Soldato
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Farming is hard, margins are slim, so you need to be doing it at scale to make good money.
Farmers
- Thread starter K-2
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Consigliere
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Any examples of the automation? Quite curious!
So like..he automates whereas other farmers haven't?
Amongst the BS in this thread, I have seen others say that 20 hour days are often possible in busy periods (lambing season).
To add gravitas to this, my girlfriends father was a cattle farmer and calving season was extremely busy, easily 18-20 hour days and often up all night ensuring calves and heifers etc are all OK during birth.
He is now solely arable, and although it’s a little less intense, harvest is a particularly busy time, working during all daylight hours (can be 18-20 hours where he is), for up to 8 weeks, to get the harvest in.
So, in answer to the OP’s question, yes it’s possible for a farmer to quite easily put in 20 hour days - particularly if it’s a small operation, but there are less intense periods.
That said, even during those less intense periods, it’s still a 7 day week for smaller operations with livestock.
It’s a rewarding job, and can be profitable, but there are many accounts of severe loneliness and depression amongst the farming community. To compound this, when EU subsidies go, farming will definitely take a massive hit, although the government is apparently concocting some scheme to (at least partially) replace the EU subsidies. But, as with all things Brexit related, there is a distinct lack of detail on what this will look like.
To add gravitas to this, my girlfriends father was a cattle farmer and calving season was extremely busy, easily 18-20 hour days and often up all night ensuring calves and heifers etc are all OK during birth.
He is now solely arable, and although it’s a little less intense, harvest is a particularly busy time, working during all daylight hours (can be 18-20 hours where he is), for up to 8 weeks, to get the harvest in.
So, in answer to the OP’s question, yes it’s possible for a farmer to quite easily put in 20 hour days - particularly if it’s a small operation, but there are less intense periods.
That said, even during those less intense periods, it’s still a 7 day week for smaller operations with livestock.
It’s a rewarding job, and can be profitable, but there are many accounts of severe loneliness and depression amongst the farming community. To compound this, when EU subsidies go, farming will definitely take a massive hit, although the government is apparently concocting some scheme to (at least partially) replace the EU subsidies. But, as with all things Brexit related, there is a distinct lack of detail on what this will look like.
Associate
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Worked on a few farms as an electrical contractor over the years most use farming as a sideline business
Seen farmers set up self storage businesses or running truck businesses or renting out units for offices
Even worked on a farm where they rent out fields for quads or paintball businesses theres many ways farmers can use the land/ sheds or barns to make money for little effort
Seen farmers set up self storage businesses or running truck businesses or renting out units for offices
Even worked on a farm where they rent out fields for quads or paintball businesses theres many ways farmers can use the land/ sheds or barns to make money for little effort
Soldato
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- 17 Oct 2005
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20 hour days are rare but they do happen, more common on smaller farms such as hill farms rather than large farm estates. Farmers simply can't afford to lose a calf or lambs, so this time of year is particularly challenging physically and mentally.
While the crop yield in the UK this year was generally good, the harvest next year probably won't be given the terrible ground conditions in the autumn, with some crops which were meant to be planted in October or early November not even in the ground until after Christmas. Many arable farmers will be crossing everything for an ideal spring and summer otherwise their yields won't be great. A couple of years like that could easily wipe out a lot of smaller farms in the current climate and with the loss of EU subsidies.
While the crop yield in the UK this year was generally good, the harvest next year probably won't be given the terrible ground conditions in the autumn, with some crops which were meant to be planted in October or early November not even in the ground until after Christmas. Many arable farmers will be crossing everything for an ideal spring and summer otherwise their yields won't be great. A couple of years like that could easily wipe out a lot of smaller farms in the current climate and with the loss of EU subsidies.
Make money in some areas, but they lose out in others (eg using that land for crops or livestock), so it's hardly a lucrative alternative. There's also only very specific areas where such ideas are practical, and obviously potential is highly limited - not every farm in a 10 mile radius is going to be able to offer land for such activities as there simply won't be the demand. You'll see two or three instances in such an area perhaps.
Any examples of the automation? Quite curious!
So like..he automates whereas other farmers haven't?
