Jacob Blake

Caporegime
Joined
29 Jan 2008
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59,131
Was reluctant to post this one but it is an interesting one in terms of how things can be stretched in the current climate from limited info and a viral video only showing part of an incident into outrage and rioting/local businesses burned down. This is the incident that started several days of rioting in Kenosha.

Below is part of a post that went a bit waffly in the Trump thread - please try to keep any Trump/US politics discussion in there, this is intended to be more about the incident itself and how it gets reported, social media and reaction on the streets etc...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Jacob_Blake

A black alleged "rapist" or alleged sexual assualter (technically he'd previously "raped" the victim by forcably penetrating her with his finger, in front of their child) turned up at his victim's house armed with a knife (she's also his on off GF and "baby momma") while still wanted by police(outstanding warrant for sexual assault, domestic abuse) and stole her keys... he goes outside, police arrive and there is a scuffle, they scuffle with him on the grass at the rear passenger side of the car, then he pulls the knife and they get back from him, they try a taser... doesn't work...then he goes around to his car and opens the door - from the POV of the officer (given this is the US and guns are everywhere and he's only just pulled a knife on them) they don't let him go any further and shoot him 7 times in the back as he reaches into the car.. no gun is found.

Was it excessive - sure, perhaps it was, perhaps a second taser could have been deployed, perhaps an officer could have taken a greater risk with the presence of a knife and tackled him... (do they absolutely have to take a risk like that though when they have firearms?). This guy is now hospitalised and potentially paralised from the waist down.

The way it was portrayed though was the usual rush to outcry - the clip shown was a viral one only showing the later part of the incident on the driver's side of the car - all we see is him moving around to open his car door and the police officer shooting him in the back.. out of context it looks horrific. Twitter blows up, celebrities tweet it - another example of racist policing - here this is another completely irrelevant clip of the cops conducting a traffic stop on an angry white person notice how he doesn't get shot.... therefore racism.

The media certainly doesn't help matters, ket bits of info are omitted or drip fed post outrage - outrage is better for news events. With the interviews of his family being presented the way they were plenty of people were left with the impression that he'd been killed by the police... "say his name" etc.. certainly the fact he was a sex offender and domestic abuser turning up at his victim's address wasn't very prominent as that does undermine the narrative, that he was armed with a knife was left ambiguous too - drip fed as a knife being found in the car... (eagle eyed social media users spotted he was seemingly carrying it in the video footage days ago) the more pertinent detail that it was found in the car because he'd pulled the knife out when struggling with officers and still had it in his hand when going back and reaching into the car was left out still initially... it has only come out now not because of information from the local prosecutor but because the police union has confirmed it.

He was originally handcuffed to his bed in hosptial, this got some negative publicity (though apparently is standard there), he's now not as the warrants are not in force thanks ot him posting a bond (presumably from the donations that have flooded in) - one dubious aspect of this, now this guy is a celebrated victim of police brutality is the awkward nature of his outstanding charge for sexual assualt - will there now be presure on a sexual assualt victim to drop the charges so Jacob Blake can carry on being held up as a victim or will they drop him quietly and no longer say his name?

So far over 2 million dollars have been raised on gofundme for a domestic abuser/sexual assualter who turned up to his victim's house with a knife - someone who abuses women shouldn't ordinarily be a SJW cause celebre but sometiems it seems things are so far gone that the identity politics part is more improtant to some than his actions - he wasn't some random person who happened to be black, the police were called by the victim specifically to deal with him and knew he was wanted:

https://www.gofundme.com/f/justiceforjacobblake

Even gofundme is political now - the unhinged LARPer cop wannabe kid who shot three had his fundraiser pulled pretty quickly by the site... his is hosted on some conservative christian fundraising site.

Initial footage released:

Second angle:

How CNN portrays the second angle/additional footage:

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/us/2...g-second-video-family-attorney-newday-vpx.cnn
 
If only he had stopped on their order and dropped the knife, and not gone to the car.....would likely not have been shot.

I'm sure if a white guy had behaved the same the outcome would have been identical.
 
