EV general discussion

The average price of an EV is higher than the average price of the ICE cars in the market. So that’s not a suprise to an extend. The saturation of Tesla and the limited access to parts is also part of the issue.

The uk average insurance price now exceeds £500 EVs are not wide spread enough to be the sole reason… regardless of Nashers “evidence”
 
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Octopus Go is doing me well, in spite of being on a granny charger. We are actually in the habit of plugging it in each night anyway as it secured the charger itself and avoids us having to pack it away lol.

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Nasher said:
EV insurance specifically is rocketing up, a lot of them are being damaged/crashed, far more than ICE cars. My insurance dropped this year on my diesel daily, from the same insurer even
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our nissan QQ went up £60 to £320 (2012 1.5 diesel worth under £5k)
the Jag ipace I replaced it with I can't remember the exact amount but it was only a little over £500.... this is fully comp with no voluntary excess and valued around £35k, on a car which is 400bhp equivalent with 0-60 in 4.5s and is group..,..... 50 I think

I will tell you what. I wouldn't insure me on that car for £500!!!!!!!!!

the timing was perfect. I sold the QQ with only 5 days remaining on the insurance. Admiral offered to insure me for free on the ipace for 5 days (well not for free but on the old QQ policy which had been. £260 for the year)
the. they insured me for let's say £525 on the ipace AND didn't charge me to put on my private plate 2 weeks later which a lot of companies do.

this was Admiral , I can't knock them (tho I do have to phone them every year and rangle with them a bit - which I actually thought they had meant to have stopped doing.
 
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NoobCannon said:
Have a Polstar 2 being delivered in about 2 hours (company car) quite looking forward to it! Will have that for a few months whilst i wait for ny Model Y to turn up.

Charger etc already been installed (again by work) Going away this weekend so diving in at deep end, first electric vehicle and long trip straight away.
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Replying to my own post here. Really enjoying the car, left on 90% 111miles of motorway plus some “acceleration testing” due to not having an EV before + climate control and arrived with 50% left

The 50% should mostly do us whilst were here for the weekend and then a charge on way home.
 
Just saw another newspaper article about someone going back to a diesel car after forking out for charging as they can't get a charger at their home, there are hardly any charger stations near to them, discovering the range in cold weather isn't the same as the quoted figures. If they had researched a bit first they would have found all this out.
 
tonys said:
Just saw another newspaper article about someone going back to a diesel car after forking out for charging as they can't get a charger at their home, there are hardly any charger stations near to them, discovering the range in cold weather isn't the same as the quoted figures. If they had researched a bit first they would have found all this out.
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it's only since really following EVs and renewable energy I have really learned exactly how insidious our news papers are. every single day without fail I get one , usually more scare story in my news feed about some failing or danger of EVs or a new tech which makes EVs unnessesary.
it's almost always the express, the sun, the mail or the mirror.
usually they are a real edge case or an obviously biased or ignorant opinion from a random person , but sometimes it's just an objective lie.

I had one today from the express about how you should not buy a 2nd hand EV because the batteries degrade really quickly. no mention of the 100k mile 8 year warranty most offer.
it transpired at the end they were talking about a Tesla with over 100k miles on the clock that could have been risking a £15k bill on the battery.

well put it this way. if I was buying a car with a sub 4s 0-60 and insane top speed performance car with over 100k on the clock...... and it was an ICE car. guess what? I may be concerned about big bills as well!

the objective lie however was one which really triggered me
a woman whos brand new EV was ruined due to flood damage to the car killing the battery.

1) why mention it was an EV anyway. flood damage would ruin any car.
2) it was a 5 year+ old DIESEL FGS.

the story then linked to other EV tales of woe.

an utter disgrace.

I am all for genuine critical debate and it's true that for those without off road parking EVs are a tough sell right now.
 
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tonys said:
Just saw another newspaper article about someone going back to a diesel car after forking out for charging as they can't get a charger at their home, there are hardly any charger stations near to them, discovering the range in cold weather isn't the same as the quoted figures. If they had researched a bit first they would have
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I do wonder if its financially viable from a business perspective currently, eg someone like a traveling salesman if they are unable to have a charger installed at home, slower chargers are out due to time constraints and fast charging at 65-75p kw are the only option.
 
bigmike20vt said:
if I was buying a car with a sub 4s 0-60 and insane top speed performance car with over 100k on the clock
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Whilst I actually agree with your overall point I'm going to take issue with this bit as I see it a lot.

Most people are not interested in buying that and are not setting out to buy that.

The end up with that as you can't buy, say a Tesla that does 0-60 in the same time as a Volkswagen Golf diesel but they are not short listing it against a C63 AMG or replacing a Porsche 911 with it. There are no V8 cars on their company car list. Therefore these comparisons are not relevant at all and the excessive performance of most every day electric cars shouldn't be used to try and compare them to what are very different cars.

