I have just currently purchased sennheisers pc 360s I heard they are only 50 ohms I am about to get a x-fi titanium hd sound card would this be enough to get the full potential out of these cans or would u still need an amp. any input would be really grateful thanks
Do I need an amp?
- Thread starter brawl3r
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Soldato
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No you should be fine. Getting an amp will make some difference, but I doubt it will be worth it.
Thanks for the reply titanium, just what sort of improvement because I use my system mainly for gaming but I do watch movies and listen to music so I want the best to be honest out of them and it does not say the x-fi titanium hd has a headphone amp is it worth looking into another soundcard maybe just want the best in one solution but I have heard the titanium hd has the best features for gaming and thats what I'm mainly after sorry if I sound really stupid but new to this audio stuff cheers
Soldato
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I think the Titanium HD may have a dedicated headphone amp in it, much like the Asus Xonar Essence cards, but I can't confirm that.
A good external headphone amp will certainly give an improvement in sound (e.g. more volume, tighter/deeper bass, more forward and lush midrange and treble, etc), but how big a difference this is, depends on your headphones.
For example, when I went from a X-Fi Xtreme Music to an Essence ST, there was only a slight increase in quality when using my Audio Technica ATH-A900 (40 ohms), which was mainly more transparent/forward midrange and sparkly highs - volume on the X-Fi was already more than enough anyway. The Essence ST wasn't really worth it.
Using my Sennheiser HD650 (300 ohms) though, the difference was huge. Bass was tigher and more impactful, with midrange and treble much more forward and lush. The headphone clearly benefited from amping.
From what I've read, the PC360 can be driven fairly easily from portable source, so pretty much all the X-Fi cards should do well.
Regarding gaming features, I'm not sure how useful any of the X-Fi stuff is these days and their performance benefits are inconsequential. Most games are are slowly dropping support for these features and moving towards software only processing (e.g. BC2 and BF3). Most important features like virtual surround sound are available even on the cheapest cards these days. I don't use any of these features and prefer a clean, unprocessed signal to my headphones, even for games.
A good external headphone amp will certainly give an improvement in sound (e.g. more volume, tighter/deeper bass, more forward and lush midrange and treble, etc), but how big a difference this is, depends on your headphones.
For example, when I went from a X-Fi Xtreme Music to an Essence ST, there was only a slight increase in quality when using my Audio Technica ATH-A900 (40 ohms), which was mainly more transparent/forward midrange and sparkly highs - volume on the X-Fi was already more than enough anyway. The Essence ST wasn't really worth it.
Using my Sennheiser HD650 (300 ohms) though, the difference was huge. Bass was tigher and more impactful, with midrange and treble much more forward and lush. The headphone clearly benefited from amping.
From what I've read, the PC360 can be driven fairly easily from portable source, so pretty much all the X-Fi cards should do well.
Regarding gaming features, I'm not sure how useful any of the X-Fi stuff is these days and their performance benefits are inconsequential. Most games are are slowly dropping support for these features and moving towards software only processing (e.g. BC2 and BF3). Most important features like virtual surround sound are available even on the cheapest cards these days. I don't use any of these features and prefer a clean, unprocessed signal to my headphones, even for games.
The HD does not have a dedicated headphone amp, although it does have a dedicated headphone output.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/519358/x-fi-titanium-hd-headphone-amp
The difference will be that the headphone out is a line level output, and amplified only by the card's opamps. The line outs on the card are pretty high voltage, so you won't have a problem with volume, although it may struggle to supply enough current with low impedance headphones. The headphone out is rated up to 330 Ohms, so no worries with your phones being too hard to drive in that respect.
See here for some discussion of the merits of headphone amplifiers in general:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/506655/ok-why-do-i-need-a-headphone-amp-for-hd650
http://www.head-fi.org/t/519358/x-fi-titanium-hd-headphone-amp
The difference will be that the headphone out is a line level output, and amplified only by the card's opamps. The line outs on the card are pretty high voltage, so you won't have a problem with volume, although it may struggle to supply enough current with low impedance headphones. The headphone out is rated up to 330 Ohms, so no worries with your phones being too hard to drive in that respect.
See here for some discussion of the merits of headphone amplifiers in general:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/506655/ok-why-do-i-need-a-headphone-amp-for-hd650
Thanks for the input guys really helpful.
you say software only processing, so will i benefit from a sound card mate and if the titanuim hd doesnt have a amp is there any point.
thanks for the help.
sorry to sound stupid here, you say i wont have a problem with the volume, thats all good what would the symtoms be by stuggling to supply enough current, as i am starting to think i may not need this high end soundcard. thanks for the input Alf
you say software only processing, so will i benefit from a sound card mate and if the titanuim hd doesnt have a amp is there any point.
thanks for the help.
sorry to sound stupid here, you say i wont have a problem with the volume, thats all good what would the symtoms be by stuggling to supply enough current, as i am starting to think i may not need this high end soundcard. thanks for the input Alf
It's not a simple matter to work out whether a given source will be able to drive certain headphones well, unfortunately. Some headphones rely more on voltage, others on current (typically, I think, low impedance phones such as yours are more current driven, whereas high impedance phones rely more on a stable voltage). But it also depends on things like the output impedance of the source, and for a soundcard it's probably higher than you would want. This means that for higher impedance phones, you tend not to get a stable voltage across the whole frequency range due to impedance curves etc.
IIRC the main symptom of clipping due to insufficient current is going to be distortion in the low end - so basically, just try it out. If you hear a little distortion on heavy kick drums or explosions in games then probably your card is struggling to match the current draw of your cans (lower impedance phones draw more current). Basically, whether you need an amp or not depends on whether or not you are happy with the way your phones sound straight out of the card. If you are, enjoy the music and don't worry about it.
IIRC the main symptom of clipping due to insufficient current is going to be distortion in the low end - so basically, just try it out. If you hear a little distortion on heavy kick drums or explosions in games then probably your card is struggling to match the current draw of your cans (lower impedance phones draw more current). Basically, whether you need an amp or not depends on whether or not you are happy with the way your phones sound straight out of the card. If you are, enjoy the music and don't worry about it.
thanks mate, a lot to take in but i get your drift and understand somewhat better now. so the question i can ask you as i see you have the card is it worth the price?
And your honest opinion do you think i should get this card or something less demanding, Not really bothered as money is not a problem just dont want to spend the money when its not even needed cheers for the help Alf
And your honest opinion do you think i should get this card or something less demanding, Not really bothered as money is not a problem just dont want to spend the money when its not even needed cheers for the help Alf
thanks mate, a lot to take in but i get your drift and understand somewhat better now. so the question i can ask you as i see you have the card is it worth the price?
And your honest opinion do you think i should get this card or something less demanding, Not really bothered as money is not a problem just dont want to spend the money when its not even needed cheers for the help Alf
It really depends what you want it for. It is an extremely good sounding card, right up there with the best you can get from an internal card. I don't know much about your headphones, or whether they are any good for music listening. If they are intended mainly for gaming, then you could probably save some money and get a cheaper gaming card. If you also listen to music, and your phones are detailed, revealing etc. then you will probably hear the benefit of the HD.
Note that this card is stereo only when it comes to analogue outputs, so is aimed at those who want audiophile stereo output and who also do a bit of gaming. Whether it's worth it or not depends on whether you are prepared to spend the money.