key skills / functional skills : A true measure of your ability ?

Business Man · 26 Jun 2013 at 18:38

So i left school in 2000 with 8 GCSE's with grades D-F, i received a D in art which i was told i should have received an A in, English and Maths i got an E and Science double i got an F.

Fast forward to 2011 i started an Engineering course at college doing an NVQ Diploma Lv2 in performing engineering operations, I then went on to do the Lv2 Technical Certificate which i have now just finished

Today i went in to college to do an initial assessment test which i was told is required for the Lv3 Engineering Apprenticeship. On completing the initial assessment test which consisted of both English and Maths i received a Lv 1 :mad:

Now the test wasn't particularly hard, i found the majority of the questions very easy but there was a couple i stumbled on, either it had ridiculously high mark requirement's in between each level or there's no consistency between key skills / functional skills since i completed English and Maths key skills at Lv2 which is apparently equivalent to A-C GCSE's

I asked if Lv1 was good enough and i was told it was, I really don't get it since if im doing Lv3 Engineering then i should at least be achieving Lv 3 maths and English

I don't believe these key skills or functional skills show a true refection of your abilities, I'm now thinking would it be worth resitting my GCSE's and see what
grades i can achieve for a better understanding ? The further i go down the road of engineering i know it will require stronger maths

I really feel i need to settle a score with the GCSE grades i received too, even if its to achieve some self pride, I wasn't bad at school and i worked hard, i just found it hard to concentrate so it use to through one ear and out the other.

Tefal · 26 Jun 2013 at 18:41

lol English and maths key skills is a-c gcse? we had to do them last year if that's what it takes for a C+ in English or maths now exams have gone down hill loads :/

don't worry though getting lvl1 in these assessment tests purely means they know they need to give you extra support. that's all these tests are for so the college ahs it on record if they need to offer etra help.

they wont thoguh btw but they have it on record so they can say the do

btw though, just because you found the questions easy doesn't mean you got them right

Syph · 26 Jun 2013 at 20:17

Key Skills at Level 2, if I remember correctly, were worth 1/2 a GCSE @ C+ in terms of points value. They were supposed to be qualifications that showed you had the "key skills" of literacy and numeracy. I believe functional skills were to be embedded within the GCSEs (FS replaced KS), so that you couldn't even get a GCSE at C or above (level 2) without them, but all of that got scrapped. FS remained separate qualifications.

TL;DR - KS/FS at Level 2 = 1/2 GCSE C or above. Supposed to be the same difficulty.

/edit: Your GCSE grades would have been = level 1, so the tests confirmed your GCSE grades/level.
/edit 2: No, I don't think KS/FS were a true reflection. Certainly not when the were delivered where I taught. Re-sit ad nauseum until it's done, and it all added to the school's 5* A-C measure. That's all gone now anyway and wouldn't count.

pgi947 · 26 Jun 2013 at 20:23

As you did your peo (I did lvl 1&2) are you going into being a hands on tech or the official 'engineer' of cad design and the likes?

mufc802 · 26 Jun 2013 at 22:18

I thought functional skills/key skills were either level 1, 2 and 3 and you can either pass or fail either, you don't achieve a level grade depending on what score you got. I don't know why one in English is even required, if you can type on a word processor that has spell checker that is good enough for an engineering course as half the work is just maths.

alx · 26 Jun 2013 at 22:28

mufc802 said:
I thought functional skills/key skills were either level 1, 2 and 3 and you can either pass or fail either, you don't achieve a level grade depending on what score you got. I don't know why one in English is even required, if you can type on a word processor that has spell checker that is good enough for an engineering course as half the work is just maths.

Because in the real world being able to explain engineering concepts and ideas in concise, clear English is pretty important?

Deleted member 77746 · 26 Jun 2013 at 22:50

mufc802 said:
I thought functional skills/key skills were either level 1, 2 and 3 and you can either pass or fail either, you don't achieve a level grade depending on what score you got. I don't know why one in English is even required, if you can type on a word processor that has spell checker that is good enough for an engineering course as half the work is just maths.

Are you a forum troll?

MrMoonX · 26 Jun 2013 at 22:52

alx said:
Because in the real world being able to explain engineering concepts and ideas in concise, clear English is pretty important?

+1

Oh and lolNVQ for good measure just to feed the troll

Third Opinion · 27 Jun 2013 at 00:48

As an NVQ A1 assessor all I can say is I agree these Key skills are a joke. I have not met a single assessor who likes dealing with them but unfortunately they are part of the framework.

I have been out of it a couple of years but from what I can remember is this. A level 1 is equivalent to roughly a d-f GCSE. Level 2 is A-C. You can claim a proxy (depending on your course framework) if you have taken your GCSE's within 3 years (I think, maybe 5). Obviously you took your GCSE's a long time ago so the grades would be inapplicable

I assessed level 3 in computer engineering and a candidate only had to complete key skills at level 2 or have a valid GCSE A-C in maths or english so I could then claim a proxy for them.

I would personally suck it up and do the key skills which is a short online test and a small portfolio.

A level 3 in maths and english would require an A level for a proxy so doing your GCSE's again would not particularly help.

Levels are totally different in post 16 education to levels used in schools.

Robbiec053 · 27 Jun 2013 at 00:52

The functional skills in ICT is also laughable; Can you use pubisher? yes? good here's your level 2.

I can understand why they're required but I don't see them as something that separates candidates.

Business Man · 27 Jun 2013 at 01:38

pgi947 said:
As you did your peo (I did lvl 1&2) are you going into being a hands on tech or the official 'engineer' of cad design and the likes?

Yes i will be going hands on as a maintenance technician, I did fitting in mechanical, electrical and electronic units in the lv2

I was looking at past English GCSE papers earlier and i didn't realise how difficult it was, I honestly believe i would struggle with it today, 30 mins to write a story of a subject filling up 1 - 2 pages, then 25 minutes to write a descriptive scene with out turning it in to a story, i'm really not a creative writer

pgi947 · 27 Jun 2013 at 06:19

Ah I was in a similar situation to get accepted for a tech position (c&g/nvq lvl3) with the airforce, was one or two C's at gcse short of acceptance and had to do the peo courses to act as a waver for the missing grades.

Do you have much experience in the field? As these days in mechanical, 5+ years experience is as good as your lvl3.

You could try asking around local workshops and see if they have any trainee/apprentice positions available, they may not be so fussy with grades and would put you through your lvl3 regardless.

mufc802 · 27 Jun 2013 at 17:38

alx said:
Because in the real world being able to explain engineering concepts and ideas in concise, clear English is pretty important?

I was just basing it on when I did a level 3 engineering course, English really wasn't that important. I was even forced to do functional skills in English for about a month even with a GCSE in English, in the end I didn't need to do it but the things that were covered were not relevant for the engineering course at all.

JonJ678 · 27 Jun 2013 at 17:53

Plenty of asian people doing engineering degrees in this country who simply can't speak English at all. Not even a little bit. A native speaker who writes terribly should do just fine at an nvq.

I'm more worried about the maths. Maths is both important and difficult, the above mentioned guys mostly pass because they can solve the equations in their sleep. Hitting a D in maths gcse is not something to be proud of.

alx · 27 Jun 2013 at 18:08

mufc802 said:
I was just basing it on when I did a level 3 engineering course, English really wasn't that important. I was even forced to do functional skills in English for about a month even with a GCSE in English, in the end I didn't need to do it but the things that were covered were not relevant for the engineering course at all.

I agree that the English skills part may not be revelant for the course, but they are important in real life and that's (generally) why you're doing the course - to get a job. But if you're just concerned with passing the course, then I'd agree they're probably pointless.