Fat UK Refs

HumanShield · 17 Apr 2018 at 13:57

No1newts said:
As an aside to what someone mentioned, pipeline, we will never have that in the UK. You're expected to start at the bottom as a ref and the grief they get is appaling. They get abused verbally, threatened regularly with physical violence and intimidated most games by "fans" and they have zero protection. Until we (the Brits) impart a bit of decency and treat them even if not with respect bit like human beings you will never get people wanting to come through. They then hit the top and get abuse on a national scale?! It's a mugs game.

Reminded me of this http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/43736236

Who'd want to start a career as a ref if this is the sort of abuse you'd be subjected to?

Moothead2 · 17 Apr 2018 at 15:21

This has been a thing for a long time, it's not a recent thing at all. Graham Poll's 3 yellow cards for example was 12 years ago now. I also don't think it's a Premier League specific problem either, **** decisions happen all over the world. Refs can only act on what they can see and sometimes that means something that's happening 60 yards away. The sooner VAR decisions can become as fluid as goal line technology the better.

Snax · 17 Apr 2018 at 22:19

A lot of the comments here defend referees because the environment is unpalatable.

Competency shouldn’t be appraised at with a concession for how challenging the job is. The choice of whether to pursue that career is up to the individual...their performance should be appraised in an objective manner, not compromised because their job environment is challenging.

Hotwired · 17 Apr 2018 at 22:49

Snax said:
A lot of the comments here defend referees because the environment is unpalatable.

Competency shouldn’t be appraised at with a concession for how challenging the job is. The choice of whether to pursue that career is up to the individual...their performance should be appraised in an objective manner, not compromised because their job environment is challenging.

You know it's possible to say the environment is garbage and also happily attack referee performance?

Easy linkto be made right there of course, blame the environment for choking the growth of quality referees and discouraging individuals to come forward to train.

You don't need to be happy with performance to question why it is what it is. Being unhappy with performance is also a motivator.

HangTime · 23 Apr 2018 at 23:16

I'm not convinced the positioning thing is purely down to fitness. I consider it inevitable that refs will not be perfectly placed to get a good view of every incident because of the speed the game is played at nowadays and the unpredictable nature of player and ball movements. I see mistakes or sub-optimal positioning from foreign refs too, so it's not just a fat UK thing.

nicktay2605 · 24 Apr 2018 at 12:40

Expecting refs to be as fit or as fast as Premier League players is unrealistic. It takes years for refs to get the experience they need to referee a PL game, by which point even the youngest refs will be in their 30s. Most PL players are 18-35 and some of them are ridiculously fast, I don't imagine any ref could keep up with them.

I don't think the standard of refereeing in the PL is even that bad. Refs are making decisions without any time to consider them, in a sport that moves at a very fast pace. Also, bear in mind that the PL is probably one of the fastest moving leagues in the world and the most watched by media and fans, all of which make their job harder than their counterparts in other leagues imo. There isn't a single sport in the world where the officials get things right all the time. The NFL officials get stuff wrong even after watching video replays. On top of that, there are plenty of decisions in football that are subjective, things aren't black and white. You get the Match of the Day and Sky Sports pundits disagreeing on decisions, so how are refs expected to be right all the time?

I'm not by any means suggesting PL refs are perfect. For example, the Marcos Alonso decision last week was very odd. The ref had a clear view and should definitely have sent him off, so they don't always help themselves, but on the whole I think they do a pretty decent job.

neviditelny · 27 Apr 2018 at 00:53

Moothead2 said:
This has been a thing for a long time, it's not a recent thing at all. Graham Poll's 3 yellow cards for example was 12 years ago now. I also don't think it's a Premier League specific problem either, **** decisions happen all over the world. Refs can only act on what they can see and sometimes that means something that's happening 60 yards away. The sooner VAR decisions can become as fluid as goal line technology the better.

You're thinking of Poll's 3 yellow cards in the World Cup? I read his biography and it was a pretty simple reason why he ended up giving someone 3 yellow cards. He listed the teams in their colors, red/white and yellow. And when the Serbian (I think it was) did get the 2nd or 3rd card he put the yellow card down for the same number but in the yellow (Australia) column instead of the Serbian column.

The thing with the abuse of the refs, it is the same in most countries. I know it for sure the same when I did referee football (mainly youth levels) back home in Sweden 13-14 years ago.

xxalxx · 28 Apr 2018 at 03:56

^^^ Also didnt help that Simunic was born in Australia and speaks with an Aussie accent! Easy mistake to make in the end.

chrcoluk · 28 Apr 2018 at 06:23

Snax said:
The quality of refereeing in Premiership is astonishingly poor. I’m sure it is even worse in lower divisions.

My understanding is the premier league refs are salaried at circa £70k per year. If so, how are they all so out of shape? A large portion of the poor decisions seem to come from the ref being out of position.

Surely they should be aspiring to the getting to the same fitness and mobility as the players themselves so they can keep up with play?

There seems to be a policy that there is a low willingness to replace established referees once they make it to the top.

Which has led to a combination of fat and aged referees.

The most fit and youngest referees are in the lower leagues, the reasoning supposedly is simply that lower league referees are not good enough quality so we cannot replace the top ones we have now.

Psycho Sonny · 11 May 2018 at 16:26

Tummy said:
Referee's in English football has not been good enough for a while, however, it is dire more recently.

I do not think it is down to their fitness.

Probably because you don't run for 90 minutes regularly.

If someone is in shape, you can have a full blown conversation with them and ask them complicated questions whilst they are running and they will answer normally.

Someone out of shape will struggle just to breathe.

So they are linked. Poor fitness will result in poor decisions being made. It won't be the only factor though. But it is 1 of many.