These groups are simply using black people being shot by police as an excuse to bring the country to ruins and take over. They don't care if the guy was doing something wrong at the time. They probably celebrate when this sort of thing happens because they know they can exploit it to further their cause, which they have.
 
These groups are simply using black people being shot by police as an excuse to bring the country to ruins and take over.

Pretty much, given the prevalence of mobile phones then no matter what police reform occurs or how much things improve (and they have improved over time regardless) - with a big population of hundreds of millions and the presence of guns and armed criminals inevitably there will be incidents where people are shot by the police, inevitably some of these people will be black and that fact alone can be enough to make the clip go viral and generate outrage... there isn't an obvious end to that - this race baiting can carry on regardless of whether there is even is any real underlying race issue re: police shootings, it just requires people to perpetuate the dubious perception that there is and to get angry about the perceived issue.

This article sums it up quite nicely - reactions to these events/riots are the result of perceptions (not exactly helped by the media in the US) - so long as the US is a gun country then the risk of this sort of inteaction is always there along with the chance of it being filmed, going viral and playing into this perception.

https://www.city-journal.org/reflections-on-race-riots-and-police
First, America is a huge country—the third largest in the world by population. That means that extremely low-probability events (such as police shootings) will happen much more frequently here than they do elsewhere. For instance, if America were the size of Canada, but otherwise identical, about six unarmed people would have been killed by police last year, not 55.

Second, America is a gun country, which makes policing in America fundamentally different than policing in other nations. When cops pull someone over in the United Kingdom, where the rate of gun ownership is less than one-twentieth the American rate, they have almost no reason to fear that the person they’ve stopped has a pistol hidden in the glove compartment. That’s not true in America, where a cop gets shot just about every day. So long as we are a gun country, American police will always be liable to mistake a suspect’s wallet or smartphone for a gun. And we will not be able to legislate that fact away—at least not completely.

A third factor (not unique to America) is that we live in the smartphone age. Which means that there are millions of cameras at the ready to ensure that the next police shooting goes viral. Overall, this is a good thing. It means that cops can no longer reliably get away with lying about their misbehavior to escape punishment. (And that the claims of those accusing police in such situations will face objective video scrutiny.) But it also means that our news feeds are perpetually filled with outlier events presented to us as if they were the norm. In other words, we could cut the rate of deadly shootings by 99 percent, but if the remaining 1 percent are filmed, then the public perception will be that shootings have remained steady. And it is the public perception, more than the underlying reality, that provokes riots.

Combine all three of these observations and one arrives at a grim conclusion: as long as we have a non-zero rate of deadly shootings (a virtual certainty), and as long as some shootings are filmed and go viral (also a virtual certainty), then we may live in perpetual fear of urban unrest for the foreseeable future.
 
You guys are below a couple of levels, your saying the media don't help etc but in reality it's a lot more scripted and coordinated than you think, there are people in power, media, politicians, corporate people, antifa groups that are exploiting any incident like this, it's all about the upcoming election and trying to discredit or remove trump.

It's a lot more sinister, billionaires funding all these street level groups to create chaos and it disrupts the order of things and as I said is an attempt to make trump look incompetent depending on how he handles it.

But it is good entertainment and if I grew up in America I may well have been on the side of the protesters and agitators. Who knows.
 
If only he had stopped on their order and dropped the knife, and not gone to the car.....would likely not have been shot.

I'm sure if a white guy had behaved the same the outcome would have been identical.
So far the only people who claim he had a knife on him are the police, and iirc they're saying it was in the car.
I don't know about anyone else here, but I currently have several "knives" in my car, I have two in the front of the car in case of a need to cut the seat belt, and another in the boot.
Having a knife in your car means zero, as most trades people/handy people, or even just people who like me find the need for one will have them.
I have mine in the centre console (penknife with a decent blade), the glasses holder above my head (small box cutter with 3/4" blade that retracts when you stop pushing it forward with the thumb slider) and the boot (box cutter in the bag with tools and emergency gear) - the first two are mainly for if I need to cut the seat belt as it means they're both secure and easy to reach even if the car goes over, but get frequent use breaking down boxes when going to the tip, or cutting things like strapping on wood bundles.

