Greenlizard0 Premier League Football Thread ** spoilers ** [2nd - 4th April 2024]

Who exactly would united get as manager though.

Ten Hag was meant to be the man (Although he looks sounds completely out of touch, and the pushing for Anthony etc)

There's some talent in the team but some awful attitudes too

And some dead wood
 
Man Utd have conceded 225 shots in 2024. More than any other team in the top 5 European leagues!

Maybe ETH already knows he is buggered and simply doesn't care or he realised the defence is a complete shambles and he also doesn't really care.
 
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You can get a hybrid of Klopp and Pep in and it won’t make they much of a difference unless they can genetically modify the players.

Just look at the players they’re playing!
 
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Reuben klang said:
You can get a hybrid of Klopp and Pep in and it won’t make they much of a difference unless they can genetically modify the players.

Just look at the players they’re playing!
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Yes the team doesn't look good but compare it to Luton for example. They have scored more than you and generally only lose by a goal to the big teams while having at best a championship team. They manage that by playing as a team and with a plan. United's performances have been awful regardless of the players.
 
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fez said:
I mean, its partly because we barely have a functioning defence at the moment. Thank god we didn't get rid of Maguire eh. Currently we have Martinez, Lindelof, Varane, Evans, Shaw and Malacia all injured.

The very brief time that we had most/all of our first choice defence back we looked easily the best we had all season. That being said, Ten Hag is done. Top 4 is gone and I wouldn't be surprised to see us have a pretty sad end to the season. Fingers crossed the changes behind the scenes are putting us on the right path for the future.
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Of course injuries have played a part, but this is the case with most teams this season. There's also a question of whether this is down to training methods and that side of things? Possibly not, but I don't know.

What I do know is that despite the injury situation, there has to be some sort of tactical plan. The players should be drilled in doing the basics. The basics are very much non-existent at Man Utd under Ten Hag.

I am not absolving the players of blame either, they are not good - but this is not the team of a few years ago. This is a decent blend of young players in addition to ones ETH has chosen for the squad himself.

If you just look at how the team plays, they are just all over the place in every area, it is genuinely shocking. The midfield just disappears as there is no structure, the full backs don't know what to do. The centre backs are defending both high and deep and pressing at all the wrong moments. I actually do think most of them are making an effort for the manager, which further shows how poor his communication must be (or lack of).

Any manager with a brain would be drilling the team to be compact and organised, and using the likes of Garnacho to counter attack.

... and to top all of this, I actually think we've been quite fortunate in a lot of games this season, and our league position could be much worse. Oh, and I'd almost forgotten we were unceremoniously dumped out of our Champions League group, consisting of Galatasaray and Copenhagen, finishing bottom.

We're in the same old situation now where the club is in a black hole of despair, every game is joyless (the Liverpool cup game aside), the manager looks like he's waiting for the sack and the players are as annoying as ever.

The one positive is that I can't see a scenario where Sir's Jim Ratcliffe & Dave Brailsford, Omar Berrada and Dan Ashworth (via encrypted WhatsApp) are all sat watching this and being remotely happy about any of it. Big changes to come, hopefully for the better. If we didn't have INEOS running things and still had the Glazers, I'd be ready to give up.
 
I still want to give him some time under a proper structure. He's not doing well but no manager would here the way we've been run (the way Chelsea have collapsed since their takeover should show anyone that) If we sack him in the summer who do we get in that is better? In all likeliness if we didn't already have him we'd still be looking at ETH and you can be sure if we do sack him he'll go to another big club, wouldn't be surprised to see Barca or Bayern pick him up. We need a huge shakeup though, we need more defenders that can play a high line, a proper DM that isn't past his best, experienced attackers to share the load with the young talents we have. Our squad is just a mess right now, there is no balance in any area of the pitch.
 
CliffyG said:
Yes the team doesn't look good but compare it to Luton for example. They have scored more than you and generally only lose by a goal to the big teams while having at best a championship team. They manage that by playing as a team and with a plan. United's performances have been awful regardless of the players.
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Luton are going down unless teams get further points deductions.

United are right where they should be with the current crop of players. We need to stop kidding ourselves and comparing them to Liverpool, Arsenal and City. They’re years off them.

The only real outliner is they have the fourth highest wage bill so should be around fourth. This is mainly down to way over paying their players due to a combination of paying more for the player than market value and then having to pay them Man Utd wages.

If we take away the whole Man Utd aura of it and stick a different shirt on the players we’d all be saying decent enough season for this mob and they’ve got a good cup run as well.
 
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Robbo said:
The one positive is that I can't see a scenario where Sir's Jim Ratcliffe & Dave Brailsford, Omar Berrada and Dan Ashworth (via encrypted WhatsApp) are all sat watching this and being remotely happy about any of it. Big changes to come, hopefully for the better. If we didn't have INEOS running things and still had the Glazers, I'd be ready to give up.
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I take no pleasure in reminding you of this but I feel it's my duty to point out how terribly Ratcliffe has done at Nice. I just don't want you to get too disappointed next season when you've got Southgate in charge and still in 6th.
 
BaZ87 said:
I take no pleasure in reminding you of this but I feel it's my duty to point out how terribly Ratcliffe has done at Nice. I just don't want you to get too disappointed next season when you've got Southgate in charge and still in 6th.
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Thanks. We're so dire that Southgate is starting to sound like an upgrade... but no, please no.
 
