List of new diesels that don't have DPF

HangTime said:
I don't think it is the only way, they could offer a diesel scrappage scheme for example, or change the VED to be heavily biased against Diesel, or expand congestion charging for diesels etc. I also doubt the short term commitment is as strong, so even if that was the only way I am not convinced they would go ahead with it the way you have described.

In essence I think there will an endeavour to reduce diesel emissions but I don't think it will be as drastic/rapid as you do. We'll find out next month :)
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With Brexit EU emission targets become less relevant with every passing day...

In all seriousness there would be uproar if if they took retrospective action against diesel cars.

They could just put a levy on new diesel cars, kind of like the opposite of the electric vehicle grant. People vote with their wallets but getting people to scrap perfectly suitable vehicles is the least environmentally friendly policy they could possibly make.
 
Jokester said:
If someone is that bothered about fuel consumption the difference between a frugal diesel and a frugal petrol isn't as big as it used to be.
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Actually I find there is a massive difference.

I notice it big time when my range in my old 2.0 TDI was 750 miles on a full tank, where as the petrol show about 350 miles range, if anything the fuel costs me the same as I use Vpower for petrol.

This roughly means my fuel costs have doubled and instead of filling up once every two weeks...I am now brimming the tank once a week from near empty.

For me, it is definitely bad...must be spending at least £1000 more a year on fuel.
 
b0rn2sk8 said:
With Brexit EU emission targets become less relevant with every passing day...

In all seriousness there would be uproar if if they took retrospective action against diesel cars.

They could just put a levy on new diesel cars, kind of like the opposite of the electric vehicle grant. People vote with their wallets but getting people to scrap perfectly suitable vehicles is the least environmentally friendly policy they could possibly make.
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Hmm not entirely. A lot of it is an international agreement not an EU one.

I think they are already going to start charging diesel cars more to enter the congestion zone in London (if not already). So it's not out of the question they will pump up tax on existing diesels to be where it should be for the amount of pollution they kick out. Afterall, they only make policies with London in mind :/
 
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In a roundabout way that's been done in relative terms with the VED changes as a ton of new diesel car makes previously taxed at £0-30/year will now be taxed at £140/year.
 
Blackhawk47 said:
Actually I find there is a massive difference.

I notice it big time when my range in my old 2.0 TDI was 750 miles on a full tank, where as the petrol show about 350 miles range, if anything the fuel costs me the same as I use Vpower for petrol.

This roughly means my fuel costs have doubled and instead of filling up once every two weeks...I am now brimming the tank once a week from near empty.

For me, it is definitely bad...must be spending at least £1000 more a year on fuel.
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Surely a 2.0TFSI doesn't use twice as much fuel as a 2.0 TDI?

If you're that concerned about fuel costs stop buying V-Power and switch to regular unleaded, I bet you won't notice any difference.
 
OllyM said:
Surely a 2.0TFSI doesn't use twice as much fuel as a 2.0 TDI?

If you're that concerned about fuel costs stop buying V-Power and switch to regular unleaded, I bet you won't notice any difference.
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Yep I'm afraid it does. The diesel used to get on average 45mpg, 50mpg on a long motorway journey.

Ironically it's the shorter journeys to work which hurt the most as I struggle to get 30mpg in the petrol. Town/city driving is worse, lucky to get over 25mpg.
 
I'm sure if you put a brick under most bus drivers pedals, you'd cut pollution no end.

All the ones round me roar off at full throttle as soon as they're 'loaded', no doubt under pressure to meet their schedule, but it means they chuck out a ton of smoke. It's especially annoying if you're on the pavement where their exhaust points.
 
Blackhawk47;30478053 said:
Yep I'm afraid it does. The diesel used to get on average 45mpg, 50mpg on a long motorway journey.

Ironically it's the shorter journeys to work which hurt the most as I struggle to get 30mpg in the petrol. Town/city driving is worse, lucky to get over 25mpg.
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similar situation here.

My old 2.0TFSI Petrol Leon used to average around 30 MPG.

My newer 2.0 TDI one does 50 MPG. So not quite twice as much but a massive difference.
 
woppy101 said:
I can see trouble ahead for diesel cars with the governments ideas that diesels are now the spawn of Satan, I can see at least 10p per Ltr added to the price of diesel in the next budget to steer people back to petrol cars.
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No change in the tax on diesel announced today from what I can see.
 
I think all they can target so far is those using diesels for low mileage runs.

Unfortunately for me, i do a lot of miles each year, so until they build a petrol engine that can achieve MPG to within at least 10% of a diesel, Then even adding 10p a litre still works out cheaper for me to run a diesel.

Just as an example, when i do a drive from Bristol to Manchester, at yesterdays prices, a return journey will cost me about £27. In a petrol (Was getting 40MPG in a DS3 prior to the diesel), that return journey will cost me about £43.

