Help with a GTX 295 issue please?

Jonney Napalm · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:03

Just wondered if anyone could give me any advice or if anyone has, or
is suffering the same issue I am.

Firstly,

Windows Vista 64 bit patched to latest standards.
Core i7 920 @3.2
Asus Ramapage II Extreme motherboard. 1406 Bios and latest drivers.
Asus GTX 295 gfx card
6 Gb Corsair Dominator DDR3 PC3-12800
Corsair HX 1000w PSU
Hyundai Imagequest 19" and Samsung Syncmaster 24" monitors
Nvidia 180.87 (supplied with GFX card), 182.50 and 186.18 to name but
a few.

My problem is that I can do a clean install of an Nvidia graphics
driver and then run 3D Mark Vantage and I get what I consider to be a
resonable score:-

Gpu - 17087
Cpu - 20270
Overall - 18365
Gpu test 1 - 53.57 FPS
Gpu Test 2 - 50.70 FPS

This is on performance setting of Vantage with the 'Disable PPU' box
ticked.
Then after a few reboots/next day, if I run 3D mark Vantage again my
scores have dropped to:-

Gpu - 11404
Cpu - 20406
Overall - 12818
Gpu test 1 - 33.43 FPS
Gpu Test 2 - 31.66 FPS

So, as you can see, it's a considerable drop on the GPU side.

I can then uninstall my Nvidia driver, reboot in safe mode and use
Driversweeper to remove all traces of Nvidia and Ageia file, reboot,
use a registry cleaner to make sure and then re-install an Nvidia GFX
driver and my performance is back up to what I think it should be.
Then, you guessed it, after a few reboots/next day it's back to being
rubbish again.
I've not touched the Nvidia control panel or adjusted anything to do
with the graphics driver apart from the only other software I run for GFX is Asus SmartDoctor and GamerOSD supplied with the card.
Even if I turn these off, or reboot with them disabled, it make no difference.
I have tried this with various drivers and they all do the same.

I have also tried swapping DVI ports, only running one monitor, removing and re-seating the GFX card on the mobo and swapping the power leads to it

What going on? What is dropping the performance of my GFX card back
down to what realisticly to me looks like only one core doing the
work?

I can go back and repeat the clean driver install steps and its back
to normal again, and then of course goes rubbish after a while.
Am I missing something really obvious? (very likely knowning me!)

Just hoping someone can shed some light on this issue for me as it's
starting to drive me nuts.

Bony Maloney · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:11

If you pull up the nvidia control panel is the card defaulting to 1 GPU enabled? Have you forced dual GPU in the nvidia control panel profile for Vantage? This sounds like a driver issue more than a card fault

Jonney Napalm · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:20

The Nvidia control panel is set with the 'Enable Multi Gpu Mode' box ticked and I have tried using the Nvidia recommended (I presume that's multi gpu) setting in the Global and Program settings.
TBH, I think I've tried just about every combination of selections possible.

The thing is, it's fine when I first install the driver and then seems to degrade without any intervention by me changing settings.

gt_junkie · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:26

Sounds like it's defaulting to one GPU. Could be a driver issue. How are the temps?

I just tested a Zotac 295 and found it immensely stable both running 185.20 and 186.18 drivers.

Your initial GPU score looks about right.

At stock i got '15690' and when clocked (core: 652mhz memory: 1199mhz shader: 1406mhz) the card returned '19078'.

I'd definately keep an eye on temps.

gt

Jonney Napalm · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:34

The temps look to be fine. Haven't seen it go above 75 deg C even when it's been getting hammered.
I have used Asus Smartdocter to wind the fans up to max and ran all testing with the screaming like a hoover, and still no joy.
Currently runing 182.5 as it's considered to be the best current driver for ArmA2 and I have a few clan mates running 8800's that 186.18 has really messed with, but that's another issue.
Still, Ive tried quite a few drivers and still end up with the same result.

gt_junkie · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:49

That's just plain weird?!

