Everyone must read

Yes they are technically great for overclocking but despite the name of the forums not everyone is confident or can afford(in a business sense) to overclock their components plus there are the bragging rights such as they are of having the 6800 etc.
 
bragging rights? you must be joking, would you brag that you had paid 6 times what the e6300 costs to have an unlocked multiplier when allyou had to do was a simple free bios flash
 
well i have new Asus bois & E6300 and u get 6 or 7 muti...so nothing to exciting
i found the Asus P5B Deluxe to be not to good @ OC.....so now trying Gigabyte DS3
 
jemz said:
well i have new Asus bois & E6300 and u get 6 or 7 muti...so nothing to exciting
i found the Asus P5B Deluxe to be not to good @ OC.....so now trying Gigabyte DS3
Click to expand...

did u not read the article? the bios makes every conroe have multiplier unlocked so with an e6300 you could have a 12x multiplier
 
Psycho Sonny said:
did u not read the article? the bios makes every conroe have multiplier unlocked so with an e6300 you could have a 12x multiplier
Click to expand...

Did you not read the article?

Nowhere does it say that the E6300 unlocks to X12... in fact if you read the anandtech article it links to you will clearly see that the E6300 was only changable between X7 (stock) and X6......
 
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It may have the cache of an FX-62, but it doesn't have the cache of a top-flight conroe core'd chip. Hence why I'm plumping for an E6600.
 
Kabaala said:
Did you not read the article?

Nowhere does it say that the E6300 unlocks to X12... in fact if you read the anandtech article it links to you will clearly see that the E6300 was only changable between X7 (stock) and X6......
Click to expand...

Even more exciting is that ASUS says they have found a way to unlock up or down most Conroe chips. This will be a significant new feature that is highly desired by many Core 2 Duo buyers. It didn't take but a few minutes for us to get the new BIOS flashed and a Core 2 Duo chip mounted to check this out.

A pattern has been developing for some time in test results from Core 2 Duo chips. The 2MB Cache chips, the E6300 and E6400, are generally overclocking a bit better than the 4MB E6600, E6700, and X6800 chips. Since performance of the 2MB is a bit lower than the 4MB cache at the same frequency, this means you can make up for some of the 2MB cache deficiency with the ability to run at a faster speed. With this in mind, testing was performed with all 4 of the Core 2 Duo chips that are multiplier locked - the 4MB E6700 and E6600, and the 2MB E6400 and E6300.


Some Conroe chips also unlock at the top, allowing ranges to about 14x. None of our Conroe chips unlocked up, but you may be one of the lucky ones who have a Conroe that unlocks both down and up.



Becuase you obviously missed it the first few times you read it i will have to enlarge and bold
 
just because they can doesn't meen they will.
also the higher end chip _TEND_ (not always) to be better quality (or atleast you've a better chance of a good clocker as they have passed the tests for that speed).
also even if they have a higher clock speed, the larger cash on *** 6600s will make that moot.
AND its compairing overclocks using different cooling systems.
 
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I am a total newbie when it comes to overclocking and am thinking of buying an E6600. What is this all about overclocking top and bottom? In the BIOS screen is there an option menu which allows someone to overclock both or it simply changing the multiplier and it overclocks both top and bottom?

I am new to this whole area :p
 
Psycho Sonny said:
Even more exciting is that ASUS says they have found a way to unlock up or down most Conroe chips. This will be a significant new feature that is highly desired by many Core 2 Duo buyers. It didn't take but a few minutes for us to get the new BIOS flashed and a Core 2 Duo chip mounted to check this out.

A pattern has been developing for some time in test results from Core 2 Duo chips. The 2MB Cache chips, the E6300 and E6400, are generally overclocking a bit better than the 4MB E6600, E6700, and X6800 chips. Since performance of the 2MB is a bit lower than the 4MB cache at the same frequency, this means you can make up for some of the 2MB cache deficiency with the ability to run at a faster speed. With this in mind, testing was performed with all 4 of the Core 2 Duo chips that are multiplier locked - the 4MB E6700 and E6600, and the 2MB E6400 and E6300.


