Developers: What education/qualifications do you have and has it helped you in your career?

[MrClark]

I have a Phd and yes, it helped greatly. From the logistics side more job opertunities,easier visa process, higher salary, broader spectrum of potential jobs. From a work side yes, the ability to manage my time and large projects without micromanagement, communicating technical details both orally and in writing (writing a patent is much like writing scientific journal paper), managing others, researching new methods to tackle novel problems, ability to think outside the box, rapidly browse and process existing scientific literature to find appropriate algorithms and methodologies.

I agree with this.

I have a degree in software engineering (graduated 10 years ago), and while not always true, the code I write tends to be of better quality than my peers who don't have a software/CS related degree largely due to the formal design techniques I was taught and the critical thinking process a degree helps to instil within you.

That said, a lot of it has to do with where and what you work on - I'm currently contracting at a large investment bank working of their middle-ware trading platforms. That's quite a different kettle of fish to say, someone maintaining a website so it can be quite environment specific.

 

[D.P.]

I'm also constantly referring to my lecture motors and course textbooks for recaps and isdirations for algorithms and data structures. It is impossible to remember the intricacies of complex algorithms so it is always useful to refer back to descriptions that you previously studied in detail.

Above all else it the approach to developing code. People without a degree can happily learn chunks of information, certain algorithms or methods for example. But they don't learn in a coherent fashion, they don't learn the details behind them, they don't learn the theory, they can't prove certain results like optimally or convergence which can be critical in making safe and live software models. Even if they grasp the basic of complexity and algorithm analysis they don't know how different pieces interact, or how particular data sets may skew those results or truly understand the significance of a nlogn solution vs n^2 for their expected data size.

Worse still they tend to treat solutions as black boxes which get glued together and worry about superficial details


One clear separator is also that hose without a degree or a weak degree seem to cae what language the software is developed in, feel unfortunate learning new languages with different paradigms, and seem to think the fact that they learned a particular language like C# is some kind of indicator of talent even although a 3 year old learn far. More complex natural languages. People with a solid degree are language agnostic, choosing the best tools for the job and before even touching the keyboard will be thinking, analyzing, studying and researching the problem on pen and paper. The solutions are then more dependable with predictable behavior and greater confidence in outcome.

 

[Gambisk]

I've a CS Bachelor's degree and while I would definitely say it got me my first job I think that any subsequent jobs have been on the merit of my experience since then.

My wife on the other hand studied fine arts and while she is qualified to the same extent as me (both got Firsts Class Hons) she has struggled to get a job due to her qualification. She has now started on a IT apprenticeship to learn software development. From what she is telling me it really sounds like the way to get into IT instead of 3-4 years of uni. She has a 6 week crash course to learn the fundamentals, and then works in a company 4 days a week and goes to tech the other day. She will be getting paid for her work and at the same time learns real world skills that she needs, the job is entry level but with lots of scope to advance after the 2 year apprenticeship.

I've also talked with placement students in our company and it seems that in Germany in particular they have a very similar model of apprenticeships. But instead of a small minority of people going into a professional apprenticeship it is the vast majority and it is in a whole range of industries not just IT.

 

[meandu229]

I got a masters in computer science which got me my job, But I learnt everything I do on the job not a lot I learnt from uni helps.
Im a C# Developer btw.

 

[heavy-rotation]

I have a bunch of not great GCSEs (B-D) and no qualifications after that.

I don't think a CS degree gives you anything that passion (and geekiness I guess) in combination with the internet wouldn't be able to provide these days. I'm well versed in OO and functional programming, data structures, algorithmic complexity and the like, I've written 3D engines from scratch, and worked on the design and implementation of a few programming languages.

The only think I can think of that I found hard to get into was the logic based notation used in PL theory papers (e.g. page 26 of this), although I later discovered that's sometimes because they make stuff up for a particular paper.

 

[AJK]

Just like a fictitious book, it has content but is still made up.

You really aren't using this right. The book itself is NOT fictitious, neither is the project. The content of the book might be fictitious, as might the premise for the project work, but neither the book nor the project can correctly be described as fictitious.

