Forza 3?

PGR 4 is the best racing game on a next gen console, it eats up the competition, cars and bike and the track and weather system, its an arcade but it puts Forza 2 and GT5p to bed.
 
I just dont think Sim Bin on their first every foray onto consoles with this kind of product will surpass the best already on the platform. I will say again it wont be as simulated like the PC titles are, the console market is different and to even make a racing game on a console like the PC title would if anything harm its sales imo.

As for X360 FM2 didnt come close to using its full potential as "Che" stated back last year. Expect FM3 to be graphically a lot better. If it improved over PGR4 id be happy with that.

I dont expect GT5 to be a "SIM" like the PC neither but i dont see much wrong with the overall handling, what matters is creating a fun game that requires a certain amount of technical skill and driving ability. G25 is also a lot more enjoyable to use than the X360 wheel and hench why i dont play X360 racing games anymore or if its multiplatform id go for the PS3 version. Additionally having a racing frame and trying to change wheels isnt a easy task (over 20 mins) so having a dual format wheel would be nice..
 
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Demon said:
I'm wasn't referring to that..

Here's the thread on Logitech forums.. the messages have been edited, but are still an indication that they are possibly working on something for the 360..

http://forums.logitech.com/logitech/board/message?board.id=steering_wheels&thread.id=2294

I appreciate that it may be wishful thinking, but if Fanatec can do it, I'd imagine logitech could if they wished..

:)
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Had a read over it thanks.
The Turbo S wheel from Fannatec does everything the people their are asking for. Its available NOW.

pwtspurehauptbildah5.jpg


Okay this costs £180 but is wireless with backlighting and although the pedals arnt to G25 quality the G25 pedals can be used. Alternatively you can buy the soon to be released Clubsport pedals (costing £200) These are much like pro pedals with a lot of adjustment and very solid. (search you tube)

porsche911gt3rs07lm3.jpg


See here for a thread concerning this wheel issue and discussions on cockpits.
 
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I play FM2 and GT5 and both are great. Ive only played GT5 in SD so Im unbiased but its got decent handling, F40 is my favourite for being challenging but its still too tame probably (I wouldnt know :p)

FM2 is the longer term game I think though neither of them are proper driving sims


Im glad I kept my 360 now, I'll get this at some point. Hopefully they didnt abandon the main focus of the game on driving detail
 
DreXeL said:
See, I totally disagree. GT5's physics feel 'scripted', as if they are being called up from a database rather than being calculated in real-time. Forza's physics on the other hand feel 'organic', you just feel a lot more connected. Niether come close to PC sims in terms of realism but Forza is closer than GT.

As for Race Pro, being from from developers of proper PC sims (Simbin) I had high hopes, but towards then end of last year I saw it running at a car show I attended and visually it was a big let down with grainy, muddy graphics and a framerate that constantly appeared to dip below 20fps. Hopefully it has been improved since then though, and hopefully Simbin haven't dumbed-down the physics for the consoles.
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In all honesty, you can't judge a "finished" game from an early beta test code. The code you're referring to was the same code which was handed out to various media, including US, when we got the latest version in the second week of this year, there weasa huge jump forward in comparison, and there's still another version heading our way next week (Aust) for MP testing.

I've played the last version on my debug unit here, (it's sitting in the lounge room right now) and it a proper sim. Many 'console' gamers will not like it, as they prefer a much less challenging style of racing, even Forza 2 is a little too close for comfort for 'most' console gamers.

I have over 400 hours up in PGR3, (don't like PGR4, just didn't cut the mustard in my book( and almost 300 hours in Forza 2 and customized over 200 cars (you can check my flickr pages out from the site if you like), and having played both early beta, and middle road code of Race Pro, I can see this game sitting in the 360 tray for some time, in between bouts of Far Cry 2 of course.

I fear Race Pro will not get the support it needs for success on the console, as it does not have the HUGE $$$$ backing and promotional push MS has on Forza. Forza 3's PR push will be bigger that Forza 2's (we're involved in some of it here in Australia when it starts in a few months) so I know the level of push they will be putting behind it.

But Race Pro just doesn't have the capital to muster what MS can throw at a game such as this - sadly. It's a bloody great game (Race Pro) and any lover of sims will find it enjoyable. There's plenty of tweaking possible, the damage modeling was tuned down on our code, and only certain cars/tracks available, but a huge % of it was there.

