Sep 2006
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Morning All,

We've a bathroom which is back to brick at the moment.

Quotes to chase the walls and first/second fix have been way above what we were expecting. Being fairly practical, capable of chasing and having done some plumbing basics before myself the only area of 'expertise' I lack is working with copper, bending and compression fittings.

I've looked online for day courses though these don't seem to exist and a 3-5 day course I think would be overkill to simply move some hot/cold feeds for bath taps and a shower valve and to switch out a radiator.

Can anyone recommend any? Or should I simply turn to YouTube, get plenty of practice in and use elbows?

Thanks.
 
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If its going in a wall I'd pay someone - and I am semi-competent. Compression fittings etc are a piece of cake though, just buy a pack and have a practice. Key is to not deform the shape of the pipe. Get a decent pipe cutter so that doesn't happen.

Soldering is pretty idiot proof too but the risk is obviously great if you **** it up.
 
I've often thought about this kind of thing myself but having spoken to a tutor during a visit to the older kid's college, the certifying bodies actually want to avoid these kinds of things. The main reason being is that people do a short course then magically think they're qualified to start ripping gas pipes/appliances apart or re-wiring their houses in the case of electrics without then getting things certified to current standards or cutting corners to save a couple of quid - net result - flooded/burnt down/blown up house.

I think you can learn as much through Youtube and some practice work on a load of pipework fittings in advance of doing the job you actually need to do. I haven't done a course but fairly proficient at a DIY level when it comes to plumbing and basic electrics, but I know when to stop both from a technical and time perspective. Sometimes the amount of time I spend faffing about outweighs the cost of getting a professional in and getting them to do the job in an hour that would probably take me an entire day. I'd also recommend if you're not 100% convinced on compression fittings or soldering, to have a look at Hep2o fittings - they're very good and vastly superior to Speedfit in my opinion - they're just much clunkier than soldered fittings size wise.

Also have to agree with @dLockers - anything you're burying in a wall I'd get a pro to do - last thing you want is the pipework leaking and then the plaster coming off as a result. At least if a pro does this for you, if it were to happen, they have to come and rectify the problem and fix the damage. Or as I found recently, a leaky pipe in the upstairs can start raining through the ceiling and at the very worse, the ceiling comes down! Thankfully I managed to fix mine myself but water can do a lot of damage.
 
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I agree with the Hep2o they are pretty good bits of kit if available in what you need. Absolute ******* to get off even with the tool though I found.
Same thing as ever install it properly and I think your fine.

I'm not fully in agreement in regards pros though. They are just as, or more likely in my case, to botch something. Where as I am willing to take my time and get it right many Pros will not if its starting to exceed the allocated time.
IF you can find a good trustworthy pro then they are worth paying for, but so many now simply are not.
Our house the plumber had switched the hot and cold pipes under the bath, so had cut them off, added an extension and then connected them back up.
But rather than properly cut off the pipe he had cut it and an angle, awkward space I guess and then added the insert where one of the two rubber seals was 50% outside the main pipe, at some point this failed and we ended up with a leak and then fitting popping off!
It happened on a day we had low water pressure oddly so my guess is that when they fixed whatever they were doing (about a mile away) there was some sort of pressure surge and it was enough to pop it off.
 
@BennyC I echo the advice above about in wall work. But I have run my own pipes for kitchens a number of times.

www.thegoodlifecentre.co.uk

DIY Workshops London

Our DIY courses start at beginner level and are directed at home owners and tenants and teach practical DIY skills.
www.thegoodlifecentre.co.uk www.thegoodlifecentre.co.uk

If you are in or near London the Good Life Centre does all sorts of courses including plumbing. I can't speak for the quality of the DIY ones but my wife did the cold soap making course and said it was excellent.
 
I'd just watch a few YouTube videos, buy a length of pipe and some packs of fittings and practice. Soldering really isn't that difficult and tbh is borderline 'hard to get wrong ' if you take your time, keep everything clean, ensure nothing is rubbing etc.
 
Tom_ed1987 said:
I'd just watch a few YouTube videos, buy a length of pipe and some packs of fittings and practice. Soldering really isn't that difficult and tbh is borderline 'hard to get wrong ' if you take your time, keep everything clean, ensure nothing is rubbing etc.
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And wrap it if sinking it into the wall, as mortar will eat it.
 
Check out your local colleges that offer btecs and the like. They will do full time courses for all sort sof trades and at night time my local one does a DIY course for plumbing and joinery. 2-3 hours once a week for 12 weeks. Cost about £180.
The pipe bending was probably the most enjoyable part of it!
 