People mock Southgate, (which still baffles me) Man U need a massive reset on culture first and foremost, you only have to listen to Ollie on the Overlap to know that. Culture is what drives most teams/businesses , England was in a proper mess after Neville and Roy left them. Southgate came along and changed all that, sure, his time is coming to an end at England but now the players seemingly enjoy going to England camps and results at major tournaments have far exceeded what we could dream of after Iceland.

For me Man U could do a lot worse than Southgate from that perspective, other seemingly world class managers have achieved little in the way of progress for Man U.
 
BaZ87 said:
I take no pleasure in reminding you of this but I feel it's my duty to point out how terribly Ratcliffe has done at Nice. I just don't want you to get too disappointed next season when you've got Southgate in charge and still in 6th.
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The difference (you would like to hope) is that United affords him the chance to appoint "best-in-class" with regard to the management side. We've seen an indication of that with the Barrada appointment and noise around Ashworth, Wilcox. That's a complete overhaul of the club's senior management with arguably some of the individuals with strong credentials. No-one thats proven is going to go to Nice.

The problem Ineos now face is how the manager measures up to "best in class" and the evidence this season is that he doesn't cut it and that another complete reset is required. Those fans clamouring for dressing room clear outs are likely to be disappointed due to the economics and contract situations. It's just the way football is these days. Southgate is likely to be attractive as he will be a free agent and therefore comes without a financial penalty but for me he doesn't qualify as elite. Realistically I think the best we can hope for is that there are some totemic exits that send a message to any player not on the bus. For me that means that we cash in on Rashford, Varane, Casemiro, Sancho, Greenwood and maybe even Fernandes. It means that next year is probably at best the same as 2024 but hopefully a better long term direction. This ain't a quick fix so United fans need to suck it up.
 
Southgate isn't a Premier League manager, he's not even a Championship level manager at club level. The man has completely ruined England which is amazing given the squad he's got, you could argue that he got us to a World Cup semi final and a Euros final, which yes he did...but the former, he pretty much had the easiest run to get there you could ask for, and the first half decent team he comes up against, he fluffs it big time and shows the tactical prowess of a boiled egg. The latter, again, home advantage against a fairly easy run in, including a washed and terrible German team, then again fluffs the final as he reacts so late in the game making changes, I'd not be surprised if he brings on an intended sub for that final in the first game of this tournament.

The man is truly awful and plays such negative football, rewards players for form 5 years ago as opposed to current form, and just generally shows no sign of being a good manager whatsoever.

He wears nice ties and is good with the media, he's a people pleaser and a yes man, only reason he's still in the job
 
Calpol said:
The difference (you would like to hope) is that United affords him the chance to appoint "best-in-class" with regard to the management side. We've seen an indication of that with the Barrada appointment and noise around Ashworth, Wilcox. That's a complete overhaul of the club's senior management with arguably some of the individuals with strong credentials. No-one thats proven is going to go to Nice.
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Everything is of course relative though so while Nice wouldn't have been able to attract "best in class" relative to a club of Utd's size, for the size of Nice and all bar PSG in Ligue 1, they could. I commented on this in response to somebody saying Ratcliffe valued patience the other week, under Ratcliffe Nice have had 6 managers in less than 5 years. It's fairly evident that whoever has been appointing managers at Nice and by extension Ineos & Ratcliffe haven't done a very good job.
 
Steedie said:
Southgate isn't a Premier League manager, he's not even a Championship level manager at club level. The man has completely ruined England which is amazing given the squad he's got, you could argue that he got us to a World Cup semi final and a Euros final, which yes he did...but the former, he pretty much had the easiest run to get there you could ask for, and the first half decent team he comes up against, he fluffs it big time and shows the tactical prowess of a boiled egg. The latter, again, home advantage against a fairly easy run in, including a washed and terrible German team, then again fluffs the final as he reacts so late in the game making changes, I'd not be surprised if he brings on an intended sub for that final in the first game of this tournament.

The man is truly awful and plays such negative football, rewards players for form 5 years ago as opposed to current form, and just generally shows no sign of being a good manager whatsoever.

He wears nice ties and is good with the media, he's a people pleaser and a yes man, only reason he's still in the job
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I'm going to come across as a Southgate apologist! I don't really see him as Man United manager but for balance I think your post is harsh.
He's arguably done a better job than any England manager since Sir Alf Ramsay. Only Capello has a higher win ratio. England have perpetually come up short for the last 60 years. A final and semi-final and the improvement in team culture has to be seen as some degree of success. His pragmatic style suits international football and arguably England are as consistent as any other side and he's taken them from world ranked 15 to consistently in the top 5.
Sure England have some decent players but they always have had, the problem is that they still lack an elite defensive setup and that will probably prevent a victory.

Anyway - the point being is that Southgate has more merit than a lot of potential ten Hag successors, at least on paper. However, I repeat I do not endorse him as Man U manager.
 
Saying Southgate has ruined England just ******* nonsense, we were dire before him and he's got the best results since we last won something. There are plenty of criticisms to aim at his playing style and squad selection but saying he's ruined us is nonsense.

Don't want him in the United chair though, plenty of successful international managers have flopped at club level, he has to go elsewhere and show he is capable first.
 
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Agreed. The irony surrounding the England squad these days is that the fans are as toxic as the red tops where perceived to be back in the day. The media's very much gone the other way now. The managerial position is more toxic now then it ever has been and Southgates had to take the brunt of that.

He's not perfect and I wouldn't want him managing my club. But this idea that he's the worst thing to happen to the England team during his tenure is hyperbolic twaddle.
 
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