Go or hold-off?

Roduga · 25 Feb 2006 at 17:29

Seeing as my PC isn't going to do any justice to games coming up, I'm curious on whether it's worth upgrading now or waiting a few months?

Is there anything 'on the way' I should wait for?

gamesaregood · 25 Feb 2006 at 17:33

AM2 with DDR2
7900
Vista OS

Depends what you have at mo IMO

Roduga · 25 Feb 2006 at 18:15

gamesaregood said:
AM2 with DDR2
7900
Vista OS

Depends what you have at mo IMO

P4 3GHz Northwood
1GB RAM
ATI 9800 Pro

I want to avoid doing a half-upgrade. All or nothing. This is for a few games arriving in a month or two.

ACESHIGH · 25 Feb 2006 at 21:29

Sounds like its time to upgrade.

Go for something like ...
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 3800+ (Socket 939) - Retail (ADA3800BVBOX) (CP-134-AM)
Asus A8R32-MVP Deluxe Crossfire (Socket 939) PCI-Express Motherboard (MB-131-AS)
Connect3D ATI Radeon X1800 XT 256MB GDDR3 AVIVO TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) - Retail (GX-044-CO)
GeIL 2GB (2x1GB) PC3200 Value Dual Channel Kit CAS3 (GE2GB3200BDC) (MY-046-GL)

Xplo · 25 Feb 2006 at 21:45

Hold out

thats still good enough to play 1024*768 ATLEAST, with decent effects no AA of course. Im holding out on XP2600 512 and 9700Pro

Roduga · 25 Feb 2006 at 21:54

Xplo said:
Hold out thats still good enough to play 1024*768 ATLEAST, with decent effects no AA of course. Im holding out on XP2600 512 and 9700Pro

Yeap, that's what I do now. When Oblivion comes out it will make me cry though.

Roduga · 25 Feb 2006 at 21:55

ACESHIGH said:
Sounds like its time to upgrade.

Go for something like ...
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 3800+ (Socket 939) - Retail (ADA3800BVBOX) (CP-134-AM)
Asus A8R32-MVP Deluxe Crossfire (Socket 939) PCI-Express Motherboard (MB-131-AS)
Connect3D ATI Radeon X1800 XT 256MB GDDR3 AVIVO TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) - Retail (GX-044-CO)
GeIL 2GB (2x1GB) PC3200 Value Dual Channel Kit CAS3 (GE2GB3200BDC) (MY-046-GL)

Sounds good. However, I'm getting a sizeable bonus in a few days, plus a few hundred squid I've saved already. Permission to up that a bit?

Explicit · 25 Feb 2006 at 22:03

Roduga said:
Sounds good. However, I'm getting a sizeable bonus in a few days, plus a few hundred squid I've saved already. Permission to up that a bit?

Invest the money in a high-interest bank account, wait until AM2 comes out with DDR2 support and build yourself a killer rig. It's hard to hold back, but it always pays off in the end. Just 4 months, that's all.

Roduga · 25 Feb 2006 at 23:26

Explicit said:
Invest the money in a high-interest bank account, wait until AM2 comes out with DDR2 support and build yourself a killer rig. It's hard to hold back, but it always pays off in the end. Just 4 months, that's all.

Is it really worth the wait just for AM2/DDR2?

Explicit · 25 Feb 2006 at 23:39

Roduga said:
Is it really worth the wait just for AM2/DDR2?

That's a question of hot debate. In my opinion it is worth the wait because AMD will be basing their future processors on the AM2 socket, giving you a better chance to upgrade next year (should you need to). Also, DDR2-800 will be coming out around the same time as AM2, so it seems wise to wait instead of spending the best part of £1000 on technology that will be out-of-date in just 4 months time.

Roduga · 26 Feb 2006 at 00:50

Explicit said:
That's a question of hot debate. In my opinion it is worth the wait because AMD will be basing their future processors on the AM2 socket, giving you a better chance to upgrade next year (should you need to). Also, DDR2-800 will be coming out around the same time as AM2, so it seems wise to wait instead of spending the best part of £1000 on technology that will be out-of-date in just 4 months time.

I've read a lot of, well, not bad but not great reviews on the AM2 stuff. Hence, I'd like more input from people.

Monstermunch · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:00

Roduga said:
Seeing as my PC isn't going to do any justice to games coming up, I'm curious on whether it's worth upgrading now or waiting a few months?

Is there anything 'on the way' I should wait for?

There's always something on the way! But look at it this way, prices for the skt 939's have already started to drop (quite a lot since xmas). AM2 will offer some improvements but IMO only minor ones like the DDR2 support.

DDR2 ram is still not really any better than something like the top of the range Mushkin or OCZ std DDR ram, some people would say it's considerably worse.

The other thing to consider is that when AM2 is released it will take several months for them to perfect it and that will probably take us well into 2007.

As far as gfx cards go IMO they're releasing new chipsets so often you're better off going for something like the x1800xt 512mb atm and just upgrading and selling your it in 6-12 months or whenever needed.

Explicit · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:01

Roduga said:
I've read a lot of, well, not bad but not great reviews on the AM2 stuff. Hence, I'd like more input from people.

Honestly ask yourself whether you can manage with your current rig for merely four more months. If the answer is yes, you would be wiser in waiting.
No doubt, it is hard to hold back when you see everyone else running bleedin' edge rigs, but you'll have the last laugh come June.