Rapist? should have blown his head off^^
Accused, not been to trial as I understand it. Unless you think that anyone accused of rape should be killed without trial.
Also if he was out on bail in america for that, it suggests the police really weren't worried about him as they'll lock you away pretrial for months or years if they have any doubts, or even if you just can't afford a few thousand dollars for bail for a minor crime.
 
At the end of the day the types that go into the police are usually nationalist, egotistical, gun ho, proud etc. That generally means they think they are superior to other people and hence look down on people. So a shooting like this could be seen as a trophy shooting and they know they have the state on their side, good lawyers, preferential treatment etc. The thin blue line and all that. I've no doubt that many of their police are still racist and see black people as subjects. Just how it is. People gonna hate.
 
There have been plenty of incidents where the assailant has fully complied but was still shot dead.

Sure, but that doesn't excuse what he did either.....

Think about it from a cops perspective. You ignore the cop walk to your car to reach in and grab something (potentially a gun).

What did he expect was going to happen?
 
Sure, but that doesn't excuse what he did either.....

Think about it from a cops perspective. You ignore the cop walk to your car to reach in and grab something (potentially a gun).

What did he expect was going to happen?

Depends on state of mind, possibly drugged up or drunk or just totally out of touch with these kinds of things. Their system doesn't have much sympathy for the people at the bottom of the ladder.
 
Depends on state of mind, possibly drugged up or drunk or just totally out of touch with these kinds of things. Their system doesn't have much sympathy for the people at the bottom of the ladder.

There are also too many guns. There is definitely a problem with american police though. They seem far too eager to escalate things from some of videos i've seen in the past.
 
Moral of the story is this, if the police have their guns drawn on you and are telling you to stop then you do not walk away and reach inside your car.
Even if you do as they say in the US, you're likely to get shot.

A few years ago there was a guy who was lying on the ground with his hands in the air complying with the police (whilst also trying to talk to a confused/scared patient of his) who got shot several times.
You want to know what the officer replied when he asked why he shot? Reportedly it was "I don't know".

They're poorly trained and all too often resort to using guns as their first and only option, and do it out of all proportion when dealing with black men.
 
So far the only people who claim he had a knife on him are the police, and iirc they're saying it was in the car.
I don't know about anyone else here, but I currently have several "knives" in my car, I have two in the front of the car in case of a need to cut the seat belt, and another in the boot.
Having a knife in your car means zero, as most trades people/handy people, or even just people who like me find the need for one will have them.

That isn't correct, they're saying he had it on him, thus the bit in the clip where they step back, draw guns etc..

The point re: the car isn't really what was eventually found in there - of course there was a knife found if it was in his hand, but what he might have pulled from the car given it is the US (where a cop is shot nearly every day) and given that he's already been willing to pull a knife - how do they know he won't now pull a gun and can they easily tackle him given he currently has a knife and the taser has failed?

Perhaps it was still excessive force but I don't think this is a particularly bad example given the non compliance, struggle with the officers trying to restrain him and attempt to use non-lethal force first.

That you also have a knife in your car isn't particularly relevant, the context is entirely different - your knives are incidental and have a completely different purpose, this knife is a weapon he had in his hand.

That you've skimmed over this detail is a good illustration of the dubious reporting, drip feeding of information about a story like this.

Even if you do as they say in the US, you're likely to get shot.

Completely flase, you're very unlikely to be shot, very few police encounters result in shootings, even non-compliant suspects can still be unlikely to be shot. This is a misconception, probably down to these outlier incidents getting lots of attention. You're incredibly unlikely to be shot if you do what they say... it's possible but it certainly isn't likely.

They're poorly trained and all too often resort to using guns as their first and only option, and do it out of all proportion when dealing with black men.

Poorly trained (relative to UK and other European police) yes, that they do it out of proportion when dealing with black men - that's dubious... given they're dealing with a suspect I'm not sure there is any good evidence to suggest that if that suspect is black they're more likely to be shot.
 
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