Some Conroe chips also unlock at the top, allowing ranges to about 14x. None of our Conroe chips unlocked up, but you may be one of the lucky ones who have a Conroe that unlocks both down and up.



Becuase you obviously missed it the first few times you read it i will have to enlarge and bold
Click to expand...

Ummm...you really should read the whole article before you jump in with both feet as far as you can and then realise that it's sinking sand you're up to your neck in.
If I may just post a few choice parts of the full article for your enjoyment?

Some Conroe chips also unlock at the top, allowing ranges to about 14x. None of our Conroe chips unlocked up, but you may be one of the lucky ones who have a Conroe that unlocks both down and up

So apparently some unclock both up & down.
So far nobody has confirmed this - even in their own tests they failed to find any Conroe CPU that could be clocked upwards.
Personally I've not seen anyone post that they have been able to clock upwards.
Even the BIOS release notes simply say "can change multiplyer" - nothing about both up & down.

The E6400 starts at 8x266 or 2.13GHz. With the new 507 BIOS we managed to reach stable speeds of 445x8, 511x7, and 514x6. This composite should give you a better idea of performance at a FSB of 445x8

Nothing special going on here - same kind of overclocks we've been seeing from the beginning.
Notice no upwards multiplyer clocking....

The E6300 unlocked down and reached 525x7 at stock multiplier. We were very near the limits of the ASUS P5B with the new BIOS and Scythe Infinity air cooling since dropping to x6 only gained us a few more MHz on the FSB, namely 532 at 6X. This is a100% bus overclock and it clearly demonstrates the added flexibility of the lower speed Core 2 Duo chips

Oh look, still no upwards multiplyer clocking, all FSB which again we've known about for months.

First, we should note that certain Gigabyte P965 boards also allow downward unlocks with the latest BIOS releases. ASUS joins them in offering this feature, and they have broken new ground with the 0507 BIOS for the P5B Deluxe. The ability to specify multipliers - even if it's only downward unlocked - is so significant that every other manufacturer will have to follow suit or lose market share to the two motherboard giants

What's this - indicating that maybe you can only downward multiplyer unlock after all?
What with nobody anywhere confirming that any other chip than the X6800 and a few ES doing the rounds can simply multiplyer unlock upwards?

At present, every Core 2 Duo chip we tried unlocked down (this included both B1 and B2 steppings); however, none of our samples unlocked both up and down

Just a little more confirmation about the lack of upwards multiplyer unlocking and once again the simple fact - nobody has reported being able to do it yet.

ASUS tells us that many Core 2 Duo chips also unlock upwards...

I bet they do - yet nobody anywhere has been able to confirm this yet?
With all the Conroe users out there, many of them more than willing to overclock and I'm sure many of them owning this very motherboard you'd have thought somebody would have found an overclocking chip by now....
ASUS can say what they like - but they have backed up their statement where and how?
Do we have any proof ASUS said this at all?
 
PikKOn said:
I am a total newbie when it comes to overclocking and am thinking of buying an E6600. What is this all about overclocking top and bottom? In the BIOS screen is there an option menu which allows someone to overclock both or it simply changing the multiplier and it overclocks both top and bottom?

I am new to this whole area :p
Click to expand...

back in the day you could change both the FSB and the mulitplyer, so if your ram/chip couldn't take a higher FSB you could inc the multi by 1 and drop the FPB down BUT STILL HAVE A FASTER CHIP! and this was good.
then intel started locking the multiplyers on their chips so you couldn't (as did AMD on some chips, but easy to get around at the time iirc).

its just another way of getting more speed, or the maximum speed, from one chip.
but this report is leaving out the real world results of running those chips at that speed. the 6600 and above because they have larger cash will outperform a 6300 etc even with a lower clock speed.
 