You could see there's still work to be done, and that would have been code senyt out late last year, and the code you prob saw was earlier code.

Most printed media's reviews are also based on the earlier code, as they have a huge 6 week lead in time for print (from deadline for copy to falling on the shelves at stores) so you can see the code they'd review would also be quite old.

That's the problem with printed media reviews, they are usually quite dated compared to fresh code . . .

We'll be adding more news on the game and now have a huge image bank from the game, and will add more vids as well, including user-created ones when it is released.

Give it a chance, SimBin need it to prove that it can drop a PC style game on a console and make it work just as effectively, you won't be dissapointed, especially if you come at it from a new perspective.

Cheers . . .
 
Ineresting read, who do you work for? :)

Good to read that it has improved since I saw that early beta, it was just so rough around the edges that I knew it would be much improved upon. Good to hear SimBin are sticking to their guns and bringing a 'proper' sim to the consoles, if it has improved as much as you say then I'm really looking forward to it :cool:
 
DreXeL said:
Ineresting read, who do you work for? :)

Good to read that it has improved since I saw that early beta, it was just so rough around the edges that I knew it would be much improved upon. Good to hear SimBin are sticking to their guns and bringing a 'proper' sim to the consoles, if it has improved as much as you say then I'm really looking forward to it :cool:
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DOn't work for anyone mate, just myself and run a Xbox Community Site here in Australia. We have around 8 ppl working on the site (all unpaid and no income from the site either). But we do have a Xbox 360 Debug unit, which allows us to preview pre-release code taht can ONLY be played on a debug unit.

Retail preview code that is sent out to reviewers is usually as it would be when finished and even has the packaging etc, but the sleeve is fainter than the proper item, and has NOT FOR SALE across it etc.

Most early code sent out is Beta or Debug code, so it wil have bugs, issues, glitches and the like throughout the game. God, if I wrote a review on the actual early code we got, the game would get an extremely low rating due to bugs. But that is what the code is for.

So end users such as previewers in different areas, and doing things totally different, can let the dev/pub know what is happening, and they can add it to the list of items to fix before release.

Unfortunately, due to the massive explosion of the online world such as XboxLIVE which happened in late 2005, the possibility of more bugs, errors and glitches has increased 100 fold. As the number of gamers has increased that much with the advent of LIVE (incl PSN and Wii network etc).

Race Pro will not be "perfect" . .no game will be, and it will have issues that will show up for some players, that's a given in any game. Plus they do have to cut back on certain areas in order for it to be accessible to the demographic they are aimoimg at. But at the same time, not make it so simple that it becomes something completely different to their normal games.

Sure, it will also have thinngs some like, and some dislike, I hate the menue layout and the look of it. But that does not make it a bad game. SO those reviewers that diss a game based on the menus are not real reviewers, but simply nit-pickers looking for faults in any game.

The game should be reviewed based on how it plays, the enjoyment gained, andthe pleasure attained in playing it. Race Pros career mode and also Championship mode will keep most players happy for a few hundred hours if played to the letter.

However, I can see many 'console' gamers will just bypass the some what gruelling Career and champion modes and jump straight into LIVE and then complain the game is to hard . . . and try and cause accidents and crashes. It's what they do. Try playing a proper game of Forza 2 or PGR . . .or even DRIVE for that matter. It can be almost impossible unless you play with a group of "friends" or are involved with a racing group.

It's the sad thing about console gaming - unfortunately. It seems to bring the idiot out in ppl somehow.
 
forza 3 ? wow cant wait.
this will probably be the best racing sim on any platform....fingers crossed for this one
 
Marcos said:
If Forza 2 was on PS3 i'd be hooked on, but i hate playing it on xbox controller

is Forza 3 due on PS3?
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yup they going to do a deal.

gran turismo 5 is coming to the xbox
forza 3 is coming to the ps3
pacman is coming to the nintendo wii
 
Marcos said:
If Forza 2 was on PS3 i'd be hooked on, but i hate playing it on xbox controller

is Forza 3 due on PS3?
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Having had an ergonomist for a partner for some time, you get to learn about such things as 'relaxed hand positioning', "right and left thumb juxtapositioning" and many other useless bits of information - until of course you see it in action and go . . .""ahhhh I see now". :confused:

Just as an exercise, anyone can try this at home and you won't casue accidents or world disasters . . . and it's okay to do it in front of the kiddies as well, but - warning, it could make you feel nausious.