It is a friend of my dads so I don't know specifics. I imagine the heavy stuff is fully supervised but they seemed to have some stuff that was doing its own thing semi-supervised using GPS boundaries (which he could track the progress of on a map). Most of what I know is from overhearing conversations and seeing the front-end he has on his laptop that has the land mapped down to a few CMs of resolution with loads of information on historic planting and treatment, specific problem areas, projections for future use, etc. and what is going on currently and he can sit there on the laptop come up with an action plan and immediately push it in real time to the workers.
Currently there isn't much automation in farming but is expected to increase a lot in the next 20 years. There are very few automonous tractors/harvesters available, and very few farms have them, and that mostly only works for large US farms with mega fields. The current tech is like ADAs in cars, so the tractors can keep straight lines for example but are human driven. There is a little more in the way of using sensor networks in the ground to measure soil condition and even drones with IR imaging for moisture detection which can then automate irrigation or alert the need for manual fertilizer treatments etc.
And this all mostly surrounding arable crops. There is nothing to automate calving or hill sheep farming etc. There are some pick-n-place type robotic arm system for autonomous planting and weeding of say tomatoes in a greenhouse but these aren't common.
One of the issues is most farmers have very little cash reserve, often massively in debt, so buying very expensive new machinery is not an easy decision. They can get loans if they can make the economics work out but it tends not to. The high price of autonomous combine harvester has to be compared with the costs of manual labour and the farmer working 20 hours a day during harvest etc.
A few freinds of the family are or were farmers, and both my sisters are vets that have a passion for large animal veterinary work but the economics of farming in the UK is such taht it is not very desirable form both an economic but also ethical standpoint (farmers so broke they let animals suffer rather call in a vet).
The 18-20 hour days, 7 days a week for 2 months a year is pretty normal. The rest of the year is often about 12hours a day 6 or 7 days a week. Noting if you are farming animals there is no chance of a day off. In fact in general holidays and vacations simply don't exist. There can be quieter times, especially for arable farmers mid-winter but you still see 9 hours and 6 days a week.
they tend to be asset rich and cash poor. Large farms and a nice big farm building, loads of expensive machinery, but they pay themselves 25-30k a year working 80-100 hour week with zero vacation.
Here in Switzerland I know several winemakers, and can see others working in the vineyards form my office window. Win ther is the quite time of year, that means starting at 7am and finish at 6pm 6 days a week. 7th days may end up at some trade show, or trying to make sales at restaurants etc. In the spring/early summer, they are in the fields before 6am, home at 7pm, 7 days a week, some days might be longer. mid-summer is quieter, similar hours to winter. then insanity breaks out and they will work 20hours a day/7 days a week for 6-8 weeks during harvest. Same issues with assets and cash. Ina good year the vinyard makes a reasonable profit, then the next year there is a late frost decimating production and the same time they have to replace their 250K grape harvester. My neighbors told me they are about 5million CHF in debt and it will take 30 years or more to clear that debt and they will never be able to but a house in that time. Their only hope is the debt doesn't increase.
There is no retirement, they work until they are physically incapable,. In their 80s working the same 12-20 hour days.
On the flip side they drink wine all day, on the house.
The 18-20 hour days, 7 days a week for 2 months a year is pretty normal. The rest of the year is often about 12hours a day 6 or 7 days a week. Noting if you are farming animals there is no chance of a day off. In fact in general holidays and vacations simply don't exist. There can be quieter times, especially for arable farmers mid-winter but you still see 9 hours and 6 days a week.
they tend to be asset rich and cash poor. Large farms and a nice big farm building, loads of expensive machinery, but they pay themselves 25-30k a year working 80-100 hour week with zero vacation.
Here in Switzerland I know several winemakers, and can see others working in the vineyards form my office window. Win ther is the quite time of year, that means starting at 7am and finish at 6pm 6 days a week. 7th days may end up at some trade show, or trying to make sales at restaurants etc. In the spring/early summer, they are in the fields before 6am, home at 7pm, 7 days a week, some days might be longer. mid-summer is quieter, similar hours to winter. then insanity breaks out and they will work 20hours a day/7 days a week for 6-8 weeks during harvest. Same issues with assets and cash. Ina good year the vinyard makes a reasonable profit, then the next year there is a late frost decimating production and the same time they have to replace their 250K grape harvester. My neighbors told me they are about 5million CHF in debt and it will take 30 years or more to clear that debt and they will never be able to but a house in that time. Their only hope is the debt doesn't increase.
