Internet without Openreach - options?

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Yadda

Yadda

Yadda

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I've had a problem with my FTTC broadband for the last 2 months which neither my ISP (supposedly one of the better ones for customer service) or Openreach have been able to resolve.

Unfortunately this has tarnished my opinion of the whole ISP-->OR setup we're cursed with in the UK and I'm looking at other options.

Apart from cable, what options are there for a reasonably fast connection (40Mb+) suitable for gaming that don't involve the Openreach infrastructure?

Thanks.
 
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There aren’t any. Unless you live in Hull or are served by Gigaclear/B4rn/Hyperoptic and there’s still an element of Openreach in some of those networks.
 
wildest_jjk said:
I would have hoped Plusnet could sort it out. Any ideas what the problem is?
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Speed down to ~8Mb from a solid 35Mb (for years).

You name it, they've suggested it, but nothing has fixed it. We're just going around in circles.

ISP: "Have you tried the test socket?"
ISP: "Oh, you're on our legacy system (? no idea), it was lucky I spotted that! (really?) Should be fixed now..." - Nope.
ISP: "have you tried the test socket?"
ISP: "Faults fixed at the exchange! Should be good now..." - Nope.
ISP: "Have you tried the test socket?"
OR engineer visit: "Your copper path is fine, the problem's upstream with your ISP".
ISP: "We'll arrange another engineer visit, have you tried the test socket?"

**** that for a game of soldiers!
 
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Yadda said:
Speed down to ~8Mb from a solid 35Mb (for years).

You name it, they've suggested it, but nothing has fixed it. We're just going around in circles.

ISP: "Have you tried the test socket?"
ISP: "Oh, you're on our legacy system, it was lucky I spotted that! Should be fixed now..." - Nope.
ISP: "have you tried the test socket?"
ISP: "Faults fixed at the exchange! Should be good now..." - Nope.
ISP: "Have you tried the test socket?"
OR engineer visit: "Your copper path is fine, the problem's upstream with your ISP".
ISP: "We'll arrange another engineer visit, have you tried the test socket?"

**** that for a game of soldiers!
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As has been said, your ISP doesn't control the profiles, DLM or speed capable due to both. Your ISP only gets control once it hits the exchange and crosses over onto their network. I'd ask Openreach to come out again and be ADAMANT that the Engineer calls DCoE (Digital Centre of Excellence, their escalation route) for advice.

Is your trained in speed actually 8192kbps? If so that definitely sounds like a profile issue which DCoE should be able to resolve.
 
MissChief said:
As has been said, your ISP doesn't control the profiles, DLM or speed capable due to both. Your ISP only gets control once it hits the exchange and crosses over onto their network. I'd ask Openreach to come out again and be ADAMANT that the Engineer calls DCoE (Digital Centre of Excellence, their escalation route) for advice.

Is your trained in speed actually 8192kbps? If so that definitely sounds like a profile issue which DCoE should be able to resolve.
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Thanks. The speeds I quote are from the speed tests I've run (as instructed). Strangely, resetting the modem & router used to bring the speed back up to 35 for a day or so before dropping again but not today: after I swapped everything out at my end out (new modem, router, DSL cable and removing the faceplate and connecting through a microfilter into the test socket), now it just sits at 12 all the time.

Edit: according to the Plusnet router (the one I installed today, replacing my Tplink), my "DSL Line Status" is 35 down, 6.169 up. However, when I run a speed test (Ookla) I get 11.xx down.

@MissChief do you work for an ISP? If so can I ask which one? The fact you haven't asked if I've tried connecting through the test socket in every reply is a refreshing change from what I've been used to. :D
 
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Order a new service with a new line while your Plusnet is still active (so you don’t get put on the same VDSL port). Cancel it if/when nobody can get you to your guaranteed speed.

I think you have a lazy ISP issue, rather than anything fundamental. I’ve never heard Plusnet described as one of the better providers for customer service - used them for a business a few years back and they dragged their heels for two weeks to replace a £30 Thomson DSL router that was rebooting itself on a daily basis.
 
