I want a good hifi, how much?

nO}{8 · 8 Jun 2006 at 16:12

I want a good hifi, and will have to save up. I want an idea before I start as to the £ I need. My freinds dads got a good hifi, I dont know the make but it cost a lot. It has to be left on all the time as it improves the sound, and has only 3 buttons on the front :confused:

This has really inspired me to get one as the clarity is exceptional. I produce music in my spare time and have been looking at some studio monitors and an amp. I dont want to play cd's, but do want to play vinyl and hook it up to my computer/pvr for mp3's.

heres a list of requirements:

play vinyl
no cds
studio monitoring
near field
stereo

any ideas?

Matblack · 8 Jun 2006 at 16:15

Budget?

To be honest the posibilities are endless

MB

DRZ · 8 Jun 2006 at 16:25

Do you want a studio setup or a hifi setup?

Unfortunately, the two dont really cross

When you say "vinyl" do you mean plug in your decks or do you want a really high quality turntable?

As MB has said, you need to post a budget. There are people on here with turntables that cost more than some cars do new :eek:

nO}{8 · 8 Jun 2006 at 16:55

ok ok, I know the budget is endless, but im a poor man

basically I want an amp with some speakers. the amp needs to have good connectivity as itll be used in a studio monitoring setup.

basically ive seen some Tannoy 600A's for £350 new and a Alesis RA300
Studio Reference Amplifier for £100.

what would be the obvious differences between this studio monitoring setup and a similar hifi one? is it that a studio setup's idea is to give a perfect ultra-linear sound and the home hifi's intentions are to colour the sound to create more depth?

ps, my budget is not over £1000, but would like to spend less than £500

DRZ · 8 Jun 2006 at 23:34

Hifi is the persuit of perfect sound quality. For the scientists amongst us, this is the perfection of absolute flatness ie totally faithful reproduction. Colouration is bad and is generally looked down upon as a bad trait. "Hifi" is usually the preserve of the rich(er) enthusiast, technical people and/or those who get carried away with brands, 'what hifi'-style language and perceptual differences based on the amount of money they have spent rather than what they actually here. In reality, for most people it is a way of tailoring the various distortions to suit their tastes.

Studio generally tends to mean "As cheap as physically possible whilst doing the job". What "the job" is depends on the studio! Abbey road use B&W Model Nautilus speakers, others use huge PMC monitors while some use crap powered monitors bought with the change from the upgraded desk simply because it had more lights. :rolleyes:

In terms of ampification, the term "studio" or "PA" should just be avoided. For the home, even if it is a cheap one, get a good HiFi stereo amp.

On the second hand market with an absolute limit of £500, you can get some reasonable stuff, extending this to flex to £800ish ought to get you some very nice kit indeed if you are prepared to do the legwork beforehand to know what you like and then wait for it to come up on the S/H market.

If you are going to go down the S/H route with that kind of money, assuming you will be using the phono stage found inside the amplifier, I would be looking for about a 50/50 split, perhaps more on the speakers if it means you get some in better condition (as they are the most easily damaged). For the legwork, I would be in hifi shops listening to new speakers in the £600-£1200 range (depending on how old you are prepared to go with s/h speakers) and integrateds in the £500-£1000 range.

nO}{8 · 8 Jun 2006 at 23:42

ive seen "hifi" valve amps (eg Leak TL12's), these are supposed to give warmth to the sound, is that not colouration? I just want a linear sound so that when it comes to mastering I can gauge the compression/limiting exactly etc.

philhoole · 8 Jun 2006 at 23:57

I

DRZ said:
Studio generally tends to mean "As cheap as physically possible whilst doing the job". What "the job" is depends on the studio! Abbey road use B&W Model Nautilus speakers, others use huge PMC monitors while some use crap powered monitors bought with the change from the upgraded desk simply because it had more lights.

I'm not sure I follow this. Neither the B&W or the PMC speakers can be described as just being able to do the job. Or are you saying these are an exception to the rule. Also, with powered speakers I have come across ATC,Genelec and PMC and none of these I would describe as "crap". Maybe there are other brands I haven't experienced?

daz · 9 Jun 2006 at 01:42

NS10s are still out and about too!

