EV general discussion

Journey said:
It's the East vs. the West, simple matter of fact is they need to adapt and possibly take some short term losses if they want to survive (IMO) the onslaught of BEV's coming in to Europe. You know for a fact that people seem to care more about cost than they do about where the item they are buying is manufactured.
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Yeah I don't think the origin of manufacture has been a massive consideration for a while. What I do find surprising is the acceptance of non established brands. People seem to be getting excited about the new 'Ding Wong Motor EV-X 10' or whatever despite them never having heard of the brand or there being an established dealer support network.
 
lordrobs said:
Yeah I don't think the origin of manufacture has been a massive consideration for a while. What I do find surprising is the acceptance of non established brands. People seem to be getting excited about the new 'Ding Wong Motor EV-X 10' or whatever despite them never having heard of the brand or there being an established dealer support network.
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if the car is nice I will happily drive a ding Wong :D

hell Tata own jaguar, SIAC motor own MG (never heard of them) and lotus is owned by Geely

but I drive an ipace and would be more than happy to have an eletre or a Cyberster next to it ;)

(or any other cars from there)

Chinese cars are really good at the moment imo sadly most don't make it over here.
 
Wife is considering a a VW ID Buzz Cargo van for a work lease. Does anyone have any experience of these? Whilst its just a work van seems to have a bit more character than the other electric van options and some reasonable lease prices at the moment.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
If you know the supply is looped, the easy well to tell is if you have 1 or 2 cables going into your main head.

1 = your cable goes to a neighbour
2 = you have the main incoming cable and the loop out to your neighbour.

If 1 you get the new cable, of 2, they get the new cable.

If 1 get them to install 3 phase, it should be no cost to you as they are installing a new cable anyway.

Occasionally 3 houses are looped together and the ‘middle’ house will also have 2 cables but that’s not very common.

It is still possible still run an EV charger on a 60a fuse if it can adapt to the house load, it will need a CT clamp on the main supply for that function to work.
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Thanks mate, 2 into the main 60amp fuse I have. Does this mean it's 2 like you say being looped?

Looking at the quote back from Ovo for the install, it states from the DNO that they can go ahead with the installation before the work is completed by the DNO but with conditions. Presuming the advice is to limit charging to when my other appliances could be draining the supply to the fuse limit, I don't yet have a air source heat pump but I do have electric oven, microwave, induction hob and electric shower so maybe why. I'd only charge during the night anyway, and both chargers I've asked for a quote for have CT clamps.
 
Yes, it’s likely you have the main cable and a neighbour will get the new supply.

The condition will likely be the charger has to automatically ramps down as the house load ramps up otherwise you’ll have to wait for the work to be completed if it can’t do that function (many do these days).

Just the electric shower and oven will be approaching the 60A fuse on its own. Although for the fuse to actually blow you’d need a sustained load at well above 60A which is exactly what an EV charger provides and other appliances like ovens and showers don’t.
 
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bigmike20vt said:
if the car is nice I will happily drive a ding Wong :D

hell Tata own jaguar, SIAC motor own MG (never heard of them) and lotus is owned by Geely

but I drive an ipace and would be more than happy to have an eletre or a Cyberster next to it ;)

(or any other cars from there)

Chinese cars are really good at the moment imo sadly most don't make it over here.
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Yeah I'm not knocking the products, TBH I don't really know much about many of them. It's just surprising that after decades of brand building and customers buying into brands whether they be deemed sporty, good value, well built, prestigious, reliable etc. All of that seems to have gone out of the window relatively quickly with people basically buying into a photo and a spec sheet as long as the finance payments are palatable.
 
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Isnt it more of a case of the EV buyers profile right now, its either tech savvy people who want the car because its new tech. Or its company car (conventional or SS) buyers who's main concern is the lower tax and fuel costs.

Joe public buying new cars is only now considering EV as a viable option, and with the ridiculous list prices, they simply have to look at cheaper cars. I think brands like VW have had a PR nightmare in anycase, dieselgate hurt them big time. Joe public now has seen lesser brands such as Kia and Skoda come along and give excellent products, so maybe its a case of them thinking the likes of BYD and MG are the next ones to come in an do a 'Kia'.

Im still looking at the mainstream brands though, Ive had quite a few brand new cars over the years and many have had issues, and its been easier to resolve issues with the established brands, parts sourcing and sevice generally is better with the better brands in my experience.
 
lordrobs said:
Yeah I'm not knocking the products, TBH I don't really know much about many of them. It's just surprising that after decades of brand building and customers buying into brands whether they be deemed sporty, good value, well built, prestigious, reliable etc. All of that seems to have gone out of the window relatively quickly with people basically buying into a photo and a spec sheet as long as the finance payments are palatable.
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if it's a fleet lease or 3 year PCP people are prepare to gamble even w/o a standard dealership network - that, was the paradigm change, and, the marketting folks also upped their (family oriented) game .
Clientelle don't have the experience/scepticism from the initial Japanese marque invasion ... kinda like GenX think austerity was a patch on the 80's recession.
 
they can do what they want. China has made it's aims completely clear and are well on the way. Korean cars whilst not fully EV they also are well positioned.
for now legacy car makers still have the reputation of their cars being better because of the badge (despite often being made in China along side the "cheap tat cars" however that reputation won't last for ever.

it would not surprise me if at least one of the major brands goes under or is bought out in the next decade.
the legacy automakers have been really slow to change. take jaguar. they bought out a (at the time) as good as any EV in the world in 2018 .... (so good that it's still relevant today )

6 years later they still only sell that 1 EV and it hasn't really changed much. I just hope they stick to their pledge of being a full EV company in the next few years.
similar story to nissan, they were right there at the start of the EV revolution but now look quite behind imo.
IF legacy automakers are not ready they only have themselves to blame as they had plenty of warning.
 