I do that journey 4 times a month, so petrol would actually cost me an extra £65 a month to run - not to mention the extra VED.

To cancel out those savings, the price of diesel would need to be upped to around £1.90 a litre (an increase of about 70p).
 
hux said:
Honda civic up to 8th gen don't have a dpf so around 2010-2011 so far this is the best I've seen.
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I have a Type S Civic 2007...Diesel...i make regular short journeys to the shops...wondered why i had no problem with teh dpf...it hasnt got one.
This car is the best of both worlds in my eyes..cant beat it for space, power etc.
 
The big rise in diesels is hugely to blame on the government and if they are serious about getting lots of the road then a generous scrappage scheme is surely the only 'fair' way to do it. Attempting to price people out of them with fuel hikes and the like is massively unfair to those who were sweet talked into buying them in the first place.

As for dpf issues, my old man ran his 2012 focus into the ground at 140,000 miles (I say ran into the ground, the car was fine and would probably do another 100k) with no dpf issues. Girlfriend also has a diesel focus of the same age at 64k with (so far) no problems so hopefully that will get to at least 140k too. Her stop start occasionally stops working which I hear could be a dpf thing though. Hasn't done it for a while though.

I nearly got a diesel myself a year ago, it was actually this forum who predicted the gov would start to do this which put me off.
 
So in essence picking a Diesel over a Petrol (second hand cars im talking here) is still the way to go.
Im looking at a 2.2 Mazda CX-5 Diesel which has a VED of £30 against a Sportage 1.6 Petrol which is around the £145 (So £115 saving)....mpg is about 10mpg better...so around 25% better economy. So there needs to be around a 25-30p hike per litre difference for this to make an impact on my wallet.

So what else apart from the dpf issues that maybe faced is there to contemplate? Can we really see this much of a gap between fuel costs say in the next 5-6 years?
I cant see that at all. Without as someone has already suggested "uproar".
 
As much as I dislike diesels it has pretty much halved my fuel costs. After calculating my average fuel cost for both my 330i and Leon tdi. Bmw was costing me £10 a day on fuel average over miles which I think. The Leon is costing me £4.00. It does make a difference for me as my mileage is high.

Though the thought of forking out when something breaks is always in the back of my mind. A petrol n/a is simply much more reliable.
 
Compare a Mazda diesel against a Mazda petrol or a Kia diesel against a Kia petrol before you do your maths - otherwise you are comparing apples to oranges.
 
Armageus said:
Compare a Mazda diesel against a Mazda petrol or a Kia diesel against a Kia petrol before you do your maths - otherwise you are comparing apples to oranges.
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I have....the pricing for a 2.0 CX-5 and 2.2 CX-5 is that there is about £500 difference on a purchase price and the same with the Sportage 1.6 and 1.7...difference also is the torque and low end power that doesnt exist against the more powerful Diesel alternatives....at a push id sway to the 2L petrol engine but then im still out of pocket with the mpg.

Few years down the line the Gov will then tax the hell out of Petrol...wasnt Electric/Hybrid the way forward at one point and now theyre not so special. This country is run by M*rons who've never done a days work...all they care about is ripping off the general public, lets be honest, so how can be predict them...theyre very unpredictable and no logic fits.
 
Armageus said:
Compare a Mazda diesel against a Mazda petrol or a Kia diesel against a Kia petrol before you do your maths - otherwise you are comparing apples to oranges.
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I can understand your point that they're 2 different cars with 2 different engines. The cost of fuel is releavant for me so that's why I changed.
 
So if you look at their focus:
a) reduce pollution overall
b) reduce pollution in cities.

Both are best served by no output from engines - served by having electric only as 0 tax.
Next is by reducing the number of cars - typically the more expensive cars have larger engines regardless of petrol or diesel too.
Finally newer engines and those which are not tampered with (i.e. removing DPF) should be encouraged.

If they want to reduce city pollution then they need to impose tax on vehicles inside cities - regardless of fuel.

Petrol engines pollute with CO2 - acid rain results. Diesel engines pollute NO2/3 & carbon particulates -the euro6 such as the PSA engines claim to drop particulates and, with AdBlue, output Nitrogen only with far less CO2.

Now look at the cost of per-mile of the above (including everything) and for many (including deliveries) then diesels are more economical. However when you look at model of how most cars get used on a commute - it's something a 3 cylinder petrol engine can do.. or a hybrid could do better at the moment... and the focus of the electrical car models will be soon enough..

What is certain - is that the industry will not invest if there's no return in sales. For this reason I see that you'll still have diesel for long haul, you'll still have a mix of options in the middle and then for 'around town' the incentive will be provide electrical.

That seems to be what is happening with the government.
 
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