FFS think I've been done for speeding AGAIN.. HELP!

[matt100]

OK, I think I was zapped today and I think I was speeding, it was a stretch of the A31 in Dorset towards Poole just after the road goes down from a national speed limit to a 50 (although carries on being an unpopulated dual carriageway with no pedestrian crossing points but hey.. thats just detail.

I looked at my speedo when I saw the van and I think I was doing about 65mph, maybe a bit less, certainly not giving it the beans lets put it that way.

I have 6 points already, 1 sp30 in oct 2005 for 39 in a 30, 1 sp 30 in feb 2006 for 85 in a 70 (A417 in glos if anyone knows it, yet another arrow straight dual carriageway through the middle of nowhere).

So I'm facing 9 points and the brink of a ban until next October when 3 come off and obviously another 3 quickly after that.

Not interested in the insurance hike, I'm 30, have about 7 years ncb, driving a Focus ST and I was quoted £650 with 6 points or £715 with 9 so that makes almost no difference to my life whatsoever (and I think shows the insurance companies views of speeding tickets too tbh).

The problem is I do 30k a year and need my licence so I would like to drag things out as long as possible to get as close to next winter as I can to when 6 points drop off.

So what do I do, assuming I get a NIP next week.. what are the best stalling tactics? Is the PACE thing still a go-er? I'm happy to drag this right to the line then plead guilty if that buys me 4 or 5 or maybe more months.

Frankly I'm bloody angry that my livelihood could be at risk because of a civilian in a van with no discretion and no interest in whether what I was doing was safe (which I'm sure it was).. Which is why I want to be as arkward as possible, civil disobedience is at the heart of british democracy

It was clear, dry, broad daylight, 1pm so virtually no traffic, I wasn't overtaking, there are no side turnings and ironically I was watching the road rather than the laybyes, I honestly believe that I couldn't have been decribed as doing anything other than breaking the letter of the law.

Speaking to a copper friend and he confirmed with that sort of behaviour the police wouldn't have raised an eyebrow unless they wanted to check if the car was nicked.

It all seems so futile, the local paper was even carrying a headline of "50,000 motorists caught speeding in Dorset". I'll admit my first one a few years ago was naughty and I pay a lot of respect for 30mph limits (like the unpoliced road outside my daughters school that is literally deadly at rush hour).

The last 2 have been nothing other than money raisers, full stop in my opinion.

Can anyone offer any guidance?

 

[matt100]

yeah, 10% +2 is the normal calibration, speedo can often by out by up to 10% too but even so, 65mph less 10% would be 59mph, 50 limit +10% plus 2mph would be 57mph.

I'm pretty certain I'll have been done if he was pointing at me.

He could have been munching doughtnuts.. oh no hang on, thats coppers not civilians.. grr

 

[matt100]

Feel for you mate, those commercialised scameras are the worst.

But still, if I had 6 points already I think I'd have learnt my lesson and be driving like a granny everywhere no matter what until the points expired... :/

The margin is 10% + 2mph. But the commercial scameras don't really take much notice of that.

I did for about 16 months and to be honest 65 along there is very cedate.. If I'd given it some grief along there I'd have been well into 3 figures 225bhp remember

 

[matt100]

Are you sure it wasn't a road tax check camera-van thingy.

I thought I got snapped on my way to work in Slough 1 morning, doing around 50 in a 40 zone, stupid thing is the van was parked on the central reservation right under the static road speed camera.

hmm, can't say it definitely wasn't, interesting..

And to all those telling me to slow down.. well yes obviously I will be slowing down and I wouldn't ever consider trying to actually get out of it, what I want to do is delay the opportunity to plead guilty and take the 3 points (even if I wind up with a bigger fine).

I understand I can please guilty before the court date?

I'm not looking for sympathy, or a get out I just want to hang it out a bit and push back against the system, like I said, a bit of civil disobedience.

The first couple of times I just took it sraight on the chin (when it was a company car and I could have pushed it for ages.

After the first 3 points I got the message and started treating 30 and 40 zones as gospel and I stick to the limit, dual carriageways and motorways etc I tend to spend my time assessing the road/conditions etc and drive at what I consider to be a safe speed which I guess in the ST is a bit above the limit. I'm prepared to stake my name on the fact I am a safe driver as I have been consistantly doing 30 to 40k a year for the last 7 years and haven't even come close to hitting anything/performing emergency stops.

The location and operation of these vans seems almost to target career drivers.

The worst bit is I could have been using my mobile, smoking crack and drunk whilst driving on no licence or insurance with a fake tax disc and what would the police have got?

Nothing.

But fully registered and paid up, taxed and insured me will be one step closer to no job.

And yes I guess with 9 points I would have to drive like an absolute saint (although I'm sure I would get away with 12) but literally 1 moment of not concentrating and BANG.. what am I going to be looking at for the next year? The road? or my speedo?

