Jamie Oliver restaurants goes into administration

MikeTheNative · 14 Jan 2020 at 11:20

The food industry is a really difficult place to be but I don't think it helps when you have a few Italian chains that seem to merge into one. Zizzi, Prezzo, Bella Italia, Ask Italian etc. All seem quite similar in not only menu choice but often the decoration in the restaurants itself.

Rotty · 14 Jan 2020 at 11:25

Bear said:
Ive been to Italy many times and the food is fantastic, Italian restaurants in the UK not so great. I cant ever recall ever having a bad meal in Italy, the same could not be said of France. Had some pretty lousy meals in France considering how much they like to say how great their food is.

Yes was more referring to UK Italian, I have not been to Italy

100% agree re France, the top end stuff is great, run of the mill restaurants are often pretty awful

jpaul · 14 Jan 2020 at 11:52

yes, even the autostrada motorway restaurants, and the mountain refuges in italy (bozano) are good in Italy;
haven't yet seen heston's latest RT inteview where he apparently says food quality dimished because people are preoccupied by photos

Jokester · 14 Jan 2020 at 16:28

Never, ever had a bad meal in Italy, even going to the typical back street worker cafes for lunch is great.

Pudney · 14 Jan 2020 at 17:33

Semple said:
Unfortunately that's the way businesses work in the UK, the owner can keep the business a separate entity so that they're not liable for any debts should the business collapse.

You can almost guarantee that if UK law changed to hold business owners personally liable for any debts, that a lot more would be done in these scenarios. Rather than a cut and let loose scenario.

Jamie Oliver sunk millions into this venture. He propped it up for far too long.

Drumroll · 15 Jan 2020 at 08:25

Jokester said:
Never, ever had a bad meal in Italy, even going to the typical back street worker cafes for lunch is great.

Few reasons for it: Italians, as many others, when going out for a meal, they go out for a meal, to enjoy. You won't see someone swallowing 3 courses in 30 minutes because os going to the cinema short after that. The immediate solution in UK is to keep all ready or partly ready, so a main course can be on your table in 5 minutes. The mindset is: customers here, NORMALLY, aren't that likely to complain if the food arrives fast. Part of my training 14 years ago when working for Chiquitos.
Another reason is the adaptation rooted here: just ask for a Carbonara in Rome or a Bolognese in Bologna.
I visit Italy at least twice a year, and would strongly recommend Perugia. Pretty much everything still authentic. I would only recommend Florence for the visit, but food, the worst I ever had in Italy. Was a struggle to find something authentic. Still options, but hidden.

Energize · 17 Jan 2020 at 20:21

tom_e said:
Was that festering for so many months you suddenly had to necro the thread to let it out?

Wow, someone's triggered.

Sometimes the forum doesn't load the most recent threads, this article was news to me, deal with it.

tom_e · 17 Jan 2020 at 20:30

Energize said:
Wow, someone's triggered.

Sometimes the forum doesn't load the most recent threads, this article was news to me, deal with it.

Not triggered in the slightest just seemed a very strange post to bump an old thread with that's all, don't stress about it.

EVH5150 · 18 Jan 2020 at 22:40

Semple said:
Unfortunately that's the way businesses work in the UK, the owner can keep the business a separate entity so that they're not liable for any debts should the business collapse.

You can almost guarantee that if UK law changed to hold business owners personally liable for any debts, that a lot more would be done in these scenarios. Rather than a cut and let loose scenario.

I know of someone who voluntarily liquated their business with over 600k of debt and yet still manages to live a good life style with luxury holidays abroad and their 2.5 million pound Cotswold home, it's utterly disgusting and needs to be changed.

Energize · 3 Feb 2020 at 04:08

EVH5150 said:
I know of someone who voluntarily liquated their business with over 600k of debt and yet still manages to live a good life style with luxury holidays abroad and their 2.5 million pound Cotswold home, it's utterly disgusting and needs to be changed.

Aye, unlimited liability should apply to directors of limited companies that are negligent.

Hotwired · 3 Feb 2020 at 04:32

Energize said:
Aye, unlimited liability should apply to directors of limited companies that are negligent.

Negligent directors can indeed lose the protection of limited liability:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1986/45/section/214

Energize · 3 Feb 2020 at 04:34

Hotwired said:
Negligent directors can indeed lose the protection of limited liability:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1986/45/section/214

In reality though when has that ever actually happened?

Hotwired · 3 Feb 2020 at 04:46

Energize said:
In reality though when has that ever actually happened?

Dammed if I know, I'm not in company law.

However a quick search on google with the string: director sued limited company

...suggests its a very real concern for directors of limited companies and money is made advising on the subject.

In this thread example the claim is a debt of £80m.

That's a lot of incentive for creditors to go over any available avenues to claim negligence and therefore bypass the limited company protection.

An example solicitors page showing a list of ways a director can be held personally liable:

https://www.saunders.co.uk/news/per...legal-disputes-litigation-lawyers-london.html

Energize · 3 Feb 2020 at 05:22

Hotwired said:
Dammed if I know, I'm not in company law.

However a quick search on google with the string: director sued limited company

...suggests its a very real concern for directors of limited companies and money is made advising on the subject.

In this thread example the claim is a debt of £80m.

That's a lot of incentive for creditors to go over any available avenues to claim negligence and therefore bypass the limited company protection.

An example solicitors page showing a list of ways a director can be held personally liable:

https://www.saunders.co.uk/news/per...legal-disputes-litigation-lawyers-london.html

Most of these seem inapplicable in the real world and just serve to act as advertising for the law firm in question, I mean seriously, manslaughter, and bribery are so far removed from reality of what a person would actually be charged with...

In terms of case law, I can't really find anything where a company director has been held personally liable.

Hotwired · 3 Feb 2020 at 06:10

Energize said:
Most of these seem inapplicable in the real world and just serve to act as advertising for the law firm in question, I mean seriously, manslaughter, and bribery are so far removed from reality of what a person would actually be charged with...

In terms of case law, I can't really find anything where a company director has been held personally liable.

Fine I've found examples for you to prove that the director can be dragged out of limited liability protection. Not at a whim, they have to actually do something wrong. The company owing money is not the same thing.

A uses his limited company to contract B to renovate a house
A falls out with B, liquidates his limited company with debts still owed to B.
A then creates and uses a new limited company to contract C to renovate the house.
B is upset about this, sues A

The high court finds multiple issues and throws the limited company protection in the bin.

https://www.farrer.co.uk/news-and-i...ble-for-inducing-companys-breach-of-contract/

The entire judgement: https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/TCC/2018/2316.html

....

A employed B using a limited company to catch chickens
B filed a claim of breach of contract however the limited company didn't have any money so they sued the directors (A)

The high court decides the directors actions resulting in breach of contract were unlawful and therefore the directors were personally responsible.

https://www.menzieslaw.co.uk/case-update-1-personal-liability-of-company-directors/

The entire judgement: https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2019/843.html

....

And finally a not specified pair of cases studies showing how a limited company can be liquidated while owing money making the directors liable or not liable depending on the actions taken:

https://helix-law.co.uk/business-law-blogs/director-s-liability-on-company-insolvency/#case_study_1