Local new businesses

Man of Honour
Man of Honour
Joined
3 May 2004
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17,759
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SILENCE!
I watch a lot of those business startup and business troubleshooting programmes on TV with interest and I have run my own business for a number of years now so I feel I have a pretty good idea of what makes or breaks a new business. I also feel I can spot where a lot of small businesses are going wrong. Normally the sort of problems they are having are quite blatant and it's surprising that the proprietors don't realise what they are doing wrong.

I live just off quite an affluent high street and chat to a number of the owners of the shops and I was really surprised firstly by how high the rent was on those shops but also how high the business rate tax was. It kind of made me think and I did a few sums and a lot of the businesses simply don't work on paper. It's not just me that has done this as the guys I talk to have done the same thing. If you add up the sum of what they sell (especially some of the restaurants) and take away wages, rent and tax there is no way they are going to survive much longer. Suddenly it all started to explain why so many shops were disappearing and why a number are now standing empty.

Now I partly blame the council. They set the business rate and it is as high as the rent in most cases which is a hell of a lot of money to have to make just for the priviledge of having your shop on the highstreet. I don't know why they set it so high as that doesn't even include rubbish collection, but surely it is pricing the shops out of the market? Take one small shop as an example, the rent is £800 per week, the rate is the £1000 per week roughly. That's a hell of a lot of sales to just to cover costs and that doesn't include bills or any wages yet. So it's no wonder the sandwich shop that was always busy has in fact gone out of business recently. You simply physically can't sell that many sandwiches.

Now many of the shops simply don't get enough trade to cover these costs. I've seen it with my own eyes, day after day, night after night they simply don't have enough custom to survive much longer.

A children's shoe shop just opened in one of the shops that had stood empty for some time. The owners are new to the business but clearly haven't researched their business very well because just under a year ago a children's shoe shop closed down over the other side of the road. If they had known that would they have necessary opened that shop there? Is it sensible focusing on just kiddies shoes? I think not.

Obviously the other downfall is the way the business is run. A bike shop opened a few months ago just round the corner from me and while it is probably cheaper for me to buy parts for my scooter online I am making an effort to use them. Two things they have done wrong so far. I went in for a drive belt and an oil filter. They didn't have the belt so I said I'd pop in later in the week which I did and they still hadn't got one. It's not a specialist part as it fits a number of other bikes. Third trip in they still didn't have one so they guy gave me the filter for goodwill. Now I know it probably only costs them 50p but every little counts and it's a part that sells for £5 so it's a good profit for little work for them. As I pass the shop every day I dropped in today to see if they had the belt and he sold it to me at cost. So not only have I cost him about 1/2 hour of his time, he has now done it for free. If that continues he is doomed. The forst time I went in there I mentioned that you can't see the shop as you ride or drive past. Something like a sandwich board or a protruding sign like the other shops had would make it visible from the road and almost certainly bring in passing trade. I only noticed the shop because I was opposite buying some takeaway, but the guys still haven't done anything about it.

So what's going to happen to my area? The shops are all doomed to close except the big established ones and no-one will be able to afford to fill their spaces? Charity shops? End of lease discount stores?

Discuss
 
The same is going to happen in Wigan, the council giove the go ahead for a massive new shopping centre, the old one was built in the 80s and is still in good condition, so now the old shopping centre will be full of £1 shops and empty shops,

Grand Arcade

Its going to turn Wigan into a dump and its only 30 yards from the old one.

I go to Manchester for my shopping, its only £4 on the train.
 
cheets64 said:
The same is going to happen in Wigan, the council giove the go ahead for a massive new shopping centre, the old one was built in the 80s and is still in good condition, so now the old shopping centre will be full of £1 shops and empty shops,

Grand Arcade

Its going to turn Wigan into a dump and its only 30 yards from the old one.

I go to Manchester for my shopping, its only £4 on the train.
The same thing is happening in Basingstoke, spanking new mall/arcade gets built and all the good shops moved in there.. it left the "old" part of town to the tatty PoundTastic shops and transient cheap book shops :(
 
It's happening in every major town.

I must admit I shop at the out of town "malls" as it's easier to get a park and I can get what I want cheaper and get in and out SAS style which is always a Brucie bonus when it comes to shopping ;)
 
FISHGUTS said:
It's happening in every major town.

I must admit I shop at the out of town "malls" as it's easier to get a park and I can get what I want cheaper and get in and out SAS style which is always a Brucie bonus when it comes to shopping ;)
Parking is actually a very good point, because again, the council have put yellow lines along the length of the highstreet so no-one can stop. Surely this has no benefit to trade either. I don't know what they thinking they wil achieve when they put schemes like that in place.
 
Jonny69 said:
Parking is actually a very good point, because again, the council have put yellow lines along the length of the highstreet so no-one can stop. Surely this has no benefit to trade either. I don't know what they thinking they wil achieve when they put schemes like that in place.

Cars are evil. :rolleyes:
We should all walk, bike or get the bus to the shops.
 
With one in every 8 pounds spent in the UK going to Tesco, it's hardly surprising. Now that supermarkets stock clothes household items and electrical goods and have massive buying power how can the indipendant retailer possibly compete?

