Frame Rating: High End GPUs Benchmarked at 4K Resolutions

[spoffle]

The technology exists to scale up mobile displays to PC monitor sizing, it's just very low yield and not cost effective.

That's not why. It's about supply and demand. There isn't a demand so that's why it's not cost effective.

Again, it's absolutely stupid to compare a mobile display to a PC monitor shouting "LOOK 4K WILL BE AWESOMES!!!"

Herp derp. I never said that. I'm pointing out that 4K is nothing special, there's loads of room left before the rule of diminishing returns comes in to action. 4K on a 27" display really isn't high resolution.

I cannot be bothered to engage with you any more. 4K will not be mainstream for gaming, end of. Feel free to argue with yourself however.

No not end of, why do you think you are some sort of authority?

I've asked you this straight question plenty of times now, why will monitor displays stay at 1080P forever?

Why don't 4K gaming become mainstream? When 4K displays on PCs become mainstream, 4K gaming on PCs will become mainstream.

When 8K TVs are out and mainstream are PC gamers still going to be gaming at 1080P as the mainstream?

Can you not answer a direct question? I don't even know why you think you know what you're talking about.

 

[spoffle]

you mean Display resolution. Resolution itself is an ambiguous word and has different meaning dependent on how it's applied. IE, resolution can be given in DPI / PPI measurements. 'The display has a resolution of 441PPI', for example.

So you're all right. Or wrong. You decide.



Not sure how you can say that without using some context. Ie, the size of this imaginary 4k display would be a start

Read through my posts, I'm talking about on a 27" display.

 

[Ksanti]

That's not why. It's about supply and demand. There isn't a demand so that's why it's not cost effective.

It's a mixture of the two.

The higher PPI mobile displays are already fairly low yield with massive demand for them. Nobody wants to scale them up because it would become stupidly low yield (as the failure probability increases exponentially as you effectively stick each extra screen together) for very little incentive. Mobile phones are a much bigger arena and if you can sell phone screens, you sell phone screens - scaling up to a deficient demand market like 4k monitors wouldn't give you anything like the profit margins of phone screens, and on top of that you have the stupidly low yields to contend with.

Accounting for the yields, getting a 4K panel at the moment would likely need to cost £1200 or so before, with tech as it stands, companies are duly incentivised to pull those resources away from mobile phones.

 

[spoffle]

It's a mixture of the two.

The higher PPI mobile displays are already fairly low yield with massive demand for them. Nobody wants to scale them up because it would become stupidly low yield (as the failure probability increases exponentially as you effectively stick each extra screen together) for very little incentive. Mobile phones are a much bigger arena and if you can sell phone screens, you sell phone screens - scaling up to a deficient demand market like 4k monitors wouldn't give you anything like the profit margins of phone screens, and on top of that you have the stupidly low yields to contend with.

Accounting for the yields, getting a 4K panel at the moment would likely need to cost £1200 or so before, with tech as it stands, companies are duly incentivised to pull those resources away from mobile phones.

4K itself isn't really a great increase over say a 27" 2560x1440 monitor though.

£1200 is based on the extremely high prices of the displays sold in the UK, rather than actual panel prices and production costs.

27" 2560x1440 monitors in Korea for example are <£150 do you really believe production costs would go up significantly by reducing the pixel size by around 30%?

Not at all, Samsung are already producing 13" 2560x1600 displays for Apple.

Yields are an issue, but it's more to do with demand, but this is the one thing I think Apple does well, it produces demand for things because it basically tells people what they want.

Pre and post Apple's "retina" display on their phones and tablets is very telling of that. The prices didn't go up despite pixel density going up significantly between 1024x768 and 2048x1536 on Apple's tablets.

And since then, loads of tablets have been getting much better screens. Nexus 10s with their 2560x1600 displays, and even some of those cheap Chinese tablets that use the same IPS displays as Apple's iPads, and then the tablets selling for about £150-180.

 

[james.miller]

Read through my posts, I'm talking about on a 27" display.

I tried, but the hyperbole made my head hurt.

 

[spoffle]

I tried, but the hyperbole made my head hurt.

What hyperbole?

Sin_chase is talking crap by saying 4K will "never" be mainstream for games, can you not see that he's (for some weird reason) suggesting that games will never go over 1080P for the mainstream?

Maybe you're confusing his posts with my own.