Caged said:
Order a new service with a new line while your Plusnet is still active (so you don’t get put on the same VDSL port). Cancel it if/when nobody can get you to your guaranteed speed.
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So the OP will get stuck with the cost of installing a new line and/or the cost of a full cease on the existing line?
 
The Ofcom voluntary code specifies that customers aren’t held to term on the linked line rental if their broadband speed doesn’t reach the minimum guaranteed when signing up. So they wouldn’t be held to term if there was a fault.

Yes there would be a new line install, but I think it’s a better option than abandoning fixed line services entirely.
 
If the new line does work then it's an expensive option. You'll need to pay for the new line and also to get rid of the existing line (broadband cease charge).

If the new line doesn't work you may get away with not paying anything, but you're no better off with the broadband.

From what the OP has written Openreach have only been out once. It's not that unusual for multiple visits to be required.

Objecting to Plusnet repeating the test socket suggestion and their warnings that he may be charged if Openreach come out and find a fault with the OP's equipment is just silly. The two things are connected and are both things that every ISP will tell you.
 
bremen1874 said:
If the new line does work then it's an expensive option. You'll need to pay for the new line and also to get rid of the existing line (broadband cease charge).

If the new line doesn't work you may get away with not paying anything, but you're no better off with the broadband.

From what the OP has written Openreach have only been out once. It's not that unusual for multiple visits to be required.

Objecting to Plusnet repeating the test socket suggestion and their warnings that he may be charged if Openreach come out and find a fault with the OP's equipment is just silly. The two things are connected and are both things that every ISP will tell you.
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We (Sky) make no mention of any charge as we trust our staff to make the right decision. Sure we keep track of the number of engineers booked and work to reduce the Openreach bill but we haven’t passed on an Openreach charge, even for no fault found, in years that I know of. We used to mention it, in fact I can still remember most of the statement I said it that often but it’s easily three, maybe four years since we said it.

If the speed is being capped by the ISP then ask them to investigate with their network team. Or ask for the engineer to call DCoE and ask for a temporary port change for testing purposes.
 
Fair enough if Sky absorbs those costs, that can only be a good thing for the customer.

With a warning about charges, or not, would you expect a customer to refuse an Openreach visit if offered? If the customer uses the test socket and the ISP supplied router then there's basically zero chance of a chargeback.

It doesn't sound like a capping issue because the OP has mentioned getting different download speeds.
 
With Plusnet, if you haven't already then it's worth posting on Twitter, or on the community forums - make enough of a fuss and you'll get escalated to "gold" response (or whatever it is called) via Openreach.

Unfortunately had to do this on one occasion shortly after I joined Plusnet, but on the odd other occasion that I've had to contact Plusnet, I've not had any issues.
 
Yadda said:
Edit: according to the Plusnet router (the one I installed today, replacing my Tplink), my "DSL Line Status" is 35 down, 6.169 up. However, when I run a speed test (Ookla) I get 11.xx down.
Click to expand...

Caged said:
The Ofcom voluntary code specifies that customers aren’t held to term on the linked line rental if their broadband speed doesn’t reach the minimum guaranteed when signing up. So they wouldn’t be held to term if there was a fault.
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If it's syncing at 35 and that's what the Op's been happy with for years, then i'm going with either user error (speedtest on wifi/VPN etc.) or using an inappropriate test location.

Op you could go with Three's 4G unlimited data plan or look at 3rd party networks, they are usually quite localised and many of the community options are underpinned by OR.
 
Yadda said:
I take it 4G latency is an issue?
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4G is generally a poor substitute for a fixed line overall - for instance though it can get great speeds you will often see very varied page loading time and pages with lots of different data elements can take far longer to finish loading it all in.

Gaming wise it is very hit and miss - for instance I currently have backup Vodafone 4G via my phone and Virgin Media 4G in a dedicated router with a proper installation so gets better reception than the Vodafone (in theory) as well as my FTTC.