I buy most of my stuff from the shops where I live, know the faces of the people who work there and it has a sence of community, just the way I like it. I don't drive so out of town shopping / supermarket shopping doesnt happen, if I need to go to a big store I go into Newcastle.
 
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Where I used to live in Sydenham there used to be thriving high street with all the local shops you could ever want. Sainburys went and stuck up a huge Savacentre and it basically spelled the end of the shops. I think there are only 2 or 3 shops surviving from when I was a younger now. Even the bakery that had been there since 1850-something is different now. Most of the shops turned into foreign food markets, discount stores or fingernail painters. Then the scum all moved in and that was the end of Sydenham.

Sad because most of those businesses had been established there for 100+ years :(
 
My parents run a small shop, and your right the rent and tax is crippling. It's quite depressing when you see just how much you have to pay to just be open.

You can now see the effect it has had, as small shops close down to replaced by major high street chains. We've had a major chain move in that sells what my parents shop sells, and you can't do a thing about it. A farmer would get subsidies but a shop owner is just left to go out of business. :(

The latest piece of genius by the council is that they want to close the high street to traffic, and have a pedestrian area. While that may sound very nice, it will absolutely kill passing trade. You need new customers that notice the shop when driving by, you can't just rely on the local customers.

It seems nobody really cares about the small businesses anymore.
 
See it's pretty different down here, my folks have an office in a village/town and the rent and rates are nowhere near this high.
 
I go to my local village store every two days or so to buy my fresh fruit and vegetables. Support your local shops! :)
 
Jonny I now what you mean with regards to the obvious not being undertaken at times.

Like the sandwich board outside the bike shop- That probably costs at most £50 to get made up and will last many years, cheap advertising!

My friend started up an e-trade business. It took a couple of months for the website to get made up.

During this time I said she should get the web designer to knock up a simple page, even "under construction email xyz@xyz for info" would have done so she could stick the address on flyers, google listings etc... so when the site did open people would already know of it.

She ignored this and after 6months of "trading" and no advertising has had a total of 0 orders! To be honest, she hasn't done anything since having the site knocked up- I am suprised and dissapointed as usually she is very ambitious.

Monkeyman, what do your parents sell?

Personally, I have just got listed in 2 yellow pages distributions and yell.com. My mobile is ringing quite a lot already at the moment so I hopefully with the yellow pages push I will be looking to move into office premises and take on a couple of installers myself. :)
 
Times are always changing.... I fear for small independant shops, due to online trade and Supermarkets. Our towns are quickly becoming ghost towns.
 
FolkD said:
Times are always changing.... I fear for small independant shops, due to online trade and Supermarkets. Our towns are quickly becoming ghost towns.

Take that sandwich shop.

If rent and business rates = £1800 per WEEK then add on say further costs of £700 a week including wages. Thats £2500 a week.

Say the average customer spends £3. Thats 833 sandwiches- About 150 a day!

That's a bloody lot of sandwiches!
 
It's a helluva lot of sandwiches which is sad because they were busy all day every day and worked hard at it but looks like they just couldn't make enough. They made a good bap there too :D
 
Tesla said:
Personally, I have just got listed in 2 yellow pages distributions and yell.com. My mobile is ringing quite a lot already at the moment so I hopefully with the yellow pages push I will be looking to move into office premises and take on a couple of installers myself. :)

Hi Tesla,

Do you find Yellow Pages works well for you? I've got an advert going in my local area one for the Feb publication.

~n
 
Cybershot said:
Hi Tesla,

Do you find Yellow Pages works well for you? I've got an advert going in my local area one for the Feb publication.

~n
I don't know yet, it has literally just been distributed around Bristol and Bath.

If you have MSN then add me and we can have a chat and I will let you know when I have a better idea.

What is it that your business does?
 
Don't know how I missed a couple of threads above. I used to advertise in Yellow Pages but I think it's very dependent on the area and the type of business. Mine was computer maintenance and the years 2003-2004 were very successful advertising. 2005 it was starting to tail off a bit. They changed the books to split one of them into two areas which made it too expensive for me to justify, just as well because I found less and less people using it. Near the end of the year I was getting so little new business in and it was in undesirable areas that I dropped the adverts.

You won't know until you stick an ad in which might seem expensive but it should at least pay for itself. Don't listen to their "figures" as they seem to have been pulled out of a hat.

Business has been getting quieter for me over the last year which is why I decided to go back to employment. With the experience my business gave me it actually enabled me to drop into quite a decent role which I'm pleased with, so all is not lost.
 
Tesla said:
I don't know yet, it has literally just been distributed around Bristol and Bath.

If you have MSN then add me and we can have a chat and I will let you know when I have a better idea.

What is it that your business does?

Hi Tesla,

Will add you in a sec - I won't be around much until >14th, I'm on holiday in Canada at the moment and the time difference is interesting :p

We offer an 'emergency response' IT service to businesses around the area :) We have a couple of contracts/regular custom with local schools and businesses which keeps us going but I'm really looking to push it further now, hence the advert in the YP :)

~n
 
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