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doesn’t matter what car manufacturers make. The market will drive the sales and so maybe going all in on EV might bite companies who have no hedge against not fully EV sales in EU by 2030
 
Kill_Phil said:
Well it doesn't help that mb EVs are generally trash. The legacy automakers are in danger of being left behind
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I think their earlier offerings were very average, I'd say the EQE saloon is nice, but well over priced compared to the E-class which makes it totally unappealing unless you really want a BEV, or are getting it via company car scheme. I was hoping they's bring something out like the CLA shooting brake, or a nice Coupe but nothing as yet. I swore I''d not get another Merc, but I think I'd still be tempted if they did release one of the aforementioned cars, in the meantime my money is going to the Koreans and possibly the Chinese.
 
visually (I know nothing about the quality of the cars) personally I don't think mercedes are in a good place at the moment. beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that but generally I don't like the look of their current EV offerings.
some of the BMWs look nice enough but I really don't like what is going on with the front grilles. (the cars from 5 years ago looked more appealing to my tastes).
some of the Chinese cars look fabulous tho , the cupra born also would be high on the list if i wanted a Golf equivalent (the ID3 looks ok but a bit bland)

of course looks are only 1 part of the puzzle.
 
The two EQCs I have been in have been epic places to sit but the weight and lack of range has been frightening compared to Teslas.
 
bigmike20vt said:
some of the BMWs look nice enough but I really don't like what is going on with the front grilles. (the cars from 5 years ago looked more appealing to my tastes).
some of the Chinese cars look fabulous tho ,
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That's kind of ironic when you consider the reasons the massive grille became a thing in the first place :p

With regards to 'legacy' automakers being slow off the mark, there is only so much money and effort you can throw at the thin edge of the car sales wedge when you need to concentrate on turning profits.

You can't compare them with the likes of Tesla, Rivian et al because they rode the massive wave of backer funding hemorrhaging money at an eye watering rate to get where they are now.

You also have to consider how China poured state money into the EV sector. The 'legacy' manufacturers simply haven't been playing by the same rule book.

Honestly, the way the EU and UK are at the moment with decision making, if I was calling the shots at a large motor manufacturer I'd be keeping the EV development ticking over but not going all in. 2030 isn't far away and there is a huge deficit to close with EV vs ICE sales.

PHEV has the potential to solve a load of potential infrastructure issues and for many could see their fossil fuel use drop massively. It also makes so much sense for Mr. 30 mile commute but 2 camping holidays to the Cotswolds a year.

My finger in the air prediction is that the PHEV will get a longer reprieve but we'll wait and see I guess.
 
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I have no idea why bmw chose to go with the massive grille in their new cars. I assumed it was some retro thing from the 1940s (which would presumably be for cooling back then?). but that is not needed now esp for EVs.
(I would love to know however if you know better)

I think your prediction may be correct about plug in hybrid cars .
the only snag there is there is a lot more to go wrong with a phev and also you have to make sure it is serviced regularly and gets run properly to keep it maintained.

also apparently (and I haven't checked this myself but it does seem logical) but I am told statistically hybrids are more likely to have car fires.
 
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bigmike20vt said:
I have no idea why bmw chose to go with the massive grille in their new cars. I assumed it was some retro thing from the 1940s (which would presumably be for cooling back then?). but that is not needed now esp for EVs.
(I would love to know however if you know better)

I think your prediction may be correct about plug in hybrid cars .
the only snag there is there is a lot more to go wrong with a phev and also you have to make sure it is serviced regularly and gets run properly to keep it maintained.

also apparently (and I haven't checked this myself but it does seem logical) but I am told statistically hybrids are more likely to have car fires.
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Yes that is correct. A lot more to go wrong.
 
bigmike20vt said:
I have no idea why bmw chose to go with the massive grille in their new cars. I assumed it was some retro thing from the 1940s (which would presumably be for cooling back then?). but that is not needed now esp for EVs.
(I would love to know however if you know better)

I think your prediction may be correct about plug in hybrid cars .
the only snag there is there is a lot more to go wrong with a phev and also you have to make sure it is serviced regularly and gets run properly to keep it maintained.

also apparently (and I haven't checked this myself but it does seem logical) but I am told statistically hybrids are more likely to have car fires.
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I thought appealing to the affluent Chinese market was part of the decision behind the mega grille.

They are more complex because you have additional mechanical elements but on the flip side you aren't buying an additional 150 miles worth of battery that you aren't using from one month to the next.

A modern combustion engine is pretty robust and low maintenance. When it is the primary source of power you can have 2 year service intervals, if they were more considered a generator in a series hybrid setup then maybe that could be extended further?

Massive EVs with 250+ mile ranges can't be the only solution. The problem is that any EV with a 100 ish mile real world range is slated for it. Leaves a perfect place for PHEV IMO.

As for hybrid fires, is that fighting FUD with FUD? :p
 
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