Impact of (possible) decline of gaming on Windows use?

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:10

Al Vallario said:
So, ultimately, the only thing countering the multitude of reasons to switch from Windows to OS X (aside from gaming purposes, of course) is the stubborness of existing Windows users who don't like change

Well either that, or the realisation that Windows and x86 PCs are y'know... better?

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:11

AJUK said:
1.67 million Macs were sold in the last quarter of this year, 'nuff said.

Dell alone probably shift that many PCs a month

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:16

Caged said:
Logical design and freedom from malware? To say "absolutely nothing" is just revealing that you have obviously never used it.

And I use the same OS at work as at home.

I've used it and I don't see what it offers me over Windows. In fact Windows offers me a lot more. There is a tendency among Mac users to believe that the only reason Windows users don't switch is that they haven't tried it. I've tried it, it was interesting to play with for a while but I soon got sick of its way of doing things and returned to something which just works without fuss.

For example, I want my windows maximised thanks - but Steve Jobs has decided this is wrong so I'm not allowed, unless I bugger about dragging the window manually to the top left corner, to the exact pixel (why not adopt the 'sticky windows' á la KDE?) and then drag the size from the bottom right to maximise it - but still above the dock of course. Ah yes the dock, where if it is small enough to give you enough screen real estate, it takes longer to find and click your program of choice than selecting it, in alphabetical order, from the start menu. And then there is minimised windows in the dock, which can look identical and the only way to differentiate them is to mouse over them to see their name. Unlike in Windows where I just look down at the taskbar and read it. Quicker, more intuitive.

Oh and does OS X have a system tray icon for network activity yet? Something Windows has had since what, 3.1?

Caged · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:19

The problem I always had with the taskbar (and as a result of the way MS name things) is that it didn't take long (8 open Office windows or so) before every item on the taskbar was "Microsof...". I much prefer the dock giving me a preview of every window, and having Exposé to give me an instant overview.

I've tried Flip3D and I still don't think it's quite there in this regard.

Since I got a Mac I've been not maximising windows on Windows machines, and it's made a huge difference to the way I work (improvement).

Oh and does OS X have a system tray icon for network activity yet? Something Windows has had since what, 3.1?

You can change the dock icon for Activity Monitor to a network activity graph if you like.

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:22

How many people have eight separate Office windows open at once? And of course they would look all alike in the dock as well, as you say. If you really want exposé on Windows there are simple freeware programs which mimic the OS X feature.

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:23

Caged said:
Since I got a Mac I've been not minimising windows on Windows machines, and it's made a huge difference to the way I work (improvement).

In Windows you don't need to maximise the windows either - you get a choice :eek:

Of course with Jobs, it's his way or forget it.

Caged · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:25

dirtydog said:
How many people have eight separate Office windows open at once? And of course they would look all alike in the dock as well, as you say. If you really want exposé on Windows there are simple freeware programs which mimic the OS X feature.

I'm not going to even attempt to compare OSX to Windows with extra programs running, since the argument would never end.

Asking questions like "oh who would use it that way" is the same way as me saying "well who would want their entire screen taken up by a single window anyway?". There's no point going into arguments based on what we think people do and don't do.

zetec452 · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:29

Caged said:
Asking questions like "oh who would use it that way" is the same way as me saying "well who would want their entire screen taken up by a single window anyway?". There's no point going into arguments based on what we think people do and don't do.

Indeed, its a user preference. User should have the choice.

.

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:31

Caged said:
I'm not going to even attempt to compare OSX to Windows with extra programs running, since the argument would never end.

Asking questions like "oh who would use it that way" is the same way as me saying "well who would want their entire screen taken up by a single window anyway?". There's no point going into arguments based on what we think people do and don't do.

I bet more people like maximised windows, than use eight windows of one application.

In fact doesn't Office show the filename of the file first, in the titlebar, before 'Microsoft Office' ? So you would be easily able to see what was what. Failing that you can have stacked windows in the taskbar.

What gets me is how so many simple things are so complicated in OS X. How can something so utterly basic as maximising a window be made so difficult? Oh and the last time I used it, some windows maximise easier than others - another criticism of OS X - it doesn't give a consistent user experience. From memory, Firefox windows maximise horizontally and vertically, but Safari ones only maximise vertically, is that right? If you want it horizontal too, you have to do it yourself...

Caged · 23 Dec 2006 at 11:43

I think that's because Firefox isn't a Cocoa app and doesn't use standard UI widgets, because it's a cross platform app. This is also why it looks slightly different to other Windows windows.

At the end of the day, use what you prefer, but I wouldn't say OS X makes everything 'difficult'. Since switching I've spent more time actually doing things, rather than trying to work out why my computer has randomly started taking 5 minutes to shut itself down, and to me not having to worry about anything is worth the small amount of extra money it cost.

Use what you want, these arguments are pointless. The OP was about whether a decline of games on Windows would cause people to change OS. I doubt it, since people are likely to just stick with what they know. Just because they no longer use their Windows machine for gaming doesn't mean they will suddenly jump over to a Mac, maybe they have software they use that is Windows only, or maybe they don't really care. I don't care what OS people use (unless I have to support it), I just use what works for me. At the moment that's OS X. Maybe Apple will drop the ball and I'll be back on Vista by 2009, who knows.