 

[matt100]

I kind of half expected a load of the self righteous nonsense thats appeared in this thread..

I haven't said I didn't do it, I haven't said I am trying to get out of it, believe me I had enough of a run up to the van that in my car I could have been well into triple figures, tbh I was in national speed limit mode so I think I was being pretty sedate doing 65mph.

All that aside I was just asking if anyone knew how long I could push it with exchanging letters before I had to finally either put my hands up or wind up in front of a judge at which point I would have course fess up, in my view if they want to be arkward with pretty pointless cash collectors then I feel the least I can do is repay the favour.

In the meantime and going forwards of course I will be even more observant of the limit rather than the prevailing conditions and what feels safe which have served me well in the old "not hitting stuff".

I know this is a pretty pointless request but unless you have something constructive to say can you please keep it to yourself.

 

[matt100]

He could always do what most competant drivers do, Drive safely with an eye on the speedo and the road.......

eureka!!

you sound like an interesting chap, tell me more..

 

[matt100]

Me too, but the trouble is its a 30.....

seriously mate don't start trolling my thread, if you haven't got any other input please shove off and up your postcount somewhere else.

 

[matt100]

for goodness sake.. anyone would think I was saying I was planning on hiring lawyers and deploying every trick in the book to get off the ticket.

The simple fact is and the whole point of the thread is (/was.. seems to have changed now, thanks chaps ) gathering experience/opinions on delaying if possible the impending punishment (if there is one, I'm struggling to find any mention of mobile vans on that stretch of road and this info is pretty public).

If there is no sensible way to go about doing that of course I will just take the punishment.

Similarly after I got 6 points a couple of years ago I slowed down, genuinely. Given the amount of time I spend on the road I pass enough vans at or under the limit to know I must be observing it the majority of the time.. In the 2 years I've had my 6 points I've done as many miles as some people do in 10 years.

I think I'm quite entitled to have a bit of a moan because I would happily argue all day (as looks likely) that I was driving safely, not within the law granted, but safely nontheless.

If it helps pump up your ego or postcount to stick a glib comment in along the lines of "should have known better" or "told you so" then I guess there's not much I can do about it this being a public forum and all but jesus christ ocuk can be tiresome at times.

I'm not proud, I'm not gloating, I'm not trying to get off, I'm not even whinging about the unfairness much, give me a break and if you can't contribute.. don't.

 

[matt100]

Let them be dicks, just worry about your self. I really couldnt care what people think when im doing the limit.

have to agree with that myself, please don't get the impression I am condoning dangerous driving because I am most certainly not. This is part of my issue though seeing as we're all getting a bit soapboxy.. a policemanist would spot the aggressive driver and give them a talking to regardless of their speed.

The van/gatso is only interested in 1 thing and 1 thing only that is the most black and white to prove, impossible to defend against and easy to hand out a fine for.

 

[matt100]

impossible to defend against? how do you figure this?
this suggests it's impossible to avoid receiving a speeding ticket when in fact it's far from it.

these days, everyone is a victim. it "wasn't their fault" and this place is no different.
the FACT is speed cameras would catch nobody if the drivers who are intentionally speeding chose not to and those who aren't concentrating enough started to pay the required amount of attention to the task in hand.
basically we as motorists are handing "them" our cash on a silver platter.

(and yes, i've been done for speeding more than once, and quite a few other offences as it happens, ALL of them being my fault for being either too stupid/irresponsible or careless.)

good with stroppy posts, not great with reading english eh?

I said it was impossible to defend against not that it was impossible to not speed.. thats just daft

to be in a position to defend you have to be accused and to be accused you generally have to have been caught doing something.

I'm not suggesting for one second it is impossible not to speed, what I was saying was that once caught there is no defence other than "yes I did it" whereas there are shades of grey with dangerous/careless driving that the police clearly aren't interested in going near hence their relliance on speed cameras.

Its easy law..

did you do it?

no

we have a picture of you doing it

bugger
/end case

Less of the high horse please and don't try and make me out to be some sort of dangerous driving apologist.

What I know is the very first time I was caught speeding 10 years ago it was by a copper, with the volvo and the blue lights and the sitting in the back getting a lecture and that was the last speeding ticket I got for 8 years. These last 2, possibly 3 have been via vans and all I have been left with is a vague feeling of resentment and a feeling I should slow down to not get caught again rather than slowing down because a copper has made me feel about an inch tall after a good dressing down.

 

[matt100]

well at least you're answering the question now, any evidence of that would be great, I've read a fair amount along the lnes of exchanging these PACE letters and getting a summons and a date and blah blah blah (which bear in mind means the points aren't on your licence) can give you 4 to 6 months and then a few weeks before the date, have a change of heart, humble yourself and do some grovelling, take the punishment and then deal with it.

alternatively you may have some evidence that judges tend to assrape people who do this and give them 5 points and 800 quid.. that would make me swallow it right there and bend over.

like I said, I'm not trying to avoid the ultimate outcome and I'm not trying to say I'm in the right (much ) I just figured I might as well treat it with the respect I believe it deserves which is next to none. Had a copper pulled me and given me chapter and verse at high volume with wagging finger on why he was gunning there then this thread wouldn't exist.

