*chuckles*
Kolo Toure Suspended for Failed Drugs Test
- Thread starter BaZ87
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*chuckles*
If City makes it to the 2013 CL I will literally fellate each and every single last one of you. That is how little I believe they'll sort their house out - you can't buy your way into the CL anymore, because they'll just slam the door in your face.
Can you trim 100m off the annual losses over two years? No football club has ever done that...
Can you trim 100m off the annual losses over two years? No football club has ever done that...
I don't think you really understand that you made a massive loss the season before last, will have made a bigger one this one just gone, and that selling players isn't just a case of going "Oh here, do you want this guy we signed for £40m two weeks ago for nothing?"
Don't pretend it will be "easy", because it won't. That's why UEFA have the made the move gradual, because if you had to balance things by next season, you'd be screwed.
Out of interest, is this a required practice for football clubs? I mean, it seems like that's how everyone does it, and it makes sense, but couldn't Man City just load up all the debt of buying players onto their current financial sheets (by taking the full loss now), and then have less debts by the time the regs come in?
Soldato
Quoted For The Record ^_^
I'm not actually sure. There's nothing stopping ordinary companies doing it but I'm not sure if football clubs can. I suspect not as if they could, they would have done it by now.
Even if they could, it's too late now anyway. As above, it only effects European qualification from the 2013/14 season but qualification for that season is based on your financial results from this coming season and the following season.
Caporegime
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I suspect the same, if they were allowed to show the entire transfer fee in one season, they would have already. Considering at the moment City have a whole crapload of 20+mil transfers that have been amatorized, that will continue for 3-4 more seasons for many of them and they knew the rules were coming, so had they been able to they'd have started doing it differently.
City have no way, at all, of meeting the financial regulations, it won't happen unless Uefa let some serious dodgey stuff happen. The point is though that Uefa are supposed to be keeping on top of 150million a year shirt sponsorship and basically regarding it as insane, not market value and cheating and therefore would ignore the 150million.
City have a small stadium and likely the highest wages in the league for this year, end of next season for sure.
Liverpool, bog standard liverpool paid higher wages to players as part of their contract for champs league football, I'd be shocked if City players won't get a substantial pay increase for being in the champs league. 20mil income from the Champs league, if they have a good run, will be completely wiped out by the top 10-15 players pay increase. They likely have a yearly pay increase coming, 5% increase on a 250k a week wage for Yaya is bigger than a 5% increase on 150k for a guy at Chelsea, etc, etc.
They can't and won't do it, their wages have gone up dramatically since their last published numbers which are well over a season old. They'll be 20-30% higher, with essentially little to no extra income, 2 places higher in the league is all of 1million winnings extra.
City can sell all their excess players , the 17-20 or so essential players are on completely and utterly unsustainable wages that a stadium that small simply can't afford those wages.
I'll be shocked(if without getting away with some form of cheating) City are making anything less than 50mil losses by the time the rules are in effect, I'd not be particularly surprised if the losses are still well over 100mil a year in 3 years time.
Again the problem is, the actual punishments are yet to be established, banning from Europe if over 45mil in losses, or, a 10mil fine, no one knows.
Then theres another issue, does it matter? City aren't in the champs league now, they barely cared about Europe, they don't NEED the money, they won't go bankrupt unlike other clubs, theres no financial fair play in the EPL. So keep spending big, win the league(a bigger and more important achievement than the champs league as their first target) establish themselves by winning a few titles, and care about Europe at a later date. Because, if they need to ditch say 3-4 of their top earners, Tevez, Yaya, Silva, Dezko and bring in 80-100k a week cheaper players, will they even stay in the champs league, will they get 4th place? So getting to the point their losses are low enough to get into Europe, the team might simply be incapable of getting into Europe anyway.
City have no way, at all, of meeting the financial regulations, it won't happen unless Uefa let some serious dodgey stuff happen. The point is though that Uefa are supposed to be keeping on top of 150million a year shirt sponsorship and basically regarding it as insane, not market value and cheating and therefore would ignore the 150million.
City have a small stadium and likely the highest wages in the league for this year, end of next season for sure.
Liverpool, bog standard liverpool paid higher wages to players as part of their contract for champs league football, I'd be shocked if City players won't get a substantial pay increase for being in the champs league. 20mil income from the Champs league, if they have a good run, will be completely wiped out by the top 10-15 players pay increase. They likely have a yearly pay increase coming, 5% increase on a 250k a week wage for Yaya is bigger than a 5% increase on 150k for a guy at Chelsea, etc, etc.
They can't and won't do it, their wages have gone up dramatically since their last published numbers which are well over a season old. They'll be 20-30% higher, with essentially little to no extra income, 2 places higher in the league is all of 1million winnings extra.
City can sell all their excess players , the 17-20 or so essential players are on completely and utterly unsustainable wages that a stadium that small simply can't afford those wages.
I'll be shocked(if without getting away with some form of cheating) City are making anything less than 50mil losses by the time the rules are in effect, I'd not be particularly surprised if the losses are still well over 100mil a year in 3 years time.
Again the problem is, the actual punishments are yet to be established, banning from Europe if over 45mil in losses, or, a 10mil fine, no one knows.
