I've got magnetorheological semi active suspension on my road car, so why can they not have that on the pinnacle of motor sport ?
F1 Testing 2020: Week 1 Barcelona (19th - 21st)
- Thread starter Shimmy
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I've got magnetorheological semi active suspension on my road car, so why can they not have that on the pinnacle of motor sport ?
Soldato
Sorry, I wasn't aware it was on production cars.
Still, reading about it's not really the same as the active suspension development race of the 80s and 90s which is what I was referring too (and it was 30 years ago).
Soldato
All these innovations lead to alienating the budget shy teams which is the current issue of F1. Cost. Which then alienates the fans becasue racing suffers as a result. If the sport continued like that, nobody would want to enter or sponsor.
I think they're right to ban it in the interim, and any other ideas. But it should be encouraged as a proposal to future rules, so teams have a heads up on development. Of course that makes it less fun than a team turning up with say a double defuser and wiping the floor with everyone but ultimately when that excitement dies down we want to see race leaders fighting for the win, not walking it.
I think they're right to ban it in the interim, and any other ideas. But it should be encouraged as a proposal to future rules, so teams have a heads up on development. Of course that makes it less fun than a team turning up with say a double defuser and wiping the floor with everyone but ultimately when that excitement dies down we want to see race leaders fighting for the win, not walking it.
Man of Honour
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Innovation doesn't necessarily have to cost money. Indeed many of the best innovations in F1 history came from the smaller teams. If you are going to ban all innovation or make it available to all teams no one will bother at all.
Soldato
Really not a fan of limiting innovation, I understand the cost implications for smaller teams and the lack of new teams willing go join. But this sort of ban, without even seeing how it performs in race conditions, is just leading to more of the same cars. But to follow that up we are all getting the talk about the pink Mercedes following on from the complaints about Haas. I feel this is the on going start of the end of F1 as we know and love it.
Andi.
Andi.
Caporegime
We don't know what the drivers can or can't do with it yet, they've not experimented. But while I agree it's unlikely to help them push the limits it does give them an extra control over the vehicle, that doesn't seem a bad thing.
I'm not sure why "relevant to road use" is a particular cutoff, especially in these days when so much of F1 design is about aerodynamics that is utterly irrelevant to anything except F1. I'd rather teams were spending and innovating with mechanical systems like this than messing around making the mirrors produce fractionally less drag.
Many things have been banned which are used outside of F1 (i.e. active suspension or active aero), and while I agree that banning rules-dodges like the F-duct and frighteningly dangerous but clever tricks like the fan cars was right, I think F1 is far too quick to ban technical innovations. In-race dynamic toe angle control is a clever trick that I think it is a shame to ban before we've ever really seen it in action.
Could also lead to some entertainment especially in qually to try to get the benefit out of it and then one of the Merc drivers doesn't put it back correctly and goes wide at the next corner etc. could open up the racing if it's a bit closer at the front.
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Soldato
Trickling down to road use is the big thing in F1. Or at least that's what the top teams claim, especially regarding the power units (which aren't all that relevant the vast majority of cars at the moment).
I do agree that it's a shame to ban it, I'm just saying what I think the reasons for it are, and I think they're valid. Ideally we'd keep things like this, but I just don't think it's really practical to do so.
Caporegime
I realise the teams like to have trickle down to road use; but I think treating it like a cutoff is a bad idea. Especially for minor stuff like this; we're not talking engine development here.
Caporegime
Not sure we can read much into the times at this stage except to say that Mercedes look ominous. Personally I'm just glad none of the teams are having a mare this year; indeed it looks like every team will manage a solid test programme for once.
Soldato
Can't believe the news of the banning. I was actually excited to see something new on a car, something we've not seen before.
F1 should be about pushing innovation and engineering near the limits.
What incentive will teams have to develop new stuff? They know they could spend X amount of time & money on something just for it to get banned.
F1 should be about pushing innovation and engineering near the limits.
What incentive will teams have to develop new stuff? They know they could spend X amount of time & money on something just for it to get banned.
Ferrari are not looking that good. Effectively the slowest car out there today (the 2 drivers behind Vettel had team mates who went faster). Also 140 laps down on testing total from Mercedes, only Williams and Haas have fewer laps done this week.
They seem to be just hovering around 1:18.5, stuck on some softer tyres and only went a small amount faster.
They seem to be just hovering around 1:18.5, stuck on some softer tyres and only went a small amount faster.
Soldato
And with some of the midfield teams looking extremely good they are going to have to pull something out of the bag in Melbourne to look halfway decent.
The midfield fight is going to be epic by the looks of things, some really nice performing cars out there.
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Yeah, the midfield looks really tight, Pink Mercs, Renault and Alfa's really looking good. Potentially fighting for 3rd overall if Ferrari stay back there.
Soldato
But it hasn't been banned at all, the system isn't part of the design for cars in 2021 therefore it can't be used and Mercedes are well aware of this. However everyone is jumping the gun as we don't know yet if the system will be of benefit or actually detrimental. Hell mercedes might not even bring it to the first race.
Associate
Very true, but if they do find a benefit it is a genius move to invent something that no-one else is likely to develop at this late stage due to the lack of relevance for 2021.
It looks like it's something that is quite easy to implement, it's not a double defuser, but with the banning next year some will not even try as, by the time they get it on the car, it'll have a very limited life on the car.
It is a shame that the FIA crack down on this sort of innovation, it's something that has been visibly missing from F1 for a while now - the rules are too strict..
I would like them to open up the energy recovery side of the power unit. Add a MGU(Motor Generator Unit) to the front axle and increase the allowed energy recovery, and thus deployment, to unlimited. This way it will push F1 in a useful, for the motor industry, way and would increase performance a good amount - alas it won't happen with the FIA as it is now.
Apparently not that easy to implement. Heard anything from 3 to 6 months to implement correctly, also it has to pass a crash test - more expense, potentially a new chassis as well, which will bring even more crash tests then.
On the positive side...
Binotto has admitted they are behind Mercedes and Red Bull at the moment.
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/...rari-boss-binotto.38KIsNMysAnT8fnrdWR6T6.html