Sit relaxed in a chair, preferably a lounge chair, not so you sink into it, but just relaxed and sitting properly,

Place your 'relaxed' hands in your lap with your forearms just resting on your legs as if relaxing, slowly bring your hands together but not quite touching . . .

Allow your fingers to 'curl in slightly so they 'could touch' as you bring them together . . .

not trying to clasp your hands or do anything, just relaxed, open but curled hands with the fingers touching as your arms relax on your legs . . . . roll the hand up so that the two palms (hands) are facing each other . . . . notice anything yet?

If you've done it 'correctly, and not "TRIED" to force them or do anything, just notice when your right and left thumb are . . . .

The left is forward of the right, which is back from the 'center line' - so that if you draw a line "ACROSS" the two hands in the middle of them (from left to right) - the right thumb would be "just' touching the mid-line, and the left thumb would be forward of it.

They are Diagonally opposed . . .

Notice how the hands curve and form a hollow for two longish, but wide and none cylindrical items to slip in so that the hands need not 'clench' the handles . . .

Now go and grab a Playstation controller . . . try doing the same thing by holding the controller . . . You'll find you'll have to actually flex the left thumb back, thereby inducing muscle movement and tension to 'hold' it in position from the "relaxed natural position" . . Notice the right thumb has to come back as well. And the the wrist have to bend slightly from the 'relaxed position'.

Yes, boring I know, but the thing is, if you have a 360 controller handy, do the relaxed hands things again, then gently put the 360 controller in your hands while 'relaxed' . . . . note where the right and left thumbsticks are . . .

Note how the legs of the controller are not round, or straight, but actually "fill" the void in the open space of the two palms . . .

Having an ergonomist for a partner has its benefits . . . . you learn WHY things are made the way they are, and why things that are made simply to work, but are not "designed" with the human body in mind, generally cause problems for some. I learnt this from a lecture she had to give to form design students at Uni, where design must accompany ergonomic patterns in order for products to work correctly and as desired/designed

As a sweetner, just try placing your relaxed hands together and see which thumb sits on top when you lock your fingers together . . .

Now do it again but this time, make sure the opposite thumb lands on top- feels odd doesn't it, even sickly for some. That's because they are not 'designed' to do it that way, our right and left hand side of our bodies are different to each other in order for us to do what we do.

Plus we'd look real strange if both side looked and were identical. Even one arm is loinger than the other, as are your legs, etc etc etc.

Let me know how you go with the little test . . Thanks for the paitence and enjoy the day.
 
Totally explains why 360 controllers feel so 'right' and comfortable, and why PS3 controllers make my hands hurt after a short while :cool:
 
XboxOZ360 said:
Having had an ergonomist for a partner for some time, you get to learn about such things as 'relaxed hand positioning', "right and left thumb juxtapositioning" and many other useless bits of information - until of course you see it in action and go . . .""ahhhh I see now". :confused:

Just as an exercise, anyone can try this at home and you won't casue accidents or world disasters . . . and it's okay to do it in front of the kiddies as well, but - warning, it could make you feel nausious.

Sit relaxed in a chair, preferably a lounge chair, not so you sink into it, but just relaxed and sitting properly,

Place your 'relaxed' hands in your lap with your forearms just resting on your legs as if relaxing, slowly bring your hands together but not quite touching . . .

Allow your fingers to 'curl in slightly so they 'could touch' as you bring them together . . .

not trying to clasp your hands or do anything, just relaxed, open but curled hands with the fingers touching as your arms relax on your legs . . . . roll the hand up so that the two palms (hands) are facing each other . . . . notice anything yet?

If you've done it 'correctly, and not "TRIED" to force them or do anything, just notice when your right and left thumb are . . . .

The left is forward of the right, which is back from the 'center line' - so that if you draw a line "ACROSS" the two hands in the middle of them (from left to right) - the right thumb would be "just' touching the mid-line, and the left thumb would be forward of it.

They are Diagonally opposed . . .

Notice how the hands curve and form a hollow for two longish, but wide and none cylindrical items to slip in so that the hands need not 'clench' the handles . . .

