Mac users' elitism

jidh007 said:
Read my post. It isn't a low end one, I can go get the specs if you want. I think it was high spec at the time.
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That is what I said... the Dells with similar spec to the iMac are not noisy because we have them where I work. The high end ones, okay you've got me there because I've never seen (heard) one in the flesh.
 
dirtydog said:
That is what I said... the Dells with similar spec to the iMac are not noisy because we have them where I work. The high end ones, okay you've got me there because I've never seen (heard) one in the flesh.
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Aaah ok then. Forgiven. You seem to have a personal vendetta against Apple Macs, any reason for that? :D
 
Jet said:
Ben Q 20" = £280.

The 2 Dells 20" and 20.1" are the same price and the 20" has a better resolution. So yes, I don't think they "cost a lot more".
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But you quoted the Belina, not the BenQ (which incidentally goes for about £220 on most places)

The point was that the cheapest 20.1 is £50 more than the 20", which brings your interesting little system there down to less than the Apple.
 
I've had trouble speccing a decent system equivalent, and ideally better than a £1500 24" iMac. If anyone would actually try and do that i'd appreciate it :p With decent components too :D Might give you anti-Applers a chance to shine.
 
Jet said:
What has the name of the manufacturer got to do with how noisy the PC is. They are limited to the laws of physics. Smaller fans = more noise. It may not be "noisy" but it will be louder than a self-built PC where you have the choise of fans, heatsinks. You can't argue against that (doesn't stop you trying) it's a fact.
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So let me get this straight, your arguing that pre biuilt PC's are noisy because the manufacturers use smaller fans and cheaper components?

So what is any mac if it is not a pre built PC? And yes it is a PC, it may not have windows on but it is a computer. So that means they use substandard components and small fans? What is all this nonsense about macs having better components in them than people like dell etc.. Apple use a proprietary MB, like dell, proprietary PSU, like dell, proprietary case, like dell... You get the picture? Apple is just another computer maker that has somehow managed to create an aura of individuality and innovation around it's products. The only difference between a mac and a dell is the case and the OS!

And for the record, having seen the imac in the shop a few weeks ago, it is butt ugly, good idea but a lot uglier than other PC's like it.
 
jidh007 said:
I've had trouble speccing a decent system equivalent, and ideally better than a £1500 24" iMac. If anyone would actually try and do that i'd appreciate it :p With decent components too :D Might give you anti-Applers a chance to shine.
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Dell Ultrasharp 2407WFP 24" Widescreen LCD Monitor - Midnight Grey Dell Ultrasharp 2407WFP 24" Widescreen LCD Monitor - Midnight Grey £459.99
(£540.49) £459.99
(£540.49)
Asus P5N-E SLi nForce 650 (Socket 775) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard Asus P5N-E SLi nForce 650 (Socket 775) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard £74.99
(£88.11) £74.99
(£88.11)
Intel Core 2 DUO E6400 "LGA775 Allendale" 2.13GHz (1066FSB) - Retail Intel Core 2 DUO E6400 "LGA775 Allendale" 2.13GHz (1066FSB) - Retail £129.99
(£152.74) £129.99
(£152.74)
Team Elite 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 PC2-6400C5 800MHz Dual Channel Kit (TEDD2048M800HC5DC) Team Elite 2GB (2 x 1GB) DDR2 PC2-6400C5 800MHz Dual Channel Kit (TEDD2048M800HC5DC) £129.99
(£152.74) £129.99
(£152.74)
Samsung SpinPoint P SP2504C 250GB SATA-II 8MB Cache - OEM Samsung SpinPoint P SP2504C 250GB SATA-II 8MB Cache - OEM £42.99
(£50.51) £85.98
(£101.02)
Liteon DVD-8900 16x DVD±RW/RAM (Black) - OEM Liteon DVD-8900 16x DVD±RW/RAM (Black) - OEM £15.99
(£18.79) £15.99
(£18.79)
Arctic Cooling T1 Pro Case Arctic Cooling T1 Pro Case £56.99
(£66.96) £56.99
(£66.96)
BFG GeForce 7600 GT OC 256MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) - Retail BFG GeForce 7600 GT OC 256MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) - Retail £74.99
(£88.11) £74.99
(£88.11)
Microsoft Wireless Optical Desktop 1000 Black - Retail (BV3-00007) Microsoft Wireless Optical Desktop 1000 Black - Retail (BV3-00007) £23.99
(£28.19) £23.99
(£28.19)
Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition inc. SP2 - OEM - 1Pk (N09-01528) Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition inc. SP2 - OEM - 1Pk (N09-01528) £49.99
(£58.74) £49.99
(£58.74)
Sub Total : £1,102.89
Shipping cost assumes delivery to UK Mainland with:
City Link Parcel Next Day (Delivered Mon-Fri)
(This can be changed during checkout) Shipping : £24.95
Vat : £197.37
Total : £1,325.21

