Lotus ditch full EV lineup plan and switch to Hybrids

[Nasher]

I dunno about all of them,.but fords problem may be less about them producing EVs and more about them doing disappointing EVs.
does anyone look at the new Capri and think that looks exciting? (esp for the price).
OTOH Renault and MG seem to be doing pretty well and are producing some really exciting cars,.same with Hyundai and Kia.

maybe new car sales are dropping a bit but in part that could be because the economy is generally in a bad place at the moment.

Marc are ditching some of them as well.

Used EVs are piling up at dealerships as people aren't buying them. Even with the horrendus depreciation.

EVs feel like cars as a service, rather than something you can own and keep tbh. With no real savings in the long run.

 

[cuke2u]

I dunno about all of them,.but fords problem may be less about them producing EVs and more about them doing disappointing EVs.
does anyone look at the new Capri and think that looks exciting? (esp for the price).
OTOH Renault and MG seem to be doing pretty well and are producing some really exciting cars,.same with Hyundai and Kia.

maybe new car sales are dropping a bit but in part that could be because the economy is generally in a bad place at the moment.

Whilst the Renault's might have some eye candy they are not the most interesting cars to drive. At least the Ford EV's seem to be better..

 

[Tinders]

Whilst merc have done badly with EV's this year, BMW are up 10% in q3. No surprise considering the merc EV offering is poor.

Petrol and diesel is also down overall, we are on the cusp of a recession in the eurozone so its not surprise car sales are down.

 

[Journey]

Well I guess if Lotus think they are a luxury car brand they'll be right up there with Jaguar and such. In other words they'll end up with a smaller and smaller, even more niche audience, and eventually just become a badge. I'm not sure how many cars you need to ship to stay afloat but Geely obviously won't want to keep haemorrhaging money on a brand that has no real value once all the old timers have died.

I mean who really cares anyway, they are Chinese and China is evil and taking are jerrbs, right?

 

[Nasher]

Well I guess if Lotus think they are a luxury car brand they'll be right up there with Jaguar and such. In other words they'll end up with a smaller and smaller, even more niche audience, and eventually just become a badge. I'm not sure how many cars you need to ship to stay afloat but Geely obviously won't want to keep haemorrhaging money on a brand that has no real value once all the old timers have died.

I mean who really cares anyway, they are Chinese and China is evil and taking are jerrbs, right?

Lotus has always been low volume. They are made by hand.

 

[wesley]

Marc are ditching some of them as well.

Used EVs are piling up at dealerships as people aren't buying them. Even with the horrendus depreciation.

EVs feel like cars as a service, rather than something you can own and keep tbh. With no real savings in the long run.

Yep exactly, I wouldn't mind to own an EV but I live in a flat so impossible to have a charger fitted.

 

[jigger]

Absolutely impossible for the foreseeable future due to battery weight.

Difficult, but not impossible. You’d have to focus more on needs and less on wants.

 

[jigger]

Marc are ditching some of them as well.

Used EVs are piling up at dealerships as people aren't buying them. Even with the horrendus depreciation.

EVs feel like cars as a service, rather than something you can own and keep tbh. With no real savings in the long run.

I’m four and a half years~ into a move to an EV and around £12k in fuel savings.

 

[Nasher]

I’m four and a half years~ into a move to an EV and around £12k in fuel savings.

And how much in depreciation?

 

[jigger]

And how much in depreciation?

We don’t talk about that.

 

[Mr Jack]

Absolutely impossible for the foreseeable future due to battery weight.

Caterham seem to have other ideas. 1200kg is lighter than a Cayman, and only 100kg more than an Exige.

 

[Nasher]

Caterham seem to have other ideas. 1200kg is lighter than a Cayman, and only 100kg more than an Exige.

Looks nice, but not exactly good value. Why would someone pay £80k+ for that over an Elise (or three) and take a massive depreciation hit. Slower than most of the Elises, with no tuning potential as it's an EV.

 

[Mr Jack]

Looks nice, but not exactly good value. Starts at £80k and it's slower and heavier than an Elise (with no tuning potential as it's an EV), so why not just buy an Elise (or three) for a fraction of that and never lose money on it?

Because it's nothing like an Elise? The Cayman seems closer. Besides, the point is more that lightweight EV sports cars are already possible and only going to get better. We're not going to be driving fossil fuel burners for ever.

Most likely it will depreciate like other EVs as well.

It probably will depreciate more than ICE comparisons but the current extremes are going to be temporary, they won't last forever. They're happening because of the big increase in good EVs.

 

[Nasher]

Because it's nothing like an Elise? The Cayman seems closer. Besides, the point is more that lightweight EV sports cars are already possible and only going to get better. We're not going to be driving fossil fuel burners for ever.



It probably will depreciate more than ICE comparisons but the current extremes are going to be temporary, they won't last forever. They're happening because of the big increase in good EVs.

Then buy a top spec Cayman and still have a faster car and money left over lol. That is unlikely to lose value now either.

No one is buying this thing as a second car, which is what it seems to be built as. If it was 40k cheaper it might get some attention.

But 80k for a car with the performance of a 25k sports car from 25 years ago...meh. Can't even take the roof off. How is this progress.

 

[jigger]

How is this progress.

It isn’t, outside of a few outliers we are well past the automotive peak.

 

[OspreyO]

Car companies seem to have forgotten the lesson of lightness.

 

[Nasher]

Car companies seem to have forgotten the lesson of lightness.

Not forgotten, it has been made impossible due to EU regulations and batteries.

They are calling this Caterham light, but it's only a bit lighter than a GT86.

 

[OspreyO]

Not forgotten, it has been made impossible due to EU regulations and batteries.

They are calling this Caterham light, but it's only a bit lighter than a GT86.

If you can build a Citroen Ami or an eUp or Dacia Spring. Theres scope for not everything to be 2 ton SUV PHEV.

When it comes to sports cars I dunno where we are heading. I think we need a new MX5 like revelation.

VW GX3 concept (2006) review

Volkswagen : What planet’s this from? It looks like a mash up between a Lotus Elise, Ariel Atom and Reliant Robin… This is Volkswagen’s GX3 – a minimalist three wheeler...

www.carmagazine.co.uk

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Car companies seem to have forgotten the lesson of lightness.

…and many people are alive as a result of all the additional safety built into the car and as such have not being horrifically maimed in a collision.

But 80k for a car with the performance of a 25k sports car from 25 years ago...meh. Can't even take the roof off. How is this progress.

Let me check my calendar, ah yeh, £25k from 25 years ago is no longer worth £25k anymore.

 

[OspreyO]

…and many people are alive as a result of all the additional safety built into the car and as such have not being horrifically maimed in a collision.

Can't argue against the value of safety features.

The only issue with this is it becomes a arms race of bigger heavier vehicles. A Hybrid Range Rover hitting a Fiat 500 Vs a Hummer hitting a Range rover. When you look at cars with high death rates cars like Tesla and 911 are up there not because they lack safety features.

You'd have to consider that if we have to drive a high speed at 10/10ths to have fun, because the cars are not fun at reasonable speeds or weight it's going to load to problems.

Maybe these heavier cars are more fun I've never driven any of them. Always liked the idea of the Elise,Vx220 or MX5 or GT86.