Help me understand. Is my AVR working correctly?

Firegod

Firegod

Firegod

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Hi, I received my new AVR yesterday, the Marantz Cinema 60 DAB. It is to replace my aging Denon X2400H. Everything is very familiar as it is Marantz/Denon, and I ran through all the assisted setup at the start for my 5.0 setup. But compared to the Denon I appear to have literally no sound parameters to choose from.

If I use the TV and watch an HD channel, with my LG C3 set to output over eARC on "Auto", the Marantz lets me either select Stereo, Dolby Surround or Multi Channel Stereo. If I watch a non-HD channel, I get Stereo, DTS-X:Neural or Multi Channel Stereo.

When I had the Denon connected I had a myriad of options to choose from. And I'm pretty confident I remember seeing stuff like Dolby Digital+Dolby Surround, etc. I don't have any of that. With the X2400H, I used DTS-X:Neural for everything as I prefered it. It was louder and had more bass to the sound vs. Dolby.

Why does the Marantz not give me as many options? The amp assign was set to 7.1. I tried setting it back to the default which is 5.1+Zone2. Doesn't appear to make any difference. I checked the ohms were correct (8 ohm) as well. I plan to swap them back tomorrow and do some testing with some different source material (TV, Netflix,4K Blu-ray, etc). And compare notes.

The other thing I noticed is that, if I have the TV set to "Auto" or "Pass through" (no difference) for the audio when watching TV, the Marantz reports PCM (2/0/0). If I actually select "PCM", it is the same. Yet one gives me Dolby Surround and the other DTS-X. But the signal is always reported as PCM.

Finally, I watched Top Gun Maverik in 4k and I found the speech muffled and totally over powered by the effects and music. I've seen this film twice using the Denon and I don't remember that being an issue. Only difference being is that the Marantz said it was playing back in Dolby Atmos, which the X2400H can't do.

Not 100% convinced I'll be keeping it, but will test further tomorrow.

Cheers.
 
Best to bypass the TV first, reduce any possible issues.

AVR's don't have as many DSP modes as they used to, ie Pro Logic IIx, Pro Logic II music, DTS Neo, DTS Music have alll gone. DSU and DTS:X modes replace probably around four or so. Probably a good idea really, pain cycling through half a dozen DSP which pretty much are the same.

The manual should show what DSP modes are available with specific codecs.

Best to go through each source codec, ie Dolby Digital & DTS from regular DVD- checking OSD from DVD player then your AVR it's receiving / decoding that bitstream.

Then try BD, with Dolby HD, DTS Master HD, Dolby Atmos, DTS X etc.

Usually I try that with a kodi box, as if you don't set the options correctly, it'll show it's receiving PCM for DTS material etc.

Maverick is quite dynamic movie, I find I have to have it quite loud

Best to go through the room EQ settings as I think some settings make it worse, there's dynamic volume and few others. Also if you have room EQ app adjust midrange compensation. There's also reference and flat modes, one cuts off the high end, a bit like THX Cinema Re-EQ.
 
Firegod said:
Hi, I received my new AVR yesterday, the Marantz Cinema 60 DAB. It is to replace my aging Denon X2400H. Everything is very familiar as it is Marantz/Denon, and I ran through all the assisted setup at the start for my 5.0 setup. But compared to the Denon I appear to have literally no sound parameters to choose from.

If I use the TV and watch an HD channel, with my LG C3 set to output over eARC on "Auto", the Marantz lets me either select Stereo, Dolby Surround or Multi Channel Stereo. If I watch a non-HD channel, I get Stereo, DTS-X:Neural or Multi Channel Stereo.

When I had the Denon connected I had a myriad of options to choose from. And I'm pretty confident I remember seeing stuff like Dolby Digital+Dolby Surround, etc. I don't have any of that. With the X2400H, I used DTS-X:Neural for everything as I prefered it. It was louder and had more bass to the sound vs. Dolby.

Why does the Marantz not give me as many options? The amp assign was set to 7.1. I tried setting it back to the default which is 5.1+Zone2. Doesn't appear to make any difference. I checked the ohms were correct (8 ohm) as well. I plan to swap them back tomorrow and do some testing with some different source material (TV, Netflix,4K Blu-ray, etc). And compare notes.

The other thing I noticed is that, if I have the TV set to "Auto" or "Pass through" (no difference) for the audio when watching TV, the Marantz reports PCM (2/0/0). If I actually select "PCM", it is the same. Yet one gives me Dolby Surround and the other DTS-X. But the signal is always reported as PCM.

Finally, I watched Top Gun Maverik in 4k and I found the speech muffled and totally over powered by the effects and music. I've seen this film twice using the Denon and I don't remember that being an issue. Only difference being is that the Marantz said it was playing back in Dolby Atmos, which the X2400H can't do.

Not 100% convinced I'll be keeping it, but will test further tomorrow.

Cheers.
Click to expand...

Just curious, when you say that the X2400H can't play back in Atmos, are you specifically meaning when it's the full fat Atmos version and passed through ARC because otherwise I'm sure it can receive and play a stripped down 5.1 version of Atmos?

I found that Maverick is a challenging film for clear dialogue because a lot of the time they are wearing masks, but it was actually one of the main films I used to fine tune my EQ after running Audyssey to improve my overall dialogue clarity.

