Does a RPG require player skill?

Andy100 said:
I had to keep the pulls single as we couldn't take on two but I had to pull fast to avoid the respawn catching up with us. Now because we knew how to play our characters we managed it, someone with less knowledge of their class and group play style couldn't have pulled it off. That's where the skill comes into it.

I must admit I kinda resent the fact you are essentially saying as a long time mmo player I have no skill. The fact is I could outplay any non mmo player with an identical character in either pvp or pve. If all else is equal then my ability to win must be based on my skill in the game.
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You have even acknowledged it in your own post. It's not skill at all, it's knowledge. You can beat a new player because you know what spells to use, not because you have a "skill".
 
Yes, but is also denying the basics of it all.

I mean... Lets take 2 examples here.

I can play an RTS game and I can play it well.
There are people better at the game than I and there are people not as good as I.
Now, that to me says that we have different skill levels.

So, take Playing Snooker or Pool.

I can play pool very well there are people better and there are people worse than I.

That says that in Pool there are varying levels of skill... Just the same as in an RTS game.

to say that there is no skill in an RTS game is quite simply idiotic, it just requires a different type of skill, but its still a skill none the less. To call it knowledge over skill then you must also say that the snooker / pool players are not skilled either... Just more knowledgable, because I know how to play, but they just practise more and get more "knowledgable".

What I am thinking here is that you are no good at these types of game, and dont like it, so rather than accept defeat, you cannot take it and instead say that its not skill in a way to try to take away the achievement that the people who are skilled at these games so rightfully deserve.
 
FatRakoon said:
What I am thinking here is that you are no good at these types of game, and dont like it, so rather than accept defeat, you cannot take it and instead say that its not skill in a way to try to take away the achievement that the people who are skilled at these games so rightfully deserve.
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Well, coming from a guild that always led its servers in boss kills, and had a few top ten European boss kills, all I can really say is its debatable. One of the definitions of skill is ability that has been acquired by training. If endless nights of wiping is not training, what is?

I suppose it's all down to how you determine skill.

After all, if all WoW is is knowledge, why is it only a handful of guilds ever downed Kel'Thuzad?
 
Vixen said:
WoW at least isn't about skill, it's just about knowing which spells do what. I've come across a lot of players in my time who just don't have a clue what they're supposed to be doing and obviously have never played with their spells. I can think of one player in particular who only does what "the internet" tells him to and has never just tested out different ways of playing to find one that actually works.

I can play as anything, healer, tank or dps, and it's not because I'm "skilled", it's because I know what spells I need to cast and when.
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It's not enough if you JUST KNOW what u need to do, you need to do it faster and better than the other guy, not to mention hell lot of circumstances that counts in which takes huge knowledge.

Tactical skills, team work, leading, communication etc <--- its all skill, if you got some more than the other guy then you're better. Simple.

Some games just require less than the others, it all depends on exact title, you cant really just divide it into FPS or RPG.

Games take skill, in one way or another, less or more.
Some need very very low to play, some more, but usually if you're more skilled at some things than the other guy, you're better with it.
You can't say it takes no skill because then everyone will just play the same way and everything will be equal.
 
Some do more than others.

For anyone who has played Final Fantasy XI, when you get a crap tank or white mage or even just 1 crap class who doesn't know what they're doing, it effects the whole entire party and really annoys you.

p.s Red Mage for the win :D
 
70% gear 15% class setup 15% skill. Skill only comes into play when there is a matchup of gear and class setup. All the skill in the world will do you no good if that which is hitting you, hits twice as hard and only takes half the damage you can put out. It rolls six every roll and you roll 2.5.
 
You're obviously talking from a WOW perspective which is more like 99% gear :)

Bring back the old school Ultima Online pvp days.
 
platypus said:
Well, coming from a guild that always led its servers in boss kills, and had a few top ten European boss kills, all I can really say is its debatable. One of the definitions of skill is ability that has been acquired by training. If endless nights of wiping is not training, what is?

I suppose it's all down to how you determine skill.

After all, if all WoW is is knowledge, why is it only a handful of guilds ever downed Kel'Thuzad?
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I think you have got the wrong side of that one.

I believe that SKILL is heavily involved in RTS games, and that the use of the term Knowledge is somehow completely alien to SKILL

surely in such games they must come hand in hand ?
 
Obviously not many people actually know what skill is as I pointed out in my earlier post one of the defining characteristics of skill is knowledge.

Here's a different dictionary definition just so you don't think I'm making it up.

http://encarta.msn.com/dictionary_/skill.html

skill [ skil ] (plural skills)

noun

Definition:

1. ability to do something well: the ability to do something well, usually gained through training or experience


2. something requiring training to do well: something that requires training and experience to do well, e.g. an art or trade


Reactions != skill
 
Vixen said:
WoW at least isn't about skill, it's just about knowing which spells do what. I've come across a lot of players in my time who just don't have a clue what they're supposed to be doing and obviously have never played with their spells. I can think of one player in particular who only does what "the internet" tells him to and has never just tested out different ways of playing to find one that actually works.

I can play as anything, healer, tank or dps, and it's not because I'm "skilled", it's because I know what spells I need to cast and when.
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You are wrong. There is a lot of skill in WoW.

A couple of examples are when you are healing a raid, you sometimes have a split second to decide which player is in most danger and whether to use a fast or slow heal to save him.

Or when you are dealing damage in a DPS race encounter and have to balance your damage output with the threat you generate, as to not pull aggro.

Or when there are severl mobs on screen at once and the pull has gone a bit haywire, you have to make an insticntive decision about whether to CC one, which to kill first, or whether to fire up some AoE. As a warlock sometimes I have to juggle multiple enemies, maybe seducing one, fearing another, and nuking down a 3rd. It takes a lot of skill and coordination to keep it all under control (e.g. the 3rd boss in magisters terrace if you are responsible for CCing 2 of the adds AND dpsing).

Or when you are a warlock in heroic magisters terrace, and everyone but you has died when Kael is at 49% and you are in the air phase. It takes a great deal of dexterity to dodge the balls and drain life whilst taking constant damage. There are so many warlock I know that even if they studied the game for 100 years they would still not have the reactions or the quick thinking to survive this.

I could go on but you get the point.
 
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