How best to react to a slash in your wages..

[Glaucus]

oh yes forgot police/law.

the problem is why would private company's increase trains, when they can say it's overcrowded and as such put prices up.

If they put more carriages on, run more trains, they could lower the fares, but would make the same profit..

why should we pay, well somethings are good for the country as a whole and for the economy, a cheap reliable public transport system is one of those things.

 

[Usher]

Milked? Is the work done for councils of no value?

If councils are willing to pay the money, how can this be 'milking'?

I guess you don't pay council tax if you make comments like that, where do you think the council get their money from - a pot at the end of a rainbow?
Its from our council tax & a huge persentage of this ever rising tax goes into council employees pensions.

Why should I & everyone else contribute to someone getting a better pension simply because they work for the council & even worse is that they get to retire at 60 ? Its not sour grapes - its just unfair This applies to all government workers from roadsweepers upwards thru teachers /police etc.
I think if more people realised what is going on as regards to where their Council tax went then something might be sorted out.

 

[Dolph]

oh yes forgot police/law.

the problem is why would private company's increase trains, when they can say it's overcrowded and as such put prices up.

Because of economy of scale? You mention it yourself below, the more people you can get travelling, the more profit overall you can make. People are far more likely to take the train if it's not overcrowded and hellish...

If they put more carriages on, run more trains, they could lower the fares, but would make the same profit..

why should we pay, well somethings are good for the country as a whole and for the economy, a cheap reliable public transport system is one of those things.

Workforce mobility is indeed a good thing, but that doesn't necessitate publicly owned transport systems.

 

[Glaucus]

but in a private sector the company doesn't have to reduce fares or increase capacity. your in a catch 22.

 

[Vanilla]

i find your reply quite interesting. i share much of your opinion about the matter, and whilst it is a little off topic i would like to expand on one of the points that you made, more specifically 'it's the reason much of the private sector wont touch employees from the public sector'. is it *really* that hard to move between the two? my personal circumstances are such that i may be looking to move in the very near future, am i going to be fighting an uphill struggle?

You'll face some prejudices but, no, it's not particularly hard to move between them. Don't fret about it, it's just my experience so far, not the law of the land

 

[iBankAllDay]

You'll face some prejudices but, no, it's not particularly hard to move between them. Don't fret about it, it's just my experience so far, not the law of the land

From what I have seen and heard, it is very much possible (and often common practice) to move between the two. It may depend on what the sector or profession is however.

 

[Dolph]

but in a private sector the company doesn't have to reduce fares or increase capacity. your in a catch 22.

If they are in a competitive market they do, otherwise their competitor will and will take their business.

 

[Vanilla]

From what I have seen and heard, it is very much possible (and often common practice) to move between the two. It may depend on what the sector or profession is however.

Just to clarify, I was talking about IT. No idea about other areas.

 

[iBankAllDay]

Just to clarify, I was talking about IT. No idea about other areas.

That's quite possible then. In my sector -town planning - it's almost desirable for 'coal face' experience as it vital to know how the system works in order to make it work for you (the private consultancy). I'll let you know more accurately in a few years!

 

[teaboy5]

I work the local council here in IT, and i must say we do not waste money at all. I love working in the pace, the pay is great, but the stress levels can get high at some points but its great. Bear in mind the councils here are not as big, take the finance department for example. Its only has 7 people in it and they never stop working all day.

So not all public sector employees are lazy.

 

[teaboy5]

and in turn we pay councils tto much for what they do


having said that, maybe if they incresed efficiency and reduced numbers by getting rid of the the idle and useless then maybe they wouldn't have to cut salaries of the decent workers thy have

I dont think we do, take where i am for exampe, armagh district, its takes 1.5 million to just left the bins every years and that doesn't include the rest of waste mangment.

 

[HangTime]

I can earn £10,000 more if I move to a university and do the same job, happens that I like my job and the people I work with.

Well, I guess you have to ask yourself the question then, are you prepared to lose out on probably £50k over the next 4 years for the sake of a (probably) better working environment?

If my employer told me my pay was frozen for 4 years then I'd be looking for a better job ASAP.

 

[doopydug]

Well, I guess you have to ask yourself the question then, are you prepared to lose out on probably £50k over the next 4 years for the sake of a (probably) better working environment?

If my employer told me my pay was frozen for 4 years then I'd be looking for a better job ASAP.

Would that not depend on how well paid you are in the first place. If, for example, leaving for another job were to cost you £60k over 4 years, would you stick to your principles and go?