DRZ · 9 Jun 2006 at 02:26

philhoole said:
I

I'm not sure I follow this. Neither the B&W or the PMC speakers can be described as just being able to do the job. Or are you saying these are an exception to the rule. Also, with powered speakers I have come across ATC,Genelec and PMC and none of these I would describe as "crap". Maybe there are other brands I haven't experienced?

What I was trying to say by that was that for a studio like Abbey Road, B&W Model Nautilus speakers were the cheapest solution they found adequate. Same for the £40,000 PMC installations. Lesser studios buy cheaper kit, and by lesser I dont strictly mean those which make less money

Genelec active monitors are something I have had to use and tbh, they arent all that. In fact, the specs Genelec claim are good enough for some doctorate research so they were bought for the task. Real-world measurements in an anechoic environment exceeding all relevant standards showed them to fall drastically short - phone calls to Genelec ensued and I am unsure of the outcome.

no}{8 said:
ive seen "hifi" valve amps (eg Leak TL12's), these are supposed to give warmth to the sound, is that not colouration? I just want a linear sound so that when it comes to mastering I can gauge the compression/limiting exactly etc.

Two questions really:

Is the room you are going to listen to them in going to be perfect?

Do you believe that on a (relatively) shoestring budget you can hope to achieve linearity over the bandwidth of even CD? Warmth might indicate colouration, but it might also indicate a lack of colouration, given that the easiest form of colouration for an amplifier to introduce is high frequency harmonics...

nO}{8 · 9 Jun 2006 at 10:16

DRZ said:
Two questions really:

Is the room you are going to listen to them in going to be perfect?

-nup

Do you believe that on a (relatively) shoestring budget you can hope to achieve linearity over the bandwidth of even CD?

I did say that I dont want to use cd's, most of my samples are 24/96 and will be played through a soundcard, whats the best way to get the best sound from this situation? (within my budget)

Warmth might indicate colouration, but it might also indicate a lack of colouration, given that the easiest form of colouration for an amplifier to introduce is high frequency harmonics...

thanks for answering my original question :rolleyes:

DRZ · 9 Jun 2006 at 11:20

Thanks for the rolleyes!

I used CD as an example because its a pretty reasonable benchmark bandwidth to judge quality by. If you are dealing with even higher bandwidths than that, you need even better equipment. It had absolutely nothing to do with your use of CD or lack of it for that matter.

You say you arent going to be using the kit in a perfect room, the reason I asked is because this is the fastest way to destroy any linearity and you will reach a limit where no matter how good your kit is, it will all be coloured in *** same way. Perhaps getting some acoustic treatment for your room as well as your hifi might help if you are producing music in there. Obviously this depends on how serious about it you are etc, but it WILL make a significant difference to the sound

nO}{8 · 9 Jun 2006 at 12:00

sorry DRZ for the rolleyes. I just want some cheapish (by hifi standards) speakers and amps, Im no pro but I have a good ear.

Matblack · 9 Jun 2006 at 12:45

nO}{8 said:
sorry DRZ for the rolleyes. I just want some cheapish (by hifi standards) speakers and amps, Im no pro but I have a good ear.

Go to Richer Sounds or another hifi dealer and find a set up which fits your budget and listen to it, if you like it see if you can source it second hand or a similar higher quality model cheaper, this is the best advice that I can offer you tbh.

What your doing is like steping into the motors forum with the question

Spec me a car, it needs four wheels and an engine and I don't mind what it costs as long as its not too much. Your are going to get a mass of different answers none of which are going to be right because you are not being specific enough.

If you want my stock answer for a starter hifi then get on ebay and buy a set of KEF Q30s or Q10s & stands if you want smaller bookself style speakers and an Audiolab 8000A (which has a stunningly good vinyl stage for the money) or a Claymore amp and look for a good condition REGA Planer III turntable for the vinyl. Thats a good, inexpensive starter set up, its not a studio set up but from what little information you are giving it should do the job. Plus you can then use your experience to adapt the kit to your needs i.e. if its too harsh change the amp for another etc.

MB

nO}{8 · 9 Jun 2006 at 13:49

thanks matblack, those suggestions give me a good starting point and something to research on

BF-Bert · 9 Jun 2006 at 18:24

On the vinyl front a good Thorens TD150 or TD160 can be had on ebay for peanuts. Fine turntables capable of surprising results with a bit of care.