 

[james.miller]

What hyperbole?

Sin_chase is talking crap by saying 4K will "never" be mainstream for games, can you not see that he's (for some weird reason) suggesting that games will never go over 1080P for the mainstream?

Maybe you're confusing his posts with my own.

I'm not even reading SC's, everybody knows what he's like.

There's two very different statements there

* 4k will never be mainstream
* games will never 'go over 1080p for the mainstream'

both wrong, probably. But the reality is we are years away from achieving either. Just to make it clear, we are talking about 4k becoming the norm, yes?

It's years away. whilst we keep going around in this circle of more powerful cards arriving and more power-hungry software being created, that milestone of 4k becoming the norm seems to be getting further and further away. Seriously, unless something drastic happens and gpu power increases 10 fold then gpu's are always going to be too-far behind the curve to make 4k a consideration for anyone other than the dirty filthy rich, lol.

 

[spoffle]

I'm not even reading SC's, everybody knows what he's like.

There's two very different statements there

* 4k will never be mainstream
* games will never 'go over 1080p for the mainstream'

both wrong, probably. But the reality is we are years away from achieving either. Just to make it clear, we are talking about 4k becoming the norm, yes?

It's years away. whilst we keep going around in this circle of more powerful cards arriving and more power-hungry software being created, that milestone of 4k becoming the norm seems to be getting further and further away. Seriously, unless something drastic happens and gpu power increases 10 fold then gpu's are always going to be too-far behind the curve to make 4k a consideration for anyone other than the dirty filthy rich, lol.

Well that was the point, I've been asking him that, and he seems unable to answer a direct question.

Surely "1080P is mainstream for gaming, but 4K will never be mainstream for gaming" is him suggesting that mainstream gaming won't go above 1080P?

I pointed out before that resolutions above 1080P have been available for use for the last 15 years, and for more than 10 years before 1080P could be considered mainstream.

I'm not suggesting that 4K will become mainstream in a matter of years, I'm contesting the frankly ridiuclous notion that it will never become mainstream.

The guy's talking smack and crap and getting things wrong while saying I'm talking crap.

Also, I wouldn't really say that games are becoming more demanding, they've stagnated for the last few years, so graphics cards have been getting faster and faster whilst the requirements for games haven't really been going up unless you have multiple monitors, or a 3D set up or even both.

I have actually tested it out though, and even an oldish card like a 6950 would be able to play its fair share of decent looking games at 4K (I tested some games out on a single 6950 at 7680x1440 and a load of them were playable on max settings).

 

[Gregster]

Well that was the point, I've been asking him that, and he seems unable to answer a direct question.

Surely "1080P is mainstream for gaming, but 4K will never be mainstream for gaming" is him suggesting that mainstream gaming won't go above 1080P?

I pointed out before that resolutions above 1080P have been available for use for the last 15 years, and for more than 10 years before 1080P could be considered mainstream.

I'm not suggesting that 4K will become mainstream in a matter of years, I'm contesting the frankly ridiuclous notion that it will never become mainstream.

The guy's talking smack and crap and getting things wrong while saying I'm talking crap.

Also, I wouldn't really say that games are becoming more demanding, they've stagnated for the last few years, so graphics cards have been getting faster and faster whilst the requirements for games haven't really been going up unless you have multiple monitors, or a 3D set up or even both.

I have actually tested it out though, and even an oldish card like a 6950 would be able to play its fair share of decent looking games at 4K (I tested some games out on a single 6950 at 7680x1440 and a load of them were playable on max settings).

You get all excited and make a point of your opinion is all that counts and anyone who disagrees is talking smack! You need to chill out a little and respect others opinions, regardless if you think they are right or wrong.

You hit a point which I agree/disagree with in 'games are not more demanding'. I could point out that tech can't keep up like it used to. Crysis 3 with all bells and whistles will bring any GPU to its knees. I understand what you are saying and a valid point but if I use the same logic you did with Sin Chase, you are wrong. He said "I will happily call it now, 4K will be a niche market for gaming. It will never be mainstream for such use" Regardless if he is right or wrong, that is his opinion and you have your opinion on putting your point across but does it need to be done so arrogantly? I asked you this before, "would you talk to people the way you type to people?" I certainly hope not, as I could imagine a few black eyes or lots of alone time.

Forums are great for discussion but reel in the insults and keep it friendly.