Monstermunch · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:05

Explicit said:
That's a question of hot debate. In my opinion it is worth the wait because AMD will be basing their future processors on the AM2 socket, giving you a better chance to upgrade next year (should you need to). Also, DDR2-800 will be coming out around the same time as AM2, so it seems wise to wait instead of spending the best part of £1000 on technology that will be out-of-date in just 4 months time.

Some of this may be true but here are some things to consider:

1. AM2 isn't here yet, and it was already supposed to be (according to the original release date stated by AMD when announced)

2. When it does arrive MOBO manufacturers will take at least 6 months to perfect it's usage.

3. DDR2 ram is not all it's cracked up to be and certainly not perfected yet, most people would say that a good std DDR ram will out perform it. (timings/latency is pretty rubbish)

4. All things considered if I was waiting for a good AM2 system that utilised the 800mhz and was stable and working well, I would take an educated guess and say that it will arrive mid 2007ish

Monstermunch · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:08

Explicit said:
Honestly ask yourself whether you can manage with your current rig for merely four more months. If the answer is yes, you would be wiser in waiting.
No doubt, it is hard to hold back when you see everyone else running bleedin' edge rigs, but you'll have the last laugh come June.

No you won't, you'll be kicking yourself and swearing cos it's not working correctly, as with all new tech. Plus there will be very few other people aound with the new tech who could help you.

Also, look at my sig. I'm running HL2, FEAR, Far Cry etc with my rig and it's not as good as you've already got. I'll be upgrading in around 4 weeks to skt 939 rig and will not regret it.

Explicit · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:18

Monstermunch said:
No you won't, you'll be kicking yourself and swearing cos it's not working correctly, as with all new tech. Plus there will be very few other people aound with the new tech who could help you.

Here we go, the hot debate officially commences.

You say it won't work correctly, but there is no evidence to back your claim. If you read that THG AM2 Rig review, you'll notice how he commented on it being as stable as S939. DDR2 has been around for Intel chips so memory manufacturers really wont be doing anything drastic. Same applies to Intel DDR2 mobo manufacturers. The only real change is support for AMD processors.

Calling something a "flop" before it is even here seems irrational to me.

Boah · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:20

The main reason I see for holding off is if you're looking for a better future upgrade path than if you went for a system right now (true for both AMD and Intel, I presume, with Conroe coming). I do think that the initial benefits of the AM2 platform will be negligible and possibly not noticeable, as it will take a while for things to 'settle down'.

If you get a bleeding edge system now it will last you for a while, and by the time you're ready to do another upgrade things will have sorted themselves out on the new platforms.

While the downside of a S939 system is the limited future upgrades of the CPU and possibly RAM, the upside is that it is a very mature platform. It will take a while for AM2 to reach the same level of maturity.

Generally my approach to the question of "now, or wait" is "now". There is always something on the horizon that makes you think it's worth waiting for. Get what's available now, and enjoy it until next time around. That's what I just did, anyway, so at least I followed my own advise

Roduga · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:24

Basically, next year I will be concentrating on other activities so this is my last upgrade for a while (I hope). As the first game on my list is out at the end of March, I think I shall 'go'. Even if AM2 works, I'm not sure it would be a big enough jump to wait for.

Guess I'll have to ponder on a spec then...

Monstermunch · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:32

Explicit said:
Here we go, the hot debate officially commences.

You say it won't work correctly, but there is no evidence to back your claim. If you read that THG AM2 Rig review, you'll notice how he commented on it being as stable as S939. DDR2 has been around for Intel chips so memory manufacturers really wont be doing anything drastic. Same applies to Intel DDR2 mobo manufacturers. The only real change is support for AMD processors.

Calling something a "flop" before it is even here seems irrational to me.

No, look you've got me all wrong. I'm all for it and may go down that route next year, it's just that so many people are waiting for AM2, but there will be something else after that and so on. IMO if you need a new rig you need one, there is NO good time to buy.

As far as the DDR2 ram goes, I think you'll find that the timings are pretty rubbish compared to something like the Mushkin Redline DDR.

When AM2 arrives there WILL be teething problems that need ironing out from the motherboard perspective. All new tech IMO has teething problems and I would always advise people to wait and see, if only for a month to make sure no-one else has serious problems. Rushing out and buying the brand new tech as soon as it arrives on the shelf will be costly and troublesome.

Monstermunch · 26 Feb 2006 at 01:34

Boah said:
The main reason I see for holding off is if you're looking for a better future upgrade path than if you went for a system right now (true for both AMD and Intel, I presume, with Conroe coming). I do think that the initial benefits of the AM2 platform will negligible and possibly not noticeable, as it will take a while for things to 'settle down'.

If you get a bleeding edge system now it will last you for a while, and by the time you're ready to do another upgrade things will have sorted themselves out on the new platforms.

While the downside of a S939 system is the limited future upgrades of the CPU and possibly RAM, the upside is that it is a very mature platform. It will take a while for AM2 to reach the same level maturity.

Generally my approach to the question of "now, or wait" is "now". There is always something on the horizon that makes you think it's worth waiting. Get what's availalbe now, and enjoy it until next time around. That's what I just did, anyway, so at least I followed my own advise

Well said, exactly what I was trying to get across!