 

[shaggyd]

Spanner in the works time! - I have learnt a few software languages over the years from BBC Basic, Pascal, Fortran, Ada, Java and recently Visual Basic. The previous languages of Java and Visual Basic have been with the Open University in aid of gaining a Computing Science related degree.
The tutors and course content creators are experienced industry experts from various backgrounds who wish to pass on their skills and knowledge. From these courses you learn not just how to programme in those languages, but the structure of Object Oriented programming and its toolsets. You also learn how to plan and develop an application project with the aim of "getting it right" in the early stages. You also learn communication skills as you have to read/watch videos and transcripts of customer requirements and interperet them in your project design.
Most importantly, you learn to program using strict standards to ensure that your code meets certain compliancy guidelines - especially on my new course learning Web Technologies (TT284) - W3C, WAG2.0, etc. Which from my understanding is a minimum requirement if you wish to maintain Contract work with Civil Services and large Corporations (everything is ISO9002 quality these days).
I am not knocking self-taught programmers who have worked hard at building their portfolio and skills, but depending on your learning sources, you could risk learning in an 'un-grammatical' fashion or learn a bad habit in programming style. This is something which is frequently discussed on the OU forums, especially with software developers encouraged to gain qualifications by their employers.

BTW- I have never attended university and the highest qualification I have is HNC Electrical & Electronic Engineering. I have always avoided programming as I felt I could never grasp logic thought required - especially with Pascal & Ada. I always wanted to gain a degree and decided to re-educate myself from scratch 5 years ago. Since studying with Open University, I have grown to enjoy the challenges of learning new skills and this has reflected in my day job too. So if you do not go to University or college, you can still learn later in your life.

 

[Audigex]

I have a CS degree in a software house

Of those I work with (14 total), another 4 have CS degrees: the rest either got into it via other tech or just personal development and slowly worked their way up. It tends to be an age split, too - the 4 youngest in the company have a degree, the others (bar 1) sort of accidentally picked it up as part of other responsibilities and discovered an interest/talent, and only one of the "older" half have a degree.

I think experience matters more, although a degree probably helps you jump sideways slightly, as I've found it's assumed I have a broader knowledge than those who've picked it up as they go along (not always true, but I can see where the thought comes from)

At the end of the day, programming ability is normally requirement number 1, followed by expertise in the area.

I would say that those who kind of "fell" into the sector through other means won't struggle to find a new job, but that a degree makes it a lot easier to find the first ones. CS degrees are far more common now, so it's more expected that you'll have one - 20 years ago that wasn't the case.

The difference? 20 years ago small/medium sized companies didn't involve much tech, so often as a new "thing" came in, one person in the company would pick it up, leading to them slowly "becoming" a tech person over time as they became the go-to guy for that company. Nowadays the tech is already in place and people need, I think, to be more up to speed on a wider variety of stuff to start off with. It's still possible to work into the sector, but I don't think it will be as common in future as it has been in the past.

At the end of the day, you only know what you know: and a degree is just an easy way to show that
a) You've got some ability in the sector
b) You've got an interest in it
... if you can show that through experience and hobbies, I think most tech companies are agile enough to realise that's enough to prove it... you just might have to work harder to get it across in your CV/interview, because some of that knowledge will be assumed from those with a degree.

 

[suarve]

Once you've got 2 or 3 years commercial experience behind you, qualifications mean absolutely squat.

Sums up the entire thread.

 

[FerretBoy]

No degree here and been developing/analysing for 10 years or so. Just cross trained (i.e. sat there and taught myself instead of dying of boredom) from the business to C++ developer. Since learnt a number of other languages, currently mainly working in Java on the Jboss Fuse ESB.

Honestly I cannot imagine anything I could have learnt 15years ago that I don't know now.

 

[a66as]

Im self teaching myself and hoping to get a job as a dev someday. What did you guys have to show them in the interview, a portfolio of all the websites / different languages you used?

I know its of topic but just a little curious

 

[D.P.]

We never get candidates to show a portfolio for many reasons, not least we would have no idea if you actually wrote the code, how long it took you, what assistance you got, if you asked for feedback from othersetc. and more importantly, we simply wouldn't have the time to go through it all. It is also hard to make comparisons to other candidates because all the portfolios will be different, and the fact that most peoples work won't be able to be shared because of IP issues.

We have a standardized programming test all candidates must complete with 24hr befor getting to the interview stage. At the interview we ask lots of problem solving questions, seeing if the candidate is good at finding solutions in reasonable times, has insights into problem complexity, analysis of algorithms. We try not to focus on any language as we simply don't care and languages can be learned quickly, solid math and problem solving absolutes cannot be learned. If the candidate does know C++ we sometimes ask related questions. Then there are generic interview questions to check they aren't an axe murdere etc.


The problem we ask are designed to make event the smartest sweat, we are interested in analysing their thought process not their final solution. We so,etimes see people get angry and aggressive when they realize they can't solve the problem, others getting exceedingly existed about it and it annoys them, they go home and can't sleep a tight until they solved the problem (these are the people we hire)