Then theres another issue, does it matter? City aren't in the champs league now, they barely cared about Europe, they don't NEED the money, they won't go bankrupt unlike other clubs, theres no financial fair play in the EPL. So keep spending big, win the league(a bigger and more important achievement than the champs league as their first target) establish themselves by winning a few titles, and care about Europe at a later date. Because, if they need to ditch say 3-4 of their top earners, Tevez, Yaya, Silva, Dezko and bring in 80-100k a week cheaper players, will they even stay in the champs league, will they get 4th place? So getting to the point their losses are low enough to get into Europe, the team might simply be incapable of getting into Europe anyway.
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Caporegime
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what do these restrictions mean for real madrid? arent they basically funded the same way man city and chelsea are?
ronaldo is meant to be on a contract worth like £500K a week in his final year.
ronaldo is meant to be on a contract worth like £500K a week in his final year.
Caporegime
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The difference is, Real and Barca both make more tv money than City, a lot more, because they make their own deals not a combined deal for the whole league so those two get a stupid amount of tv money while the rest of the league gets, not smeg all but, way way less.
But on top of that Real have a stadium with what, over twice the capacity of Man City.
But yeah, Real are run like psycho's in general, they keep getting into debt thenn from what I recall, the royal family basically bail them out and the local government have done stuff like buy their training ground for an obscene amount of cash then just let them train their for free = massive cash injection and loads of debt wiped out.
They do have a LOT of income, and I wouldn't be surprised if they can to a degree become stable in the future. Barca/Real's issues for a decade or two have largely been, well, spending ridiculous cash on players, stop that and most of their debt will go away. TV money, income from ticket sales, large shirt sponsorship, stadium sponsorship deals, pre-season tours, etc, etc.
Thats the thing though, without actual official punishments decided yet by Uefa, right now its all assumed that punishments will be severe, I think banning from the competition is likely, but unlikely for a "first" offence, fines, maybe a points deduction in the group stage could be possible, but later down the line, a few years breaking the financial rules in a row. Basically we won't know for a while what they will do for various levels of rule breaking.
Theres too many assumptions to be made, but lets assume the rules are both strict and harsh with punishments. It could lead to Barca, Utd, Chelsea, City, Real and the rest all dropping wages to essentially give themselves basically a wage cap, to stay out of big losses. But thats the problem, a club with a 60k or 100k stadium will always be able to afford higher wages (without making losses) than a club with 30-40k stadium.
So even if wages come down to more sane levels, the top teams around now will be able to remain top for a while. Buying a stadium and the debt incurred(if any) won't count against financial fair play though, as long as the debt is being serviced effectively, so City have an "easy" out there. Chelsea haven't really got anywhere to go but I'd imagine City have a lot more scope for building a new stadium, it will still be YEARS and years before they'd start to see the benefit of that though, way after financial fair play comes in.
Like I said, it would be interesting if City simply say, screw Europe, win the league, go for the other two cups, get to work on a huge stadium, then after a few years get back into Europe. EPL champions won't have to pay the best players 250k a week to join them anymore.
Thing is, the rules could be a joke, the punishments could be a joke, or everyone might just cheat, really badly, and Uefa might ignore it, or we could see almost every top team thrown out of the champs league in 3 years time.
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Caporegime
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i suppose tax, inflation and currency all have a part to play.
for example how much is the average price to go see a game at the emirates and the average price to go see a game at the bernebau?
then take in VAT being 20% here is it now? how much is similar taxes in spain? theres a lot of different forces in play here and anything could happen.
for example how much is the average price to go see a game at the emirates and the average price to go see a game at the bernebau?
then take in VAT being 20% here is it now? how much is similar taxes in spain? theres a lot of different forces in play here and anything could happen.
I'm only a casual observer but how is this going to work? Do we know yet? I watched an interview with an agent who said that the clubs that are propped up by rich backers will just use one of their other companies to give daft shirt deals and buy corporate boxes at way above the real value.
Being born into money doesn't guarantee a savvy business mind, but it does allow you to employ people who do possess one.
Soldato
This is a decent article though Arsenal-centric but does a good job of explaining it all, clear as mud lol
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/397091-uefa-say-fair-play-to-arsenal
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/397091-uefa-say-fair-play-to-arsenal
That agent doesnt understand the new rules, that will not be allowed to happen, anything like billion pound shirt deals from some unheard of airline and 500 million pound stadium naming rights will simply be discounted as income.
Making the whole situation worse.
Caporegime
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FAir market value, any deals that seem dodgey will be, I guess appraised for actual value and the rest essentially marked off.
if City get paid 200mil in one season for their shirt deal, Uefa "should" go to their books, see that Barca get 25mil, Bayern 22-ish, Utd around 20, Liverpool a little less, Chelsea around 15-20mil and go, errm, nope and either put it down as 20mil for fair market value or they might deem the whole thing as cheating and count none of that 200mil.
Without the actual punishments, not published, they haven't even come up with them yet, its a bit daft. They could come out with a set of rules and the intention of being so strict we won't see half the usual champs league teams involved ever again, or they could be completely BS rules, and the whole thing is just trying to give football a less money grabbing image but underneath its as corrupt and about money as ever. It will certainly be interesting to see which way it goes as frankly, no one knows right now.