Doom Vulkan with different CPUs

[Yrkoon]

i find it hard to believe that my 6600k i5 was bottle necking my mid range rx 480.

got an awesome boost with vulkan over ogl.

 

[shankly1985]

We need more tests, one benchmark and a chart for that matter isn't enough.

 

[D.P.]

The interesting thing here, is that graph taken in isolation makes the RX 480 look total trash for those on older hardware. But then if you goto the link, and look at the other graphs it is NOTHING like the graph shown for doom. The 480 is mostly behind the 1060 for sure, but certainly nothing like the graph posted at the top.

The purpose of this thread wasn't compare the 480 to 1060 across all games. With old CPUs you expect to see a smaller difference between GPUs of different performance.

The interesting part is looking Vulkan and/ DX12 perform in scenarios where you expect there to be a benefit.



When looking at the relative performance with an old slow CPU the average differences are smaller, the 1060 tend to be slightly faster, but there are no anomalous leaps like in Doom under Vulkan.

People recommending the RX480 due to the Doom Vulkan performance should be careful to acknowledged the CPU dependence. In contrast with an old PU it is hard to argue one or the other form a purely performance perspective. And People claiming Nvidia don't see a benefit form Vulkan/DX12 shoudl check their facts.

 

[D.P.]

i find it hard to believe that my 6600k i5 was bottle necking my mid range rx 480.

got an awesome boost with vulkan over ogl.

AMD's OpenGL driver are notoriously bad.

 

[Ian Evey]

DP you need to proof read your posts, guess you using mobile lol

Yep, A reviewer is sue a fats or will sue a fats Pcu, Well you wouldn't sue a slim Pcu would you

 

[Poneros]

I'll just leave this here; tl;dw AMD performance on slower CPUs isn't bad at all

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmQvGBMESa8

 

[D.P.]

We need more tests, one benchmark and a chart for that matter isn't enough.

You act surprised at something which should be absolutely expected form the entire purpose of Vulkan/DX12.

 

[Scougar]

The purpose of this thread wasn't compare the 480 to 1060 across all games. With old CPUs you expect to see a smaller difference between GPUs of different performance.

The interesting part is looking Vulkan and/ DX12 perform in scenarios where you expect there to be a benefit.



When looking at the relative performance with an old slow CPU the average differences are smaller, the 1060 tend to be slightly faster, but there are no anomalous leaps like in Doom under Vulkan.

People recommending the RX480 due to the Doom Vulkan performance should be careful to acknowledged the CPU dependence. In contrast with an old PU it is hard to argue one or the other form a purely performance perspective. And People claiming Nvidia don't see a benefit form Vulkan/DX12 shoudl check their facts.

I was talking specifically about the original chart you posted.

(to be utterly clear, I am NOT trying to 'catch you out' or anything like that, I just want to know what the hell is going on with those results).

As an aside, I sure as hell wouldn't but the 480 for one game.

 

[D.P.]

So please explain to me why the 6700k would be the most CPU limited in that original chart? Surely the 480 would be LEAST limited by that CPU compared to the others? But then it makes a massive jump in performance. Your explanation is the exact opposite of what we are seeing in that chart.

The RX480 may well have other bottlenecks in the GPU front-end that are resolved with Vulkan on a faster CPU, or AMD's VUlkan driver have issues on slower CPUs. There are a lot of variables at pay and changing the CPU can have additional effects.

Non of that is particularly relevant to the main point of discussion though.

 

[D.P.]

I was talking specifically about the original chart you posted.

(to be utterly clear, I am NOT trying to 'catch you out' or anything like that, I just want to know what the hell is going on with those results).

As an aside, I sure as hell wouldn't but the 480 for one game.

TBH, I really don't know exaclty what happens witht he RX480, looks like there are compounding factors there.

My main discussion point was how Vulkan and Dx12 help Pascal GPUs in the scenarios where they are supposed to help the most.

I do find it interesting that the RX480 gains so much with a fast CPU but the whole architecture is a bit of a mystery. It massively under-performs and uses far too much power. AMD supposedly made lots of improvements to the command processor but it is hard to see that in benchmarks. The RX480 really performs the exact opposite of what i would have expected. I would have hoped Poalris would show a much smaller difference between dX111 and DX12/Vulkan, not a bigger difference. There may be some large DX11 driver gains to come.

 

[shankly1985]

Yep, A reviewer is sue a fats or will sue a fats Pcu, Well you wouldn't sue a slim Pcu would you

 

[Gerard]

DP you need to proof read your posts, guess you using mobile lol

99% of his posts are like that

 

[siriq111]

All CPUs bottleneck any mid- to high-end graphics card made in the past 5 years in most recent games. I saw a doubling in minimum framerates with an HD7950 pretty much across the board going from a Q9550 at 3.6GHz to an i5 6600K at 4.5GHz. The scaling carries on beyond 4.7GHz in my case, but I'm happy to stick at 4.5.

The results at the link below using a GTX980 Ti Strix show the same effect proving that it's not an AMD specific issue and make interesting reading...

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=pl&tl=en&u=http://pclab.pl/art66945.html

(See pages 15 to 19 in particular)

Vulkan or not, it's all about the IOPS.

Even [email protected] makes bottleneck on GTX 580. I had a lot with PII [email protected]

 

[LoadsaMoney]

I am seriously being swayed toward the 1060, especially given that performance of current games is 90% in the 1060's favour, and the price appears to be roughly the same for AIB cards of 1060 or 480. The 480 would have to be at least 30 cheaper on average to warrant it. And I completely agree, the 4GB seems like the only real option for a budget gamer right now, with the problem that some companies are putting on slower memory which is just sodding lame.

I am trying to not get too caught up in the DX11 results though with the benchmarks, because we all know that AMD suffers there... but the anno result is just really really bizarre on the 6700k.

Got to remember, the 480 may not be so good now, but it will be in the future

 

[Yrkoon]

AMD's OpenGL driver are notoriously bad.

on vulkan my cpu is only getting 50% usage and about the same on open gl on doom.... open gl was up to about 10 % more usage, i just ran both.

 

[flinco]

I tried Vulkan on my i5 750 and 970. It stuttered like crazy and was horrible to play.

 

[shankly1985]

I tried Vulkan on my i5 750 and 970. It stuttered like crazy and was horrible to play.

This my point why I said above we need more testing. Looking at a chart doesn't show issue like what you saying.

Charts are old school we all need to move on.

 

[tommybhoy]

If I understand correctly, you're saying that NV's currently optimising a lot better than AMD is, but AMD is equalling that optimisation in DX12 only, and this is why the 480 beats the 1060 in Vulkan/DX12 applications?

Yes, sums it up.

OcUK forums been in meltdown because AMD is faster like for like in about 3 or 4 titles and slower in every other game ever made on PC.

Got to remember, the 480 may not be so good now, but it will be>1060 in the future

Fixed

 

[Kaapstad]

Yes there is.

If the faster of the two GPUs is not getting CPU bottlenecked then there is no way the slower of the two will.

There is a problem there but it is not the hardware.

 

[Doom112]

We need more tests, one benchmark and a chart for that matter isn't enough.

AMD has a bottleneck with Vulkan.
One user posted some benchmark here.
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2479898&page=9

3rd party reviews made a pretty big mistake that they are doing benchmark on mid tier card with a high end CPU. Most of the people who will buy 480s will be on 5 to 7 years old i7. There is no person who will be buying a $350 CPU for a $2xx GPU and this is the reason experience>>>>>>>benchmark.

The purpose of DX12 and Vulkan was to reduce CPU bottleneck ,which clearly is not happening on AMP GPUs.