How to solve the boundary dispute with a stressfully difficult neighbor?

[Peerzy]

You meant… court is the only possible solution…(?)

Pretty much, you've asked him to stop. The police haven't done anything and solicitor letters have failed.

The last option is court. A judgement in your favour will allow the police to act but could be expensive (especially if you lose).

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Pretty much, you've asked him to stop. The police haven't done anything and solicitor letters have failed.

The last option is court. A judgement in your favour will allow the police to act but could be expensive (especially if you lose).

This basically, the police will not get involved in these disputes until they are forced to or someone escalates it beyond petty lock removals etc. (e.g. a punch up).

 

[NickK]

You meant… court is the only possible solution…(?)

If that has been dragging on - and what you have told him is not sinking in, let the court make the point for you.

In my case - she cannot rent out a visitor's parking spot as part of her property. It is in her deed.. she has two spots on her property that she is responsible for. She is entitled to one spot and the other visitor spot I, and other home owners including her, have a deed right to use. So she makes a big fuss, make it sound legal and tries to trap you in conversations.. so everyone carries on regardless. The issue is renters will back down, if she complains then I will simply state I will take it to court.

There's old rules that people that use a piece of land for X amount of time become entitled to it. However I believe recent laws have rescinded those laws. You will need to take legal advice for that.

I'm not a legal person but having it written as a solicitor's letter or legal court point means it's in writing by and independent recognised body and the council/police follow the legal written right (the court can instruct the police accordingly).

Lastly IF the situation results that he annexes the land (legally) then you have a right to compensation which he is likely to be instructed to pay you (and any other person that may have lost part of the deed agreements).

In the end - the loss of land impacts your house price/investment.

 

[Delvis]

If the gate is on his side of the boundary then it belongs to him and there is nothing you can do to that gate. You are absolutely not allowed to lock his gate. He is within his rights to remove any lock you place on his gate. However, there is nothing stopping you placing a fence panel on your side directly in front of his gate. If he knocks it down then you can have him arrested for damaging your property. That should get the message through.

Depends entirely on access etc.

I know people in old terrace houses and the neighbours technically can walk from three doors in across two back gardens to get to the side entrance....you couldn't block those gates for instance

 

[Psycho Sonny]

I hope someone can help me here.
I’ve been drowning in this dispute for almost three years with no progress.

to be short, my downstairs neighbor had a single way locking gate into my garden and his fence includes half of the sharing land into his own private use. So he can come into my garden anytime anywhere but we can’t go into his. The only document of the land showing a different shape of boundary and the sharing land is completely open for both side.

The neighbor claimed that he has been living here over 30 years but he don’t have any evidence to show that the land he usurped had been registered, he only has responsibilities for maintenance, but we share the same right of access over it. Plus, the map from estate agent showing that I owns all of the area outside his fence when I bought it.

we were first time buyer and we didn’t check all of the documents carefully ourselves, either did our conveyancer noticed the difference between actual boundary and the lease.

The neighbor dig out my new tiles outside his fence on the sharing land, which was the first time we called the police (end up to be useless) and took it seriously as a dispute.

I’ve tried solicitor letters, a charter surveyor report , to show the neighbor the fact of his encroachment( his shed is over sailing part of my land according to the lease) and trespassing (he kept putting things covering the whole sharing bit) , but he just ignore everything by attaching words only.

after two years “letter fight”, he finally used a solicitor (Atwell, London) (he intended to sale his property, and needs a deed of variation with us), who ended up to be aggressively baseless just like the neighbor! So far, they can’t show any evidence to prove his position but only asking for my land.

I heard that the court doesn’t worth the money, but I don’t know if there is another way to get this done as the neighbor has been taken advantage of his right of access to intrude my garden anytime. He left his scraps in my garden, taking pictures from my garden into my balcony/kitchen, he stole the tennis balls I left in my garden overnight, he dig out my tiles when we were on holiday… basically, we can’t use my garden due to his “right of access”. We have been so stressful for his harassment over the years…

many advice or similar experience are welcome. Please.

Sell up and buy detached.

Even then you may have neighbor issues but odds are they won't be as bad.

 

[Pixy_E]

Thank you for sharing the story.

 

[Pixy_E]

Depends entirely on access etc.

I know people in old terrace houses and the neighbours technically can walk from three doors in across two back gardens to get to the side entrance....you couldn't block those gates for instance

You are right

 

[garnett]

https://imgur.com/a/g36c819

The red and blue is the physical boundary. The yellow part (pic 2) is where my neighbour claims to be his by covering his bulky rubbish and wheelie bin and so.
The green on lease plan is where both side have the same right of access, but I need to maintain; the brown triangle part is where both have the same right of access, but neighbour need to maintain.

I can't reconcile the Google maps image and the lease plan.

Also you've talked about land that is your neighbours, and land that is yours, and you've mentioned "sharing land" - do you mean communal land over which you and your neighbour both have rights to use? Can you identify those three areas on the Google maps image and the lease plan?

Have you got the leases? Any chance you could post these?

As others have said, don't sign anything without legal advice. If someone wants you to enter into a deed of variation they should pay your legal fees.

If the neighbour is breaching the terms of their lease (eg by accessing property that isn't demised to them or over which they have rights of access, or, similarly, by denying access to another leaseholder to land they are entitled to access) they are likely to be in breach of the terms of their lease, and you should notify the landlord and press for them to take action.

It's hard to offer much help because it's still unclear what's actually going on.

Good luck.

 

[pp111]

Depends entirely on access etc.

