Downlight problems

psd99

psd99

psd99

Soldato
Joined
7 Sep 2008
Posts
5,846
Hi guys,

I got a problem with the bathroom downlights.

Two problems:

- The lights are of poor quality the springs are broken and if I take them down they won't go back up into the slot.

- The lights are too small for the hole, so the area around them has filler in them
it looks horrendous and unclean.

I'm thinking of changing all 4 downlights and replacing them with new ones.

Last week I took one down to have a look at everything. It just would not go back up, I might have to jam something in there etc.

I measured the hole it was like 80mm, so it looks like whoever installed them probably used a 80mm saw on all 4 holes, I have a lot of downlights downstairs that are adjustable and have a 80mm hole.

Anyway, looking online I've found lights that I like for bathrooms IP65 but they are rated at 76mm. that's some 4mm out. I'm certain the new lights won't stay up there either but I might be wrong.


it won't look very flush having this gap, I know caulk does wonders but the finish tends to be poor.

what can I do to potentially bridge the 4mm gap? or what other solutions do I have here? thanks.
 
4mm Should be fine. It sounds a lot but its actually on 2mm only opposite sides when centred

I cut 82mm holes for 80mm lights and its tight.. They dont seem to take into account the spring mechanism for the hole diameter.
Have a look at the lights and measure the lip
 
mattyg said:
4mm Should be fine.

I cut 82mm holes for 80mm lights and its tight.. They dont seem to take into account the spring mechanism for the hole diameter.
Have a look at the lights and measure the lip
Click to expand...

phew that's good then

2-4mm is like a very small margin, I'm hoping we are right :)
 
I'll check for you if you want I have some spare Icage 76mm lights

Hang on


Edit:

Balls..I have the lights but my bricky borrowed my hole saw last week and hasn't returned it yet....
 
mattyg said:
4mm Should be fine. It sounds a lot but its actually on 2mm only opposite sides when centred

I cut 82mm holes for 80mm lights and its tight.. They dont seem to take into account the spring mechanism for the hole diameter.
Have a look at the lights and measure the lip
Click to expand...

This, last lot of downlights I did I had to notch for the springs even though I had cut the holes the required size.
 
so we're thinking although they say 76mm cut outside
prob 78mm-80mm will still be okay? i.e the lights will fit snug but I will need to caulk around the edges?
 
Not sure why manufacturers give such a skin tight hole diameter, maybe to maintain the fire barrier etc but it just ends up destroying the ceiling, if your lucky it will go in first time but any future repairs / maintenance where it has to come out will damage the ceiling

Cutting a hole a few mm too big or using smaller downlight in existing hole will be ok as the bezel will cover the extra few mm
 
yep they are a nightmare to get into place

guess it's time to look for the right downlight and match the existing ones downstairs.
 
The light isn't held in by the diameter vs hole size, the springs hold it in - so a few mm wont make a difference and you shouldn't have to caulk or anything as long as size isn't off by too much, bezels on downlights can be 10mm per side overhang etc so will hide the gap unless they are massively smaller
 
ps

Least maintenance option will be GU10 fitting with led bulbs - if you use integrated LEDs they will need to come out at some point when they fail, whereas Gu10 with led bulb shouldn't ever need to come out just pop new bulb in etc
 
thanks guys

next question is this

if my current hole in the ceiling is 80mm and I want get lights that are 88mm
is that quite a difficult task to use a hole saw on an existing hole to get the extra 8mm?

(i think wil
 
can be tricky to make the hole bigger, can use a padsaw which gives a rough finish or batten across hole to hold the drill bit from the holesaw or put smaller holesaw inside the bigger one to centre it on the old hole - they make special arbours for this
 
thanks for the tips guys

I got all 4 lights changed on the weekend guess what they fitted into the slot! I decided to go for something that didnt require me to make the holes bigger in the end!
I was very happy the lights are much better quality

the only problem now is filling the unsightly gaps around 3 of the lights in the ceiling

I was thinking bringing the lights down and using gypro filler for the gaps it looks tricky though.

what else can I do instead?
 
Filling to make the holes slightly smaller isn't hard, but its time consuming.

I have had to do the same, my house 10 years old had a lot of recessed spots, and as most were MR16 they were mullered as the heat degrades the plasterboard. The people trying to get the bulbs out would end up spinning the light causing damage.

So what i did was, and this takes a little time but is undetectable. Get some fine surface filler.
Break out any loose material if the plasterboard is degraded. Now get a teaspoon, slowly build up the surface a few mm at a time around the inside of the hole. Try to leave the (outside ceiling) surface slightly short so you can skim over that at the end.
Do this a few times, probably 2-10 depending on how you build it up. Mine were badly misshapen so more like ovals so some areas had a lot, some hardly any. Keep testing by pushing the lamp close to the hole, will it nicely cover or not, once it will, tidy up the hole and then just skim the surface to get it perfectly smooth. Very light sand and then paint.

Use fine surface filler (such as the screwfix) because its generally harder than the normal fillers now.

Only other option I considered is to basically reboard them. Cut out a larger area, use the traditional approach to insert some new board, they recut with a holesaw.

The first approach took me from 3-10 days or so per light, all varied depending on damage. They don't have to be perfect, just filled in enough to close any gaps, and the teaspoon makes it easy to get the filler from the pot, but also its small enough to run round the inside of the hole nicely. Of course use a normal filling knife to do the final skim that you will see.
 
Mercenary Keyboard Warrior said:
Filling to make the holes slightly smaller isn't hard, but its time consuming.

I have had to do the same, my house 10 years old had a lot of recessed spots, and as most were MR16 they were mullered as the heat degrades the plasterboard. The people trying to get the bulbs out would end up spinning the light causing damage.

So what i did was, and this takes a little time but is undetectable. Get some fine surface filler.
Break out any loose material if the plasterboard is degraded. Now get a teaspoon, slowly build up the surface a few mm at a time around the inside of the hole. Try to leave the (outside ceiling) surface slightly short so you can skim over that at the end.
Do this a few times, probably 2-10 depending on how you build it up. Mine were badly misshapen so more like ovals so some areas had a lot, some hardly any. Keep testing by pushing the lamp close to the hole, will it nicely cover or not, once it will, tidy up the hole and then just skim the surface to get it perfectly smooth. Very light sand and then paint.

Use fine surface filler (such as the screwfix) because its generally harder than the normal fillers now.

Only other option I considered is to basically reboard them. Cut out a larger area, use the traditional approach to insert some new board, they recut with a holesaw.

The first approach took me from 3-10 days or so per light, all varied depending on damage. They don't have to be perfect, just filled in enough to close any gaps, and the teaspoon makes it easy to get the filler from the pot, but also its small enough to run round the inside of the hole nicely. Of course use a normal filling knife to do the final skim that you will see.
Click to expand...


thanks, never thought about the tea spoon idea. sounds good.
 
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