VeNT said:
but this report is leaving out the real world results of running those chips at that speed. the 6600 and above because they have larger cash will outperform a 6300 etc even with a lower clock speed.
Click to expand...

the CACHE will only make like a 200mhz difference (just an estimate) so if you had an e6300 @ 3.7 GHZ it would be equal to an e6600 @ 3.5ghz, plus the larger cache will only be used by some programs not all of them so the e6300 would be faster is some but equal in others, plus its fsb speed would be higher due to the overclocking therefore faster
 
stoofa said:
Ummm...you really should read the whole article before you jump in with both feet as far as you can and then realise that it's sinking sand you're up to your neck in.
If I may just post a few choice parts of the full article for your enjoyment?

Some Conroe chips also unlock at the top, allowing ranges to about 14x. None of our Conroe chips unlocked up, but you may be one of the lucky ones who have a Conroe that unlocks both down and up

So apparently some unclock both up & down.
So far nobody has confirmed this - even in their own tests they failed to find any Conroe CPU that could be clocked upwards.
Personally I've not seen anyone post that they have been able to clock upwards.
Even the BIOS release notes simply say "can change multiplyer" - nothing about both up & down.

The E6400 starts at 8x266 or 2.13GHz. With the new 507 BIOS we managed to reach stable speeds of 445x8, 511x7, and 514x6. This composite should give you a better idea of performance at a FSB of 445x8

Nothing special going on here - same kind of overclocks we've been seeing from the beginning.
Notice no upwards multiplyer clocking....

The E6300 unlocked down and reached 525x7 at stock multiplier. We were very near the limits of the ASUS P5B with the new BIOS and Scythe Infinity air cooling since dropping to x6 only gained us a few more MHz on the FSB, namely 532 at 6X. This is a100% bus overclock and it clearly demonstrates the added flexibility of the lower speed Core 2 Duo chips

Oh look, still no upwards multiplyer clocking, all FSB which again we've known about for months.

First, we should note that certain Gigabyte P965 boards also allow downward unlocks with the latest BIOS releases. ASUS joins them in offering this feature, and they have broken new ground with the 0507 BIOS for the P5B Deluxe. The ability to specify multipliers - even if it's only downward unlocked - is so significant that every other manufacturer will have to follow suit or lose market share to the two motherboard giants

What's this - indicating that maybe you can only downward multiplyer unlock after all?
What with nobody anywhere confirming that any other chip than the X6800 and a few ES doing the rounds can simply multiplyer unlock upwards?

At present, every Core 2 Duo chip we tried unlocked down (this included both B1 and B2 steppings); however, none of our samples unlocked both up and down

Just a little more confirmation about the lack of upwards multiplyer unlocking and once again the simple fact - nobody has reported being able to do it yet.

ASUS tells us that many Core 2 Duo chips also unlock upwards...

I bet they do - yet nobody anywhere has been able to confirm this yet?
With all the Conroe users out there, many of them more than willing to overclock and I'm sure many of them owning this very motherboard you'd have thought somebody would have found an overclocking chip by now....
ASUS can say what they like - but they have backed up their statement where and how?
Do we have any proof ASUS said this at all?
Click to expand...

hmm seems someone obviously believes whatever they are told by ASUS lol. Quite a typical response by joe public, I wonder how many extra boards they sold due to some exec who figured this was a clever marketing plan!!!
 
stoofa said:
Ummm...you really should read the whole article before you jump in with both feet as far as you can and then realise that it's sinking sand you're up to your neck in.
If I may just post a few choice parts of the full article for your enjoyment?

Some Conroe chips also unlock at the top, allowing ranges to about 14x. None of our Conroe chips unlocked up, but you may be one of the lucky ones who have a Conroe that unlocks both down and up

So apparently some unclock both up & down.
So far nobody has confirmed this - even in their own tests they failed to find any Conroe CPU that could be clocked upwards.
Personally I've not seen anyone post that they have been able to clock upwards.
Even the BIOS release notes simply say "can change multiplyer" - nothing about both up & down.