I know people in old terrace houses and the neighbours technically can walk from three doors in across two back gardens to get to the side entrance....you couldn't block those gates for instance

If that is so then there will be a through-way mentioned on the deeds. If there isn't then you can block it off and it is his responsibility to prove otherwise.

 

[Delvis]

If that is so then there will be a through-way mentioned on the deeds. If there isn't then you can block it off and it is his responsibility to prove otherwise.

Yes

As you can tell from the op though there's a fair bit of conflicting information!

 

[Hotwired]

I can't reconcile the Google maps image and the lease plan.

I reckon it's this:

Spoiler: clicky

L shaped garden behind a semi detached that's shared in a funny way.

 

[mid_gen]

It’s a long lease hold, so there is no registration of ownership. Land registry shows that the whole two garden is shared between us two lease holders. And the dead shows a completely different shape of boundary line as it was sold to me.

Christ almighty did you not actually *look* at the deed when you were buying the place?

 

[The_Arbiter]

Christ almighty did you not actually *look* at the deed when you were buying the place?

You could say that about many lease buyers, new build buyers, shared ownership, etc. Lots of not obvious issues that rear their heads to non experienced buyers who paid a so called professional to help and guide them through the purchase. The real problem is our property sector is quite the joke.

 

[mid_gen]

You could say that about many lease buyers, new build buyers, shared ownership, etc. Lots of not obvious issues that rear their heads to non experienced buyers who paid a so called professional to help and guide them through the purchase. The real problem is our property sector is quite the joke.

Well yes, the person at fault here is the conveyancer who is paid to make sure this stuff is in order. But still, first thing I did when I got the draft contracts through was walk round the property and make sure everything was in order in terms of the plot.

 

[garnett]

I reckon it's this:

Spoiler: clicky

L shaped garden behind a semi detached that's shared in a funny way.

Ah, thanks. That makes sense, and makes it a bit clearer.

Still too much conflicting info and gaps in the detail to be able to offer any sort of help, but it looks like there's likely to be scope for some horse-trading and a satisfactory outcome can get set out in this deed of variation.

 

[Pixy_E]

I can't reconcile the Google maps image and the lease plan.

Also you've talked about land that is your neighbours, and land that is yours, and you've mentioned "sharing land" - do you mean communal land over which you and your neighbour both have rights to use? Can you identify those three areas on the Google maps image and the lease plan?

Have you got the leases? Any chance you could post these?

As others have said, don't sign anything without legal advice. If someone wants you to enter into a deed of variation they should pay your legal fees.

If the neighbour is breaching the terms of their lease (eg by accessing property that isn't demised to them or over which they have rights of access, or, similarly, by denying access to another leaseholder to land they are entitled to access) they are likely to be in breach of the terms of their lease, and you should notify the landlord and press for them to take action.

It's hard to offer much help because it's still unclear what's actually going on.

Good luck.

Thank you for the comment.
we do have leases and showed them to a couple of solicitors, who all said the demising of the communal land is very blur. The most difficult thing for us is, the actual boundary has been altered into current shape for over 20 years, way before we moved in, but the free holder claimed that he had no idea about the alteration.
We have charter surveyor report which says clearly that the neighbor is breaching the lease and a suggesting remedy, but he ignored it, interestingly, so as his solicitor now. They just don’t reply on our evidence, neither have they provide any evidence/document to support their position. It feels like wasting my legal fee over talking nonsense.

 

[Pixy_E]

I reckon it's this:

Spoiler: clicky

L shaped garden behind a semi detached that's shared in a funny way.

Lease plan: pink is my private; white is neighbor’s private; green is same right of access with my duty of maintenance; brown is same right of access with neighbour’s duty of maintenance.
Google plan/ actual boundary since ages ago: red L shape is neighbour’s fence and shed, all locked up; blue is my shed and land, out side his fence; yellow is under dispute that neighbour’s is claiming it’s his.

 

[Pixy_E]

Christ almighty did you not actually *look* at the deed when you were buying the place?

Can I blame the conveyancer… ? Yeah, we are paying for the neglect.

 

[garnett]

Lease plan: pink is my private; white is neighbor’s private; green is same right of access with my duty of maintenance; brown is same right of access with neighbour’s duty of maintenance.
Google plan/ actual boundary since ages ago: red L shape is neighbour’s fence and shed, all locked up; blue is my shed and land, out side his fence; yellow is under dispute that neighbour’s is claiming it’s his.

So are you not just arguing over ownership of that small "L" of green land that touches the area of land coloured brown on the lease plan?

Is there another route for you to go between your garden and your flat? (I'm not suggesting at all that you should use an alternative. I'm just trying to understand how the neighbour can feel he can adopt exclusive usage of that area, and block your access).

Similarly, I presume the neighbour has been granted rights over that part of land shaded free so he has access to an exit onto public land at the back of your garden. Is that right?

Can you see why you have been granted usage rights over the land shaded brown on the plan? I can't see a reason for that.

As I said before, it's difficult to comment without sight of the leases. Ultimately it would be unusual for there to be a reason why he can force you to sign a deed of variation, and, if he wants to sell, he will be massively incentivised to get this issue resolved, and resolved fairly swiftly. It seems likely you are in a strong position here, and should be able to come out of this with a satisfactory result.

Good luck.

 

[Hotwired]

It sounds totally on the neighbour to get over being wrong if they want to sell the house.

You might humour them for whatever reason and sign away the land you're meant to be sharing but won't the freeholder have something to say about an alteration like that?