 

[HangTime]

Would that not depend on how well paid you are in the first place. If, for example, leaving for another job were to cost you £60k over 4 years, would you stick to your principles and go?

If leaving for another job were to cost me £60k over 4 years, then it wouldn't meet my criteria of a "a better job"

What I'm getting at is, if he stays with his current job, paying £x, over 4 years he will earn £4x.
Whereas changing to the uni job would earn him £4(x+10)^payrise_factor. So in the first year he would earn £10k more than his current job, in the 2nd year even more than £10k difference (assuming payrise) and so forth.

 

[Raumarik]

i find your reply quite interesting. i share much of your opinion about the matter, and whilst it is a little off topic i would like to expand on one of the points that you made, more specifically 'it's the reason much of the private sector wont touch employees from the public sector'. is it *really* that hard to move between the two? my personal circumstances are such that i may be looking to move in the very near future, am i going to be fighting an uphill struggle?

In some sectors (I.T. especially) it's very easy, I know this as I and several others have moved to and from Private/public sectors several times. In some other areas like HR/Finance etc I guess it'd be a little more tricky as generally council departments of those aren't as efficient at private ones.

Although lets face it, neither are I.T. departments

 

[Raumarik]

I guess you don't pay council tax if you make comments like that, where do you think the council get their money from - a pot at the end of a rainbow?
Its from our council tax & a huge persentage of this ever rising tax goes into council employees pensions.

Why should I & everyone else contribute to someone getting a better pension simply because they work for the council & even worse is that they get to retire at 60 ? Its not sour grapes - its just unfair This applies to all government workers from roadsweepers upwards thru teachers /police etc.
I think if more people realised what is going on as regards to where their Council tax went then something might be sorted out.

I wasn't aware that public sector workers like myself could retire at 60! But I agree it's unfair and councils on the whole are exceptionally inefficient. There's pockets of exceptional people but I haven't seen that many in the last few years working for a council

I do however now work on my own, manage myself and do probably 4x the amount of work I did under a manager in my previous IT department. God save anyone that comes to work under me expecting an easy life.

 

[doopydug]

In some sectors (I.T. especially) it's very easy, I know this as I and several others have moved to and from Private/public sectors several times. In some other areas like HR/Finance etc I guess it'd be a little more tricky as generally council departments of those aren't as efficient at private ones.

Although lets face it, neither are I.T. departments

The problem with Finance/HR is the council does things completely different from the real world. There are very few skills learned in the council that translate to work outside in these particular fields.

 

[ElvisFan]

Granted that's not very hygienic, but I'd prefer it over a turd.

Proper LOL (Very reminiscent of Karl Pilkington)

 

[[TW]Fox]

Air travel is exactly how a privatised rail system should work, central scheduling (and track upkeep in the case of railways) but independant companies.

In theory, this is exactly how the railway system works. As per air travel, routes must be 'booked' with Network Rail, in the same way slots at airports are booked with the CAA/NATS/whatever they are called.

What we really need to do is accept railways will, on the whole, never be properly profitable and are infact a socially neccesary public service and should be treated as such.

 

[[TW]Fox]

If they are in a competitive market they do, otherwise their competitor will and will take their business.

The problem we have is that our privatised rail network is NOT a competitive market - infact the terms of many of the franchise agreements actually forbid competitive practices. Those few operators who HAVE tried to genuinelly compete have normally found themselves run into issues.

Case in point - what used to be First North Western ran Manchester to London services, but were subject to so many ridiculous restrictions designed to ensure the Intercity Westcoast (Franchise holder Virgin Trains) franchise was not affected that the service stopped a year or two after it started becuase it was largely pointless.

You also, specific cases again excepted, don't generally buy a ticket from one TOC for use on one TOC. The most popular ticket type, a Route Any Permitted, allows the use of any reasonable train to reach your destinition irrespective of operator.

The whole system is pointless as a privatised network, there will never be true competition and many of the private companies draw more in subsidies than the equivilant sector of British Rail.

Did you know, for example, that in BR days although the CrossCountry region of Intercity made an operating loss (Due to the nature of the routes), the Intercity Sector overall returned an operating profit despite also itself subdising the loss making regions?

Now it's all split so the huge cash-cow Intercity routes, ie East Coast (GNER) make huge amounts of money (Good move there Sea Containers, East Coast Franchise was a guaranteed cash-cow given just months before the Railways Act 1994 was passed a multi-million pound electrification and new train program had just been completed) whereas Virgin CrossCountry requires huge subsidies.

Joy.