FTTC gets 70Mbit down, 19MBit up and flat 6ms latency to UK game servers.
Vodafone 4G 50Mbit down, 25Mbit up and fairly stable ~30ms latency
Virgin 4G 30Mbit down, 10Mbit up and moderately varied 100ms latency

FTTC is good for gaming, the Vodafone connection is pretty much like playing games on ADSL with interleaving on so reasonable it is very playable but you do slightly notice the latency while the Virgin connection is playable but far from an ideal experience and gets some intermittent pauses.

However I've tried playing on the Vodafone connection in several different parts of the country and I don't have to go far from my current location and it performs similar to the Virgin Media one and probably vice versa if I moved the VM connection elsewhere there are probably places where it is almost as good as a fixed connection. I've been to some places where 4G would be completely unplayable with latency constantly spiking to 1000+ms, etc.
 
Armageus said:
With Plusnet, if you haven't already then it's worth posting on Twitter, or on the community forums - make enough of a fuss and you'll get escalated to "gold" response (or whatever it is called) via Openreach.

Unfortunately had to do this on one occasion shortly after I joined Plusnet, but on the odd other occasion that I've had to contact Plusnet, I've not had any issues.
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Their forums can be very effective. I recently transferred my mother's broadband from Virgin to Plusnet and suffered from various Openreach related issues. I managed to get them all sorted via the forum and didn't have to call them once.
 
Avalon said:
If it's syncing at 35 and that's what the Op's been happy with for years, then i'm going with either user error (speedtest on wifi/VPN etc.) or using an inappropriate test location.
*snip*.
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Fair enough, but I assure you it's not user error. Whether you believe me or not, bear in mind that the OR engineer saw the speed test results during his visit and also ran his own tests.

Armageus said:
With Plusnet, if you haven't already then it's worth posting on Twitter, or on the community forums - make enough of a fuss and you'll get escalated to "gold" response (or whatever it is called) via Openreach.

Unfortunately had to do this on one occasion shortly after I joined Plusnet, but on the odd other occasion that I've had to contact Plusnet, I've not had any issues.
Click to expand...

Thanks Armageus, I'll bear that in mind although to be honest I'm not sure I have the appetite to deal with them any more.

Rroff said:
4G is generally a poor substitute for a fixed line overall - for instance though it can get great speeds you will often see very varied page loading time and pages with lots of different data elements can take far longer to finish loading it all in.

Gaming wise it is very hit and miss - for instance I currently have backup Vodafone 4G via my phone and Virgin Media 4G in a dedicated router with a proper installation so gets better reception than the Vodafone (in theory) as well as my FTTC.

FTTC gets 70Mbit down, 19MBit up and flat 6ms latency to UK game servers.
Vodafone 4G 50Mbit down, 25Mbit up and fairly stable ~30ms latency
Virgin 4G 30Mbit down, 10Mbit up and moderately varied 100ms latency

FTTC is good for gaming, the Vodafone connection is pretty much like playing games on ADSL with interleaving on so reasonable it is very playable but you do slightly notice the latency while the Virgin connection is playable but far from an ideal experience and gets some intermittent pauses.

However I've tried playing on the Vodafone connection in several different parts of the country and I don't have to go far from my current location and it performs similar to the Virgin Media one and probably vice versa if I moved the VM connection elsewhere there are probably places where it is almost as good as a fixed connection. I've been to some places where 4G would be completely unplayable with latency constantly spiking to 1000+ms, etc.
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Thanks Rroff.

It looks like I'm stuck with <an ISP> & Openreach. Looking through the UK ISP customer reviews doesn't exactly fill me with confidence. Choosing one is like deciding which testicle I'd like to be kicked. Anyway, mysteriously my speed test result seems to be about 32 at the moment even though nothing's changed as far as I know so that's something, at least.

Edit:

Missed this one. :)

bremen1874 said:
Objecting to Plusnet repeating the test socket suggestion and their warnings that he may be charged if Openreach come out and find a fault with the OP's equipment is just silly.
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You're entitled to your opinion but they have lost my confidence. Some of us don't enjoy going round and around the same merry-go-round, being asked and told the same things over and over again. Especially when it conflicts with what someone else has said. It reeks of shambles and I have no more time for it.
 
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