I'm not sure how similar the Marantz setup is, but with Denon I found the Reference setting along with Dynamic EQ being on did improve bass and the low end, but it made dialogue too deep and on many films voices would sound a little muffled. Even after running the paid for MultiEQ, disabling midrange compression etc it still wasn't to my liking. I ended up disabling the Audyssey settings in the app, copied the Audyssey Flat in the Graphics EQ to effectively restore those settings but now I could fine tune and tweak it. I dropped the 125Hz and 250Hz a little in the centre speaker until the boom was reduced enough in dialogue and now it's crystal clear. I adjusted my subwoofer accordingly to bring back similar bass levels as the Dynamic EQ gave me without affecting the dialogue, although I notice you say you have a 5.0 so could be worth getting a subwoofer?

If the dialogue is too quiet compared to the other speakers and effects, it could be that the centre speaker isn't setup right, did you do the auto setup with the mic? You could always increase the centre speaker manually in the app?

My AVR is the X1800H and I've found it great. It has a array of output modes as you mentioned that you had with the X2400H.
 
Just wanted to feedback. Looks like all is OK. :)

The UB820 is sending as bitstream to the AVR. Thanks for the feedback on Maverick, sounds like I just needed to try a few others. I did try Maverick again, and with the TV on pass through and UB820 set on bitsteam the app reported DD+ +DSurround. Interestingly, not dolby atmos this time. :) So I was then able to change that to DD+ +NeuralX which was great for me. So the AVR is definitely not just stuck accepting PCM, which was my worry. I also tried Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 and 3. Some great music in these, and they were fine. Dialogue was clear. Also tried a John Wick 4 via Netflix App on the TV, and the AVR input signal was correct for that (I forget what it was using).

Then yeah - just tried the standard TV again and in pass through, HD was dolby surround only and SD was DTS Neural:X only.

I think I was worrying about nothing.

Perhaps as mentioned, there just aren't as many options. I checked the manual online and the ones I'm seeing are correct. Also, set the amp assign back to 7.1 as that is the default. I made a mistake on that one.

I'm using the Reference curve with light Dynamic EQ, +3.0dB on the center with Dialog Enhancer on Medium and that helps. :)

Panic over.

Speaker wise I have BR09's for the front 35Hz - 22kHz. BR08's for surround 40Hz - 22kHz and BRC1 for center 57Hz - 22kHz. I think they are all set to full range. I might put the center back to 40Hz (which Marantz had set originally). If I understand correctly that means 40Hz and below will be sent to the front left/right speakers? Sub is on my list to match the rest of the system.
 
Firegod said:
Just wanted to feedback. Looks like all is OK. :)

The UB820 is sending as bitstream to the AVR. Thanks for the feedback on Maverick, sounds like I just needed to try a few others. I did try Maverick again, and with the TV on pass through and UB820 set on bitsteam the app reported DD+ +DSurround. Interestingly, not dolby atmos this time. :) So I was then able to change that to DD+ +NeuralX which was great for me. So the AVR is definitely not just stuck accepting PCM, which was my worry. I also tried Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 and 3. Some great music in these, and they were fine. Dialogue was clear. Also tried a John Wick 4 via Netflix App on the TV, and the AVR input signal was correct for that (I forget what it was using).

Then yeah - just tried the standard TV again and in pass through, HD was dolby surround only and SD was DTS Neural:X only.

I think I was worrying about nothing.

Perhaps as mentioned, there just aren't as many options. I checked the manual online and the ones I'm seeing are correct. Also, set the amp assign back to 7.1 as that is the default. I made a mistake on that one.

I'm using the Reference curve with light Dynamic EQ, +3.0dB on the center with Dialog Enhancer on Medium and that helps. :)

Panic over.

Speaker wise I have BR09's for the front 35Hz - 22kHz. BR08's for surround 40Hz - 22kHz and BRC1 for center 57Hz - 22kHz. I think they are all set to full range. I might put the center back to 40Hz (which Marantz had set originally). If I understand correctly that means 40Hz and below will be sent to the front left/right speakers? Sub is on my list to match the rest of the system.
Click to expand...

Good to hear you are sorted. Nice speakers, my own front ones go from 39Hz and whilst they produced lovely undistorted bass, it wasn't the kind that vibrates through you and I also couldn't help but feel that my speakers were being stressed and overwhelmed.

I got myself a nice BKE XLS300-FF which is 17Hz+ and ideal for a living room size, I only have to go half power and it's still vibrating through me! lol What a difference it made with the fronts (crossover is at 60Hz), they really opened up in the midrange and of course it's great being able to independently control the bass now so I could really get my fronts and centre perfect. It will be interesting to hear back from you once you get a sub.
 
ninjag said:
Good to hear you are sorted. Nice speakers, my own front ones go from 39Hz and whilst they produced lovely undistorted bass, it wasn't the kind that vibrates through you and I also couldn't help but feel that my speakers were being stressed and overwhelmed.

I got myself a nice BKE XLS300-FF which is 17Hz+ and ideal for a living room size, I only have to go half power and it's still vibrating through me! lol What a difference it made with the fronts (crossover is at 60Hz), they really opened up in the midrange and of course it's great being able to independently control the bass now so I could really get my fronts and centre perfect. It will be interesting to hear back from you once you get a sub.
Click to expand...
Lol thanks for the insight. :) yeah I don't want lots of booming bass so being able to control it sounds good.
 
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