 

[matt100]

A fraction of a second is all it takes to miss something, or break your scan pattern, plus on a sports bike (I know thats not the case with the OP) it takes longer than that as the speedo isnt really in the line of sight - I hate looking away from the road when I'm on a bike, especially in built up areas. I'm confident enough to know when I'm roughly doing the limit, but these cameras have no discretion - a few mph over and thats 3 poitns and £60 please. And when you have a camera every hundred metres it really does reduce your attention on the road.

Having said all that I've still managed to keep a clean license for the last 17 years, due partly to careful driving and healthy dose of luck

do you really have much to fear from forward facing cameras?

 

[matt100]

^ as an ex biker i agree it takes longer to check a bikes dials.
but we're talking about cars here.

yes but we're not talking about different laws are we?

 

[matt100]

yes but that goes back to my point about it being undefendable.

I agree, if I were on a bike the last thing I would be doing is looking down at the speedo and I guess if I were a copper i might take that into account.

The van/camera is just pass/pass/pass/fail/pass/fail all day...

 

[matt100]

Is it me or is matt100 the most arrogant, rude and aggresive person we've had bitching about getting nicked all year?

Just an observation, like.

crikey thats a bit strong don't you think? I've seen people arguing much more than this, there was a whole thread of someone with an orange beemer trying to actually get off rather than delay some points.

I'm a bit off with people derailing the thread but I certainly didn't kick off as arrogant or rude which are both accusations that can be more than levelled at yourself on a routine basis.

chill out!

 

[matt100]

Er are you talking about the Poole side of the A31 around Wimborne or the Ringwood St Leonards side heading into ferndown where they dropped the limit to 50 not so long ago?

Either way if your local ish and know the roads then they are well known Speed Camera Van sites in case you didn't know

Bad luck really, probably nothing you can do but add to the statistics in the Echo article

exactly there yes

 

[matt100]

Exactly where, Poole side or Ringwood side? I live in Ringwood and it's truly ridiculous that they've dropped that road to a 50.

Right, ferndown, poole side going towards poole, hotel and car garage on your left, about halfway down in a bus stop.

Is it as truely ridiculous as the A35 between Ringwood and Dorchester which for 5 miles of open country is... a 40?

no, doesn't sound as ridiculous as that but if you know the area I fail to see why the A31 past ringwood is NSL and then when all the houses etc die down a bit it drops to 50mph.

The WORST bit I just read was that this camera was a "complaint" one, 15% of the time dorset camera safety partnership is able to place cameras at areas NOT highlighted by collisions/deaths but where someone (an anon someone) has complained about speeding motorists.

Which is great, there isn't even a pretext here of saving lives which makes me feel much warmth inside.

 

[matt100]

yeah sorry, going towards macdonalds.

and like I said, in my ST if I felt like it I would have been doing a LOT more than 65mph

 

[matt100]

It's true, you can keep a clean license and still have fun. Any one who has met me and driven with me, or been a passenger knows this.

I am a super careful driver, especially in terms of speed limits for 30 and 40 roads, which I follow closely. The rest though I do tend to vary and go over the speed limit.

It is also possible to have an ST, and not pick up any points in the car, my license is clean, and has been for 6 years, I've never been stopped, pulled over or caught speeding once.

A lot of that I put down to good perception of the road.

I agree on the car, I wouldn't ever try and blame a ticket on the motor. I think I would have been doing that speed in any car within reason. In fact the 6 I already have were in the slowest car I've owned for years which was a 1.8 astra.

I'm also happy to completely accept that I wasn't paying attention to the speed limit, I was driving at a speed that i thought was safe for the conditions and road and that I honestly believe I wouldn't get done for which I guess is ironic.

I was in full on NSL mode assuming the road to be just as it is for the 20 odd miles all the way back to my house which is so so frustrating, hence me trying to just put off the inevitable for a while.

Allegedly there is some ruling on friday in the european court of human rights which might make the whole right to silence argument flare up again which can only be a good thing if it encourages the police to get back on the road.

For the record the van was operated by the dorset safety camera partnership which is entirely seperate from the police which just makes it more irritating because if I'd just nicked my car and was driving under the limit I could have just sailed past with no one any the wiser, if it was a police car it would have set off all the bells inside the car with the VASCAR stuff.

 

[matt100]

I would because until I'm convicted my licence is clean so i don't have to tell my insurance and I can't be banned for totting up (although I'm already driving like a saint).

For example if I hung it out for 6 months (highly unlikely) then the points are added retrospectively then thats a 6th of the term that has been served almost "on bail".