To be honest I paid a plumber for anything in the walls as I was having a whole house done. For second fixes behind units in a kitchen /bathroom I think hep2o seems pretty robust. I've used hep20 and compression. Fits.

Compression Id use YouTube /"Plumber parts" YouTube and get fernox liquid jointing compound for the fittings. Generally I'd go with hep2o over compression fittings to be honest. Easier, quicker, less chance of leaks. Yes the cost of the joints is a bit more but it's negligible for a single room.

Soldering I've never done (purely cos I think a blowtorch is a bit expensive with a pipe bender?) but again I think YouTube + spending some time looking at it would be fine and test it/cap it before boarding over/tiling it.


How much was your quote @BennyC ?
 
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Thanks for all the advice so far.

Buffman said:
How much was your quote @BennyC ?
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I've no issue using push-fit or other similar variants though think the thickness of some of these fittings mean the chases will need to be on the deeper side.

First quote was £1,700 + materials and considering it included moving the waste stack a few inches to the side and a second fix, wasn't horrendous but still more than my O/H's expectation/budget. Today's quote was almost double that at £3,200.

I think most here are right in that what I need can be learnt online or with a little practice, proper prep and patience.

Just for perspective, the outline of works. The room is, or will be, empty.

I appreciate that tradesmen are charging for time, travel costs, business costs and of course turning a profit. My costs below for the tooling are rather for perspective on tooling/material outlays.

I have an SDS drill/chisels for chasing, angle grinder, recip saw but not a holesaw/auger (£50). I estimated pipe and fittings for the soil stack to be around (£100)

Toilet- minor position movement.
- Move toilet 2-3inches back and left, remove cast iron soil pipe, replace with plastic.
- Move cold feed out of sight up and under from the floor most likely.
(The room is very narrow and this small margin of space is necessary. Plus the existing waste pipe is very unsightly and protrudes from the wall significantly.)

Basin - position unchanged.
- Chase hot/cold feed for basin in to wall.
- Chase waste for bottle trap in to wall / possibly straight through and in to soil pipe, or in to existing waste.

Radiator - position unchanged.
- Chase feeds in to wall, narrowing slightly. (existing radiator was wall mount but floor fed)
- Boards will come up so joists may need chopping a bit dependant on position but should not be particularly tricky other than working in the floor.

Bath/Taps - position unchanged
- Taps moving to mid-way rather than at the foot, and wall mounted with concealed valves.

Shower above bath - position unchanged
- Prev. was electric so chase for concealed valves and chase for shower head. (Access to the rear via bedroom with boiler in cupboard).
 
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Picture of bathroom? Do you really need to chase basin pipes as a lot of vanities expect it to come out of the floor (but close to wall).

I'd be going waste pipe myself.

Bath/Taps you've got for the most expensive possible option - most installations I have seen "box in" the pipework.

Shower you can do yourself - I had a similar situation. Just plastic and then do the tails in copper for the shower fitting.
 
dLockers said:
Picture of bathroom? Do you really need to chase basin pipes as a lot of vanities expect it to come out of the floor (but close to wall).

I'd be going waste pipe myself.

Bath/Taps you've got for the most expensive possible option - most installations I have seen "box in" the pipework.

Shower you can do yourself - I had a similar situation. Just plastic and then do the tails in copper for the shower fitting.
Click to expand...

Ta, plastic in the walls makes sense. Less faff to cover prior to plastering. Copper tails too for the radiator with push-fit on to existing copper in the floor might be easier where space is limited.

I don't have any useful pics to hand but will throw some up at the weekend.

The vanity unit that's been chosen, to make life even more difficult, is a 'frame' rather than solid unit so H/C feeds really do need hiding.
 
Compression fittings use PTFE tape around the olive and you won’t have any bother.

The manufactures say you shouldn’t but I’ve never had any bother if I’ve put PTFE tape around it. Some will say it’s amateur hour but the proof is in the pudding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ssHYT6zUqo

Theres also a good one from skill builder which I can’t find where he actually says about the manufactures saying their fittings don’t require it and he’s debated it with them.
 
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Can also fit inspection hatches if not 100% sure if possible and out of the way.

I have 3 in the hallway that are covered by framed pictures that allow access to shower plumbing, stop cack (swear filter) and water metre.

plumbing4home.com

Inspection Access Panels

Shop wide range of durable inspection access panels. Access hatch make easy access to concealed areas. Find various door panels sizes, materials, and colours.
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Some general advice. Compression fittings should only be used where you can get at them to undo/tighten. If soldering, heat the pipe and fitting, then move the flame away and touch the area with the end of the solder coated with flux. If the solder does not run around the joint, the pipe/fitting is not hot enough, so heat some more and try again.
 
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