Possibly some kind of incompatibility. :confused:

I take it you don't have kaspersky or any other anti virus software that might be effecting the installtion/running of the drivers?

gt

Jonney Napalm · 24 Jun 2009 at 12:54

Ah, now you mention it, I do have Kaspersky Internet Security 2009 running, and I'm pretty sure I didn't disable it for this install, but I know I have in the past.
I'll have to try a fresh re-install later with it shutdown and see where I go from there.
I can see how it might srew up an installation of GFX drivers, but would it be able to mess with them just during everday use?
Is there a known issue with Kaspersky and Nvidia drivers seeing as that's the AV you mentioned?

gt_junkie · 24 Jun 2009 at 13:22

I've heard that Kaspersky can be aggressive but i've not seen specific related issues.

My workplace uses sophos anti virus and that causes some issues with program installations if it's set up to be aggressive.

Good luck!

gt

Jonney Napalm · 24 Jun 2009 at 14:59

Thanks GT, I'll close kaspersky down completely and do a full clean and reinstall and see if I have any joy with that.
I'll keep you posted as to the results.

Jonney

Jonney Napalm · 25 Jun 2009 at 10:10

Well, what can I say, I re-did the circus act of unistalling, cleaning and reinstalling the driver without Kaspersky running and looked fine.
Did a quick benchmark to confirm and the card was roaring along.
Installed Asus Smartdocter and Asus GamerOSD, rebooted and benchmarked and all was still well.
Rebooted and checked again, still good.
Did another reboot and checked, still good, and then tried running ArmA 2, which duly crashed (which is not that unusual) so I decided to uninstall that for a reinstall at a later date.
Rebooted, and everythings gone back to being rubbish again.
Back to looking like only a single GPU is running the show.
GRRRRR!
So I uninstalled the physx and nvidia driver using the uninstall programs utility in control panel.
Booted into safemode and suddenly realised that if I checked the device manager, it was saying that the GTX 295 was using driver version 185.15.
What?
Did a driver sweep and registry clean and rebooted into normal mode.
On the startup, I can see that it says it's found new hardware and is installing a driver for the GFX card.
No way to stop it!
So now it just installs what looks like a trimmed down version of 185.15 even in safemode.
And as it's using this driver I can't seem to delete it.
Vista seems to have taken a copy of 185.15 and hidden it away for it own use without letting me be able to delete it.
Would physically removing the GFX card and starting up give me the option to delete this wayward driver?
Is there a setting in Vista that I seem to have enabled called something like 'automatically install driver on startup' that I can disable so I can choose my own driver or am I looking at a Vista reinstall to delete this pesky mutt.
What happened to the 'new device found' message where you get to install the driver of you choice and not the one of Vista's choice?
Seem to be digging myself into a deeper and deeper hole here.

My feeling is that this 185.15, so called driver, is corrupted and affects any other driver I install after that.

Help!
Jonney

gt_junkie · 25 Jun 2009 at 10:34

Yeah, if you are able to boot up without the card you might be able to remove the driver.

You could also connect the system drive to another PC to see if you can remove the driver that way.

Looks like you've tracked down the issue though - must have corrupted and is now throwing everything out of whack!

gt

Ch3m1c4L · 25 Jun 2009 at 13:03

there is an option in vista to stop it automatically installing the drivers, although i dont know where it is. The driver installer should be located in C:\Nvidia\xxxx if you want to delete it.

The fact that it worked until you ran arma2 which then crashed and caused it to go back to one card makes me think its that causing the issue, unless you can test with another 3d game and then reboot and see what happens. Have you tried just turning off multi gpu, reboot, and then turn it back on, does it make it work again?

Bony Maloney · 25 Jun 2009 at 13:12

Right click computer in start menu, select properties, select advance system settings, then hardware,from device installation settings select how you want windows to install drivers

Jonney Napalm · 25 Jun 2009 at 15:52

Thanks guys, I'll try these things later when I get home from work.

Jonney

Jonney Napalm · 26 Jun 2009 at 12:06

Still no joy, GRRRRR!

@GT, being the dullard that I am, it was only after taking the side off my case that I realized if I take the GFX card out what am I going to connect my monitor too......duhh!!!!