There is no retirement, they work until they are physically incapable,. In their 80s working the same 12-20 hour days.
On the flip side they drink wine all day, on the house.
Yeah he mostly does crops - not really sure what he has animal wise but from what I've heard that side is more of a hobby now. Pretty sure from the images he had he has drones in use for surveying, etc. I'm mostly trying to deduce it from seeing the software he has running on the laptop that manages it all which had an impressive level of integration.
Associate
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- 3 May 2007
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Farmers get big Grant's for diversification so they would be mad not too.
I am a farmers son. Life is hard for small farmers and they just scrap a living. Our income was certainly low enough I qualified for a full poor person scholarship to the local private school. My dad didnt take holidays with my mum and my brother and me as he couldnt afford to pay anybody to look after the farm. He would sometimes join us for the day when we were holidaying at Filey.
Everybody chipped in and worked on the farm including me and my brother. I was driver tractors when I was 11.
My dad would work 7 days a week, 52 weeks of the year. When you have animals they have to be fed every day.
Some busy times of the year like harvest or lambing then yes he would work 20 hours a day. Very often my dad would be up at dawn for milking and by the time he came in for his breakfast with us he had already worked 2 to 3 hours.
The average fame makes £2,200 per annum from farming and £28,300 from subsidies. Still £30k per annum is hardly something to be happy about when you are working 7 days a week and long days.
Basically unless you are a massive farm, small farmers are either just hanging in there or have diversified into other things. Thats why you see so many caravan parks at farms. Far more profitable than farming.
Its onl;y when you sell up that you get your money. Neither myself or my brother wanted to take over the family farm so my dad sold it when he retired. Got about £1m for it which is pretty good for them after spending 40 years living off a few thousand per annum. They have never been so wealthy as they are now in retirement.
Funnily enough the farm is no longer a farm and is a massive static caravan park now and all the outbuildings were converted into homes.
Also, farmers top the suicides rates for occupation. One farmer per week commits suicide in the UK. The stress of the long hours, massive debts, no income wears people down.
Everybody chipped in and worked on the farm including me and my brother. I was driver tractors when I was 11.
My dad would work 7 days a week, 52 weeks of the year. When you have animals they have to be fed every day.
Some busy times of the year like harvest or lambing then yes he would work 20 hours a day. Very often my dad would be up at dawn for milking and by the time he came in for his breakfast with us he had already worked 2 to 3 hours.
The average fame makes £2,200 per annum from farming and £28,300 from subsidies. Still £30k per annum is hardly something to be happy about when you are working 7 days a week and long days.
Basically unless you are a massive farm, small farmers are either just hanging in there or have diversified into other things. Thats why you see so many caravan parks at farms. Far more profitable than farming.
Its onl;y when you sell up that you get your money. Neither myself or my brother wanted to take over the family farm so my dad sold it when he retired. Got about £1m for it which is pretty good for them after spending 40 years living off a few thousand per annum. They have never been so wealthy as they are now in retirement.
Funnily enough the farm is no longer a farm and is a massive static caravan park now and all the outbuildings were converted into homes.
Also, farmers top the suicides rates for occupation. One farmer per week commits suicide in the UK. The stress of the long hours, massive debts, no income wears people down.
Soldato
- Joined
- 13 Apr 2013
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- La France
I don’t know about the total hours worked, but I often see my neighbour’s ploughing and seeding their fields late at night thanks to huge LED light bars on their tractors. Due to the good soil, hot summers and mild winters; they’re growing different cash crops all year around.
I rented a yard on a farm for three years until recent. Lovely people he is the father in law of Alistair cook who would often be helping out. I would say they certainly do a lot of hours but they diddnt ever seem to stressed and had a good few farm hands. Often away following the cricket around the world.
In lambing season its pretty intense, there is somebody in the sheds pretty much 24/7. It was a beautiful place to work though.
In lambing season its pretty intense, there is somebody in the sheds pretty much 24/7. It was a beautiful place to work though.