Electrical help please!

MrCake

MrCake

MrCake

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Joined
22 Sep 2003
Posts
704
Location
South Coast UK
Im currently decorating our porch and need to replace a broken light bayonet and we have bought a new round ceiling light. I have just checked that the current setup is earthed so we can use the new light and am baffled by the current wiring.

From these pictures it seems that there are 2 feeds going in and what looks to me that where the earth should go, its got a live feed?? Electrics aren't my strong point so hopefully someone on here can give me some idea.

Im assuming that the wire that is green is the earth but if it is fed from two different supplys then surely I am missing an earth from the other one?







 
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Lighting will be on a spur and after squinting at your pictures I would suggest you have a cable from either the previous light or the consumer unit going in plus the cable going to the next light. As to why its wired to the earth is an unknown and in the second picture where does the earth go ?
 
EDIT 2: Scrub what I said, read what SB11B wrote.... I only looked at thw first picture and couldn';t see itr properly.. :o... updated below

Take reds out of earth parking terminal and bit of connector block in the fitting. One black is your switched live and should be sleeved red, but on a baynout fitting its no big thing if you get them transposed, ES would be another matter

Plain green sleeving indicates wiring of a bit of a vintage...it was discontinued in favor of green with yellow stripe at the end of 1977, so if you havent already done it, then before you decorate a perioidic inspection would be advised

Edit: In answer to your question, the fitting probably has a parking terminal for the earth, thats not used, its a plastic fitting not requiring an earth, its your choice on the new one if you put the earths in the parking terminal or put a bit of connector block on them, but they must remain connected together
 
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Somebody has cut corners fitting the light.

One black wire is the neutral, the other is the switched live from the switch. There SHOULD be a red band on one of them to denote the switched live...

One of the red wires on the earth terminal is the incoming live, the other is the feed to the switch (the switched live that returns as a black wire to the bulb base)

The actual earth appears to be inside the piece of green earth sleeving.

edit and i type too slowly.
 
As the previous poster states :) there doesn't appear to be a switch cable so it's switched from elsewhere and is spurred from another light. If the earth isnt connected to anything it would appear that they have just attached the live feed to the earth then the fitting itself will pick up the live from the earth which in itself isn't really a problem albeit a tad confusing and probably doesn't conform to part P standards. Its old cabling anyway and probably needs renewing and as suggested by Adam perhaps get it inspected personall I would replace and bring it all upto date.
 
mollymoo said:
As the previous poster states :) there doesn't appear to be a switch cable so it's switched from elsewhere and is spurred from another light. If the earth isnt connected to anything it would appear that they have just attached the live feed to the earth then the fitting itself will pick up the live from the earth which in itself isn't really a problem albeit a tad confusing and probably doesn't conform to part P standards. Its old cabling anyway and probably needs renewing and as suggested by Adam perhaps get it inspected personall I would replace and bring it all upto date.
Click to expand...

Umm, that's not what i said. There is a switch cable, it's one of the black wires.
 
Looks like the blacks are being switched by the light sw.
The reds have been put in there just to join them as they are not part of the switched circuit.
 
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Thanks for the replies, unfortunately I'm not sure if I still understand? There is not a light outside so still dont really get why its like that?

The replacement light is part metal so I will definitely need to use the earth.

If I put the 2 red cables into the live connector on the new light and twist the 2 blacks into the neutral will that work, or am I reading that one of the black wires is actually the live?

Apologies for my ignorance!
 
MrCake said:
Thanks for the replies, unfortunately I'm not sure if I still understand? There is not a light outside so still dont really get why its like that?
Click to expand...

It's the last light on the loop, there is no "next" light to send power to, hence no third bundle of cable.

MrCake said:
If I put the 2 red cables into the live connector on the new light and twist the 2 blacks into the neutral will that work,...
Click to expand...

Don't do this!!

MrCake said:
... or am I reading that one of the black wires is actually the live?
Click to expand...

You've got it.



OK, do this.

Put the two red wires into one terminal on their own.

Put one black wire to one side of the bulb holder (might have a brown wire/marker or L on it), put the other black wire to the other bulb holder (might have a blue wire/marker or N on it).

Put the earth wires to the last terminal on the fitting.

This is based on the light having four terminals (some coming with a flying lead with a 4 way terminal block on the end.)

If you want more detail, take a snap of the new light fitting and i'll tell you what goes where.
 
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SB118 said:
Umm, that's not what i said. There is a switch cable, it's one of the black wires.
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You did then edited it. However if one of them was a switch cable then even back then if they didn't have a 2 core brown/red for switching it they should/would still have put red tape on it to show it was a switch cable by rights. Anyway now there are bigger pictures it's a bit easier to see what is going on. :)
 
mollymoo said:
You did then edited it. However if one of them was a switch cable then even back then if they didn't have a 2 core brown/red for switching it they should/would still have put red tape on it to show it was a switch cable by rights. Anyway now there are bigger pictures it's a bit easier to see what is going on. :)
Click to expand...

You must be reading the post above mine, all i added was that i type slowly.

Raptor said:
I presume the new fitting is marked
Com
L1
L2
?
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If he was fitting a new switch it might ;)
 
Thanks SB118 for your patience! Here is a picture of the new fitting which has a block built in.

So looking at this I leave the 2 red twisted together and maybe put in a seperate connector block for neatness\safety or do the red still need to connect to this new light fitting? Then one black on N and the other on L and finally fit the earth?




Do I get irony points for taking the picture of it on a DIY manual? :D
 
MrCake said:
So looking at this I leave the 2 red twisted together and maybe put in a seperate connector block for neatness\safety or do the red still need to connect to this new light fitting? Then one black on N and the other on L and finally fit the earth?
Click to expand...

Spot on, put the red cables into a separate connector block (maybe use some tape to ensure there's no chance of a short, metal body on the light fitting and all), then do as you say with the rest of the wires.

MrCake said:
Do I get irony points for taking the picture of it on a DIY manual? :D
Click to expand...

Yes, but you lose man points for actually owning one in the first place.
 
SB118 said:
Spot on, put the red cables into a separate connector block (maybe use some tape to ensure there's no chance of a short, metal body on the light fitting and all), then do as you say with the rest of the wires.



Yes, but you lose man points for actually owning one in the first place.
Click to expand...

Last question I promise - I take it if I get the L & N mixed up, the light wont work and I just reverse them as I cant see any clear mark on the current holder?
 
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