NathanE · 23 Dec 2006 at 12:08

The taskbar is resizable you know... I use a double height taskbar across two monitors. It offers me more than enough space for programs and I never get the "Microso..." effect. That's not to say the taskbar is perfect though... Microsoft is aware it's outdated and they're going to replace it in the next client release.

Glaucus · 23 Dec 2006 at 12:23

Caged said:
Logical design and freedom from malware? To say "absolutely nothing" is just revealing that you have obviously never used it.

And I use the same OS at work as at home.

I'm talking about a normal user, it's far from logical as they have been using windows anything that is not set up identically to windows will mean a new learning curve, Malware is not a problem on windows. You could take a windows power user, who has got there though work and put them on osx and they wouldn't have a clue how to ddo some of the more advanced syuff. Simple things like maximizing windows is painful.
And yes I have used it and offers nothing for a normal user. Oh and a large proportion of the osx is there purely for graphical design.

Why would some who uses windows at work, knows how to alter the look of windows to suit them, even knows the basics of the control panel. Suddenly decide to change to osx. Thus throwing there computer in the bin and buying a computer which is more rip of the pc prices just to change to a OS that does nothing for them. Same with gamers. Most know windows inside side out. Why relearn everything.

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 12:30

NathanE said:
That's not to say the taskbar is perfect though... Microsoft is aware it's outdated and they're going to replace it in the next client release.

That worries me to be honest

I disagree with them (and you?) that it is outdated and it strikes me as change for change's sake. But seeing as MS did that with Vista's GUI in some important respects, I am nervous about their plans for the next Windows client post Vista.

Caged · 23 Dec 2006 at 12:42

AcidHell2 said:

I'm going to leave this thread now since there's no point trying to have a discussion about merits and differences of various operating systems with someone who insists that for anything to be usable it has to work exactly the same as Windows. Malware not a problem on Windows? I suppose AIDS isn't a problem in Africa either? If OS X offered nothing that Windows can't do, then why the hell do people get themselves locked into a single hardware vendor by using it?

Glaucus · 23 Dec 2006 at 12:53

Caged said:
I'm going to leave this thread now since there's no point trying to have a discussion about merits and differences of various operating systems with someone who insists that for anything to be usable it has to work exactly the same as Windows. Malware not a problem on Windows? I suppose AIDS isn't a problem in Africa either? If OS X offered nothing that Windows can't do, then why the hell do people get themselves locked into a single hardware vendor by using it?

That's not what i'm saying Im saying for 90% of the population, they're not interested in the os only that they can use it. That's why Ms have the monopoly and will continue to have the monopoly.

leezer3 · 23 Dec 2006 at 12:59

I suppose I'm almost in a unique position here

- I've used both Windows, Linux & OSX exensively. My thoughts on OSX & the MacBook Pro are in this thread: http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=17645888

Windows- Only reason it's still here is for playing games properly. Unstable heap of junk, and requires far too many third-party apps to get it to what I consider to be a usable state (ObjectBar, RocketDock & various small theme & explorer patches) Even then the OS is a total pain & I'd very much like to get rid of it entirely, but thats not on the cards sadly.

OSX- Fanboy heaven. Very nicely integrated, but its OSX's way, or not at all. Probably too biased through 9 years of Linux usage & customisation, but see the thread I linked to above for the full ramble.

Linux- IMHO where its at. Yes, very easy to break the whole system with a single typo, and can be a pain to update a hugely customised system, but thats half the fun of it

I really couldn't do without the customisation that comes with Linux, and the ability to do things my own way. If it only played games.....

-Leezer-

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 13:01

Caged said:
If OS X offered nothing that Windows can't do, then why the hell do people get themselves locked into a single hardware vendor by using it?

People who like Apple's stylish computers perhaps? Also people who haven't used Windows for a long time? I've visited Mac forums and read tripe you wouldn't believe - like saying that once a Windows program crashes (which happens all the time of course!) it takes down the whole operating system, necessitating a reboot. Sheer ignorance like that will account for some of its users also.

Macro · 23 Dec 2006 at 13:13

leezer3 said:
Linux- IMHO where its at. Yes, very easy to break the whole system with a single typo, and can be a pain to update

So it's difficult to use, fagile, hard to keep updated and secure, has limited application availability and doesn't play games...

Yup I can see why you think it's a great OS compared to Windows...

dirtydog · 23 Dec 2006 at 13:23

Seeing as it is free, I certainly wish I agreed that Linux was great. Rather than the pile of poo that it is

Glaucus · 23 Dec 2006 at 13:33

leezer3 said:
Linux- IMHO where its at. Yes, very easy to break the whole system with a single typo, and can be a pain to update a hugely customised system, but thats half the fun of it
I really couldn't do without the customisation that comes with Linux, and the ability to do things my own way. If it only played games.....

-Leezer-

And this is why linux unless they change there approach will never become mainstream. Most people need a computer which is a doodle to set up and once it's set up is easy to use and stable. As much as people hate it. XP is very stable and you can run it for years with no problems. They don't really mind what it looks like as long as they can browse the web and open office and do some writing there happy.

More on the title of games affecting. I don't think gamers would move to OSX and think they would move to WMC They'll still have there music, there video's there downloads. WMC is a much better option for gamers than OSX if they give games up for consoles.