The E6400 starts at 8x266 or 2.13GHz. With the new 507 BIOS we managed to reach stable speeds of 445x8, 511x7, and 514x6. This composite should give you a better idea of performance at a FSB of 445x8

Nothing special going on here - same kind of overclocks we've been seeing from the beginning.
Notice no upwards multiplyer clocking....

The E6300 unlocked down and reached 525x7 at stock multiplier. We were very near the limits of the ASUS P5B with the new BIOS and Scythe Infinity air cooling since dropping to x6 only gained us a few more MHz on the FSB, namely 532 at 6X. This is a100% bus overclock and it clearly demonstrates the added flexibility of the lower speed Core 2 Duo chips

Oh look, still no upwards multiplyer clocking, all FSB which again we've known about for months.

First, we should note that certain Gigabyte P965 boards also allow downward unlocks with the latest BIOS releases. ASUS joins them in offering this feature, and they have broken new ground with the 0507 BIOS for the P5B Deluxe. The ability to specify multipliers - even if it's only downward unlocked - is so significant that every other manufacturer will have to follow suit or lose market share to the two motherboard giants

What's this - indicating that maybe you can only downward multiplyer unlock after all?
What with nobody anywhere confirming that any other chip than the X6800 and a few ES doing the rounds can simply multiplyer unlock upwards?

At present, every Core 2 Duo chip we tried unlocked down (this included both B1 and B2 steppings); however, none of our samples unlocked both up and down

Just a little more confirmation about the lack of upwards multiplyer unlocking and once again the simple fact - nobody has reported being able to do it yet.

ASUS tells us that many Core 2 Duo chips also unlock upwards...

I bet they do - yet nobody anywhere has been able to confirm this yet?
With all the Conroe users out there, many of them more than willing to overclock and I'm sure many of them owning this very motherboard you'd have thought somebody would have found an overclocking chip by now....
ASUS can say what they like - but they have backed up their statement where and how?
Do we have any proof ASUS said this at all?
Click to expand...

Thanks for that Stoofa. Saved me the hassle of trying convince him that Asus haven't turned water into wine.
 
If you only look at clock speed (and not the difference in size of the cache) in general lower clocked cpu's have more oc potential as at any design "phase" the higher clocked ones are getting more to physical limits of heat etc

Therefore the E6300/6400 are more likely clockable to the same MHZ/GHZ rating as the E6700/6800 and beyond (ie all cpu's of the same fab week are usually clockable to the same level) and as long as you get a good fab week for your particular cpu then even if its a E6300 it should clock to the same limit (given the same mobo and cooling equipment) as a E6800 in its place.

There was also documented proof that in general the larger the cache size the harder it is to get a high stable oc. So this is also a good reason why the lower specced chips should at least be as good as the high end ones.

Remember the extra 2mb cache between the different types of core 2 duo chips will make more / less of a difference in different games or applications
but in general should be worth around 400Mhz extra core speed wise.

The other thing to remember is that as the Intel chips are less dependant on running RAM in sync with CPU speed, multiplier used is less important than on A64 rigs (of course its still brilliant if 1:1 or as low ratio as possible can be used, but its not such a big loss if it cant be)

This is just my understanding - but I believe the above to be true
 
Psycho Sonny said:
bragging rights? you must be joking, would you brag that you had paid 6 times what the e6300 costs to have an unlocked multiplier when allyou had to do was a simple free bios flash
Click to expand...

I try not to brag about what I own(or don't) full stop. However if you have the cash and want to tell people exactly what you own in top end hardware (nb that is guaranteed to perform at that speed/resolution/whatever rather than might with overclocking) then feel free as a lot of people do, I might not listen but that is a personal thing.

Not everyone has the confidence or the freedom(because they might use their machine for business reasons) to overclock so a 6300 would not be an option.

//edit FrankJH I think is more or less right, the 1mb cache(per core) versions of the X2s were approximately 200mhz faster than the 512kb versions so it seems logical that going between 1mb and 2mb(per core) for a Conroe would yield approx 400mhz :)
 
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