hmm interesting proposition from a client

D4VE

D4VE

D4VE

Soldato
Joined
23 Oct 2003
Posts
8,899
Location
Hampshire, UK
Hi,

Ive been designing a website for a client (insurance company).

Basically, they dont want me to do any designs for other insurance companies for the next 2 years. For this, they will pay me a sum and they have asked how much I want.

I can see why they want that contract in place - they dont want me to go off and do a better design for a competitor.

No idea whatsoever of what to charge to be honest. :confused:

Anyone got experience of this?
 
Mulder said:
Do you design professionally, i.e. for a living?
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I do a little freelance work in my spare time and I work full time doing other things (that is where most of my income comes from).

The danger I can see here is - if I got a web design job with a Design firm(currently looking) I need to be able to legally do work for any kind of company of course

I can see their point, but it could make life tricky. Although I really need this job to beef up my portfolio.
Or perhaps they are out of order to ask for this. I cant see a design agency (at least one of whom is also presenting designs) agreeing to do that.
 
So if I understand you correctly, you currently don't design professionally but are actively seeking employment of this kind. In which case, it's not unreasonable of you to ask for 2 years wages for a web designer of your age/experience/qualifications etc, as this is what you will lose by signing the contract with them.
 
Yep, I also think it's reasonable for them to compensate you for any money lost if you find future employment in that field.

Seen as they're an insurance company, they can cover you for a 2 year term of employment based on how much you think you're worth by current standards. So, if you find a job and lose it due to not being able to work, you'll be covered for two years wages.

Ok, maybe that's a bit much to ask anyone, but something along those lines is only reasonable and fair.
 
Thanks for the input so far.

I was thinking about saying something like:

For the fee of £X, Within the next 2 years (from date) I will not produce designs on a freelance basis for another Insurance company - unless, I get a job with a Design Agency and are required to do work for them on Insurance company website(s).

What do you reckon?
 
Do they know this is what you do on the side or do they think you do this fulltime? How much work was it? Days? weeks? months?

I think 2 years fulltime wages would be hard to justify unless they're a very big insurance company and you've done a massive job for them. I think even my clients would balk at what would that would be for me. I think you may have to settle for equivalent employed rates rather than contracting rates.

How's your relationship with the client, if you signed this contract could they want you to do further work for them?
 
z3b3dy said:
Do they know this is what you do on the side or do they think you do this fulltime? How much work was it? Days? weeks? months?

I think 2 years fulltime wages would be hard to justify unless they're a very big insurance company and you've done a massive job for them. I think even my clients would balk at what would that would be for me. I think you may have to settle for equivalent employed rates rather than contracting rates.

How's your relationship with the client, if you signed this contract could they want you to do further work for them?
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Yes they know its on the side. I am careful to tell clients this before I take on a job as it limits how quickly I can do work etc.

So far I havent done any coding, I have bid for the job by presenting designs (as PDFs). Im not doing the coding until they tell me I have been successful and will definately be doing their website. I know they have contacted an Agency too (who will charge more I imagine), but I wont find out if Ive won the work until Friday at the earliest.
However, it has been 2-3 evenings work already.

However, if I am successful they have said already that there will be further work. Quite a bit infact, as they have multiple sites.
Relationship is fine, but we have only been working together for 2 weeks on and off so it is early days.
I have yet to discover what type of client they are ;)
 
D4VE said:
Yes they know its on the side. I am careful to tell clients this before I take on a job as it limits how quickly I can do work etc.

So far I havent done any coding, I have bid for the job by presenting designs (as PDFs). Im not doing the coding until they tell me I have been successful and will definately be doing their website. I know they have contacted an Agency too (who will charge more I imagine), but I wont find out if Ive won the work until Friday at the earliest.
However, it has been 2-3 evenings work already.

However, if I am successful they have said already that there will be further work. Quite a bit infact, as they have multiple sites.
Relationship is fine, but we have only been working together for 2 weeks on and off so it is early days.
I have yet to discover what type of client they are ;)
Click to expand...

Well I hope you're successful with the pitch. I really think you'll have to factor in the possibility of more work with what you charge for exclusivity. You'll want to make the contract very clear whether the agreement allows them to call on you for extra work during that period for no pay. Do you think this would keep you busy on a full time basis or evenings during the week for quite a while?

I did some work last year on the design of insurance software, the client was remarkably receptive to a more radical design and layout. It quite surprised me!
 
(Value of current site) * 4 I would estimate, say to them that you expect to design x amount of websites in the next 2 years and you expect 2 of them to be insurance-related. Then there's the work you might possibly lose through missing out on word of mouth bear in mind. And less sites to potentially add to your portfolio.
It's a nice position to be in and a bad position at the same time :)
 
The problem is you can't value jobs you may lose out on so it can't be factored into the tender.

A contract that defines exclusivity works both ways. If they are squeezing you to keep faithful to them within the industry [which is understandable as it's a fiercely competitive industry], I would dictate exclusivity to you on their part, as in, you're the sole provider of services on site x, y and z. Get them to sign it, then start to write justification reports as to why the sites needs an accessibility audit, usability testing, search engine optimisation, content management system etc.

Remember that you too are a service provider and you need to sustain yourself ecomonically which some contracts can inhibit so stay sharp.

Best of luck.
 
personally id agree to not work on something then if something else turns up do it anyway.

can always stick somebody elses name on it if need be.

but more importantly it doesnt lose you a contract (money).
 
The average amount you earn from a client of that nature, and double it.

After all, you're cutting out potential clients in the future. Which isn't just about money, you could miss out on a very big client because of them. Such as Churchill, and should be compensated. ;)
 
In all honesty, I'd tell em where to stick it. Say you settle for 2 years wages.. what happens if another company then offers you double that? You can't accept..

'No' would be the answer, if it was likely that I would be working for someone else.

If unlikely to work for another, I'd rip their arm off and tell them £50k+ if they want exclusive services.

It's not just about monetary gain, it's about credibility and your reputation as a web designer.. 2 years down the line, you've not done any work for any insurance firms and Insurance Firm A & Co. want to see your portfolio...
 
Can you give the first letter of the company, just wondering if it's us as that is what we're about to do and it's the kind of condition we'd ask for!
 
That’s a rather tricky situation to be in.

First and foremost I would ensure that it won't hamper you in finding employment as this will earn you a lot more money in the long run.

If I was going to agree to such a contract I'd have a pretty high price on it really, firstly to make sure that they really wanted you. Secondly to compensate should you have another insurance company call you tomorrow and what to pay you several thousand pounds for a new web solution.

All in all, I'd say chance your arm with a decent price that will keep you financially stable for x amount of time and see what happens.
 
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