@Ch3m1c4L, There was no C:\Nvidia folder as it had already been deleted. I don't think ArmA2 was the cause as it had happened before I even purchased that game, but yes, I don't think it has done me any favours either.

@Bony, if I follow your advice, it takes me to a box with two options. One is to go to device manager and the other controls the options for whether or not windows update looks for a driver online or not.
It doesn't give me the option to choose which driver to let windows install.

Thanks for all your advice guys, it's much appreciated.
I'm thinking of getting a new HDD to replace my ageing and noisy 36Gb Raptors that are used for the OS, so that'll mean I can admit defeat gracefully and do a full Vista re-install.
Hopefully this will solve my issues, but if it doesn't, I think I'll take up knitting instead

Cheers,
Jonney

gt_junkie · 26 Jun 2009 at 12:15

Thought that might have been the case. Wasn't sure if you had onboard video or another card to try.

You could give this option a try -

gt_junkie said:
You could also connect the system drive to another PC to see if you can remove the driver that way.

But i suspect as you say 'raptors' you probably have two in raid meaning it would be very hard to manage.

gt

Jonney Napalm · 28 Jun 2009 at 01:31

Well, popped over to Overclockers this afto ( sorry Mr Plod, I was doing 70, I swear!) and picked up a new 320Gb Samsung Spinpoint F1 to replace the ageing old couple of groaning Raptors that run my OS.

Did a full re-install of Vista etc and I think I may have found the culprit.

Nothing to with video drivers, but wait for it.................................Creative!

Well blow me.

I think it's the Creative sound drivers, not 100% sure yet, more investigation is to come.
Funnily enough, everthing was fine until I activated the X-Fi MB drivers online, then it all went Pete Tong.
After much ado about a lot really, I retreated to a restore point before I installed them, and bingo, back to being good again.

Umm, ok, Asus Mobo, Asus GFX Card and a tiddly little Creative X-Fi sound card, as supplied by Asus as part of their mobo, with the drivers on the CD supplied by Asus?

Damn, I so wanted to pick-up a Xoner sound card too, but I didn't think it would fit. (Just like the side panel fan I purchased!... Duh!.. At least I'll find another use for that!)

Now where's the wool and my size 9 needles?

Jonney Napalm · 28 Jun 2009 at 02:03

Oh cr*p, it's still doing it!
Just ran L4D and it back to 'pants central' again.
So i'm fine until I run a 3D app?
Can't expect a dual GPU card to do that really, can I.
Groan.
Maybe it's not the Creative drivers then.
Mind, I'm still sat across the bar from those pesky critters, covering my guns, giving them the 'dead eye' stare.
I'll be happy when they mosey on out of town regardless.

So how much do you think I can pick up an Alpacka for?
No, seriously, the knittings looking good atm.

/stop crying

Jonney

gt_junkie · 28 Jun 2009 at 10:03

Ahhhh - creative.

Had issues before with X-Fi's i've had in the past.

Creative drivers are some of the worse available - plenty of threads on many other forums identifying problems.

Strange that it started doing it again though - what are you using for audio at the moment?

If it turns out to be audio related i'd consider either an external DAC or one of the cheaper Asus Xonar's to deal with the audio side of things.

How do you listen to audio when gaming... speakers or headphones?

Beyond that it might indeed be the card - bit weird though! Especially considering the card isn't overheating! :confused:

gt

Jonney Napalm · 28 Jun 2009 at 11:58

I'm using the little Creative X-Fi card that comes with the motherboard and the drivers supplied on the mobo installation disk.
You install them and then the first time you click on the little icon in the task bar you have to input a S/N that comes on the disk packaging and it activates the drivers.

I normally use headphones for audio as the Missus doesn't appreciate the sounds of gunfire and zombies when she's trying to get to sleep.

I think my next step is to do another full re-install of Vista and this time not install any Creative drivers.
If this sorts it then all well and good, but if it doesn't then I'll be totally stumped.
The only other thing I can think of is the card is faulty.
Would I be able to RMA it back to Overclockers based on what I've done?
It's only a few months old and was originally purchased from O'CUK.

Oh well, back to watching loading line moving across the screen again I suppose.