I've no idea whether an electric car needs a £15k repair at 100k miles - I suspect it does not - but if it does the answer cannot be that it's fine because it costs loads to replace the brakes on a Porsche Cayman. The answer would be that this is a huge negative factor you wouldn't get with the sort of car the owner would previously have purchased.
 
[TW]Fox said:
Whilst I actually agree with your overall point I'm going to take issue with this bit as I see it a lot.

Most people are not interested in buying that and are not setting out to buy that.

The end up with that as you can't buy, say a Tesla that does 0-60 in the same time as a Volkswagen Golf diesel but they are not short listing it against a C63 AMG or replacing a Porsche 911 with it. There are no V8 cars on their company car list. Therefore these comparisons are not relevant at all and the excessive performance of most every day electric cars shouldn't be used to try and compare them to what are very different cars.

I've no idea whether an electric car needs a £15k repair at 100k miles - I suspect it does not - but if it does the answer cannot be that it's fine because it costs loads to replace the brakes on a Porsche Cayman. The answer would be that this is a huge negative factor you wouldn't get with the sort of car the owner would previously have purchased.
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i take your point however Tesla IS still somewhat of a premium / luxury brand.
probably comparable to a fairly high end BMW or Audi / Merc

if you want to compare to a middle of the road golf diesel then surely an MG4 or E-Niro or ID3 would be more comparable , in which case the headline drop in value would be far less because they didn't cost anywhere near as much as the Tesla in the 1st place
 
How much does an engine cost for an 8 year old diesel golf that’s done 100k and decided to lunch itself?

If you go to a main dealer and ask them to supply and fit a brand new engine, the bill is probably not dissimilar.

What happens a in reality is people either scrap the car or get a used engine from a crashed one and have an independent fit it. There is no reason you couldn’t do the same with an EV, if any thing fitting a new battery is a complete doddle compared to an engine replacement.

The issue is predominately that there isn’t enough used battery packs on the secondary market, particularly for Model S/X because people keep buying them and breaking them down to use in classic conversations.

If that wasn’t happening, the used battery pack cost could be considerably lower and a much better proposition than it is now.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
How much does an engine cost for an 8 year old diesel golf that’s done 100k and decided to lunch itself?

If you go to a main dealer and ask them to supply and fit a brand new engine, the bill is probably not dissimilar.

What happens a in reality is people either scrap the car or get a used engine from a crashed one and have an independent fit it. There is no reason you couldn’t do the same with an EV, if any thing fitting a new battery is a complete doddle compared to an engine replacement.

The issue is predominately that there isn’t enough used battery packs on the secondary market, particularly for Model S/X because people keep buying them and breaking them down to use in classic conversations.

If that wasn’t happening, the used battery pack cost could be considerably lower and a much better proposition than it is now.
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Exactly - people with 10+ year old BMW M3/5’s, Audi RS’s etc… with outside warranty faults, are not going to the dealer to fix them.

Same will happen for used EV’s - if you need to replace a battery or cells in a 10+ year old iPace then you’re not going to Jaguar to get it done.
 
bigmike20vt said:
I am all for genuine critical debate
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after reading through below July report on additional ev repair costs (eg ££ storage laws) and the relative cost point where a write-off would be declared because of battery damage
(due to scarcity of repair and diagnostic skills and batteries relative cost) that does seem like something which will impact residuals and owner insurance cost if you had a prang.
Yes when everyone has an ev you won't have an alternative; but, it's a bit like the current too-few public charger discourse though, repair resources suddenly swamped.

they seem particularly concerned by failed repairs after accidents that have unknowingly impacted battery (shock on battery even without external physical damage!)

neighbour has just got a works id4 single motor 200hp/9s - was going to run some quotes to see if less powerful ev's attract similar premiums to ice alterntatives,
Are ev insurers currently offering favourable private initial ev insurance rates, but any kind of damage might put up premium making it unaffordable,
been paying sub £300 forever 3series/<200hp , but an EV even at £500 where I might pay monthly, well, if that went to £750 following a prang, I'd be wary.
(have a renewal in september anyway - I'll sort that out first before making some whatif ev quotes - don't want to queer the renewal, anonymous quoting seems difficult)
 
bigmike20vt said:
i take your point however Tesla IS still somewhat of a premium / luxury brand.
probably comparable to a fairly high end BMW or Audi / Merc

if you want to compare to a middle of the road golf diesel then surely an MG4 or E-Niro or ID3 would be more comparable , in which case the headline drop in value would be far less because they didn't cost anywhere near as much as the Tesla in the 1st place
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Tesla isn't a luxury brand. I'd say it's on par with Ford/Vauxhall and Model 3s are like the new Mondeo. They are very expensive because the batteries and motors are very expensive. The rest of the car is average quality.
 
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