Now go and grab a Playstation controller . . . try doing the same thing by holding the controller . . . You'll find you'll have to actually flex the left thumb back, thereby inducing muscle movement and tension to 'hold' it in position from the "relaxed natural position" . . Notice the right thumb has to come back as well. And the the wrist have to bend slightly from the 'relaxed position'.

Yes, boring I know, but the thing is, if you have a 360 controller handy, do the relaxed hands things again, then gently put the 360 controller in your hands while 'relaxed' . . . . note where the right and left thumbsticks are . . .

Note how the legs of the controller are not round, or straight, but actually "fill" the void in the open space of the two palms . . .

Having an ergonomist for a partner has its benefits . . . . you learn WHY things are made the way they are, and why things that are made simply to work, but are not "designed" with the human body in mind, generally cause problems for some. I learnt this from a lecture she had to give to form design students at Uni, where design must accompany ergonomic patterns in order for products to work correctly and as desired/designed

As a sweetner, just try placing your relaxed hands together and see which thumb sits on top when you lock your fingers together . . .

Now do it again but this time, make sure the opposite thumb lands on top- feels odd doesn't it, even sickly for some. That's because they are not 'designed' to do it that way, our right and left hand side of our bodies are different to each other in order for us to do what we do.

Plus we'd look real strange if both side looked and were identical. Even one arm is loinger than the other, as are your legs, etc etc etc.

Let me know how you go with the little test . . Thanks for the paitence and enjoy the day.
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thats really interesting, but i use the pressure sensitive X and Square and the D-pad on racing games. I get on well with pressure-sensitive analog controls.

I agree, the PS3 pad's analog stick placement isnt fantastic
 
Currently playing a hell of a lot of Forza 2, started the other day and am just making my way through all the race (although not started the endurance ones yet, they dont look fun aka 45 laps :eek:) but it is most definitely the best racing game i have played
 
I agree with that ergonomics argument, in time it affects your accuracy and quickness to tire. Thats why I dont like large keyboards make great for great gaming on pc as your arms should not be too far apart


The thing I do like about the ps3 pad is the trigger buttons, I prefer them over the 360 I think but neither are as good as the ds controller triggers which had the longest most accurate travel
 
Dreadi said:
Currently playing a hell of a lot of Forza 2, started the other day and am just making my way through all the race (although not started the endurance ones yet, they dont look fun aka 45 laps :eek:) but it is most definitely the best racing game i have played
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There is one Enduro that sucks to all high heaven . . .and I mean "seriously sucks".

That being the 2 lap or "The RIng" in the Ford GT40 and the Ferrari P??. Youcan only alter the tyre pressure, and that is IT. as they are in the Original enduro race, it's the second or 3 from the end of the enduro races.

They bother are exceptionally fast cars, but - they handle like wet soggy paper at high speed on The Ring. The trick is, drop the tyre pressure down, and run a few long races to find out the set pressure that when heated, reaches around optimum heat range and effectiveness. Use the tyre heat indicator for finding this out which can be popped up using the "D" pad.

Then, try to get in front before the first entrance to the first bend approaching the pit,, take that one slow, otherwise you'll come to grief quick smart.

Once ahead, do NOT go flat oiut, but stay just ahead of the AI behind you, and even on the lowest AI setting, he'll try and pass you no matter what.

If he does, then stay on his tail but back about 2 car lengths, this wil help being dragged, and you'll see him brake on blind corners or rises etc, saving you from overdoing it, then, if you're close enough to him at the end and approaching the last left and then right into the home straight, get up-close-and-personal, and over take him pronoto.

You'll then pass him on the main final straight - ideally. But get used to coming to grief a lot, because you will, as will you in the Ford Cobra in the "Original" race series. It's exceptionally powerful, but unless you do a few suspension mods, it's power outweighs it's tractability.

Check out my Flickr page for some paint ideas, the cobra is on page 2 or 3 I think, and check out the TVR Speed 12 Resident Evil 5 paint job. http://www.flickr.com/photos/9119347@N07/ You might want to checkout the other pages, as the Lexus 360 Police one is great, as is the Ambulance Chaser and the early American Muscle cars with old-skool paint jobs. I used to do custom Paintwork in my 'earlier' years on Van, chopper and Street Machines, it was fun.
 
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