VS.

* 2.16GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
* 2GB 667 DDR2 SDRAM - 2x1GB
* NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT 256MB SDRAM
* 500GB Serial ATA drive
* Keyboard (English) & Mighty Mouse + Mac OS X (English)

* 24-inch TFT display
* 8x double-layer SuperDrive (DVD±RW, CD-RW)
* AirPort Extreme
* Bluetooth 2.0 + EDR

£1,689.02

Up to you really, know what I would pick with the overclocking potential ;) (couldn't find the mac for £1500, not exactly) To get the Mac down to the same cost (well, £25 more but we'll call that the bluetooth shall we :p) you have to drop to a 7300gt, 250gb HD and 1gb ram.
 
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dirtydog said:
<snip>
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Congratulations on finding the single worst photo of the smallest (and therefore most awkwardly sized) iMac in the range.

Now have a look at a photo of a 24" iMac and tell me you would not have its babies over and over again. The effect on the screen bezel is negligible, and the screen is so thin you wouldn't think theres an entire computer in there.

I would buy a 24" iMac as a separate monitor, then I'd do it again, and again. It is gorgeous, and I don't care about personal preference; anyone who disagrees just has no taste. FACT.
 
Raikiri said:
*Snip*
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Ahhh excellent. Good starting point. And god damn, to match the Mac I can get a better HDD and an awesome GFX card as well. Think I know what I'm doing, haha :D Can't remember how I specced the 24" Mac but it came to something like £1476.

Cheers.
 
divine_madness said:
On Page 13 it was decided it was you.
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I've only got a P4 3.6 and its not overclocked so I'm well down on the big willy stakes.
I can however play MP3's while downloading from the t'interweb and haven't got a dual core processor.
 
Raikiri said:
<snip>
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I can see you've deliberately gone for the cheapest parts possible, have thrown together a spec very similar to that of the iMac configuration you quoted, and you only managed to save £300.

But more importantly, you're comparing a full computer system with separate monitor to a computer which fits, in its entirety, into the size of 52.3 x 57.4 x 20.7 cm (bare in mind the depth includes the stand; the actual screen is razor-thin). With that in mind, it's downright daft to complain that the latter is £300 more expensive.

A mac may not be suited to your individual needs, but bare in mind that you are in the minority. 99% of computer users in the UK have no idea what overclocking is, couldn't care less if they have the latest graphics card and have never even thought about upgrading their computer. It would be stupid of Apple to down all tools and cater to your obscure needs and ignore 99% of the market for their products.
 
Amp34 said:
So let me get this straight, your arguing that pre biuilt PC's are noisy because the manufacturers use smaller fans and cheaper components?

So what is any mac if it is not a pre built PC? And yes it is a PC, it may not have windows on but it is a computer. So that means they use substandard components and small fans? What is all this nonsense about macs having better components in them than people like dell etc.. Apple use a proprietary MB, like dell, proprietary PSU, like dell, proprietary case, like dell... You get the picture? Apple is just another computer maker that has somehow managed to create an aura of individuality and innovation around it's products. The only difference between a mac and a dell is the case and the OS!

And for the record, having seen the imac in the shop a few weeks ago, it is butt ugly, good idea but a lot uglier than other PC's like it.
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The argument wasn't iMac v manufactured PC in this case. It was manufactured v self-built.

In any case my iMac is almost silent, no other manufacturered PC i've encountered has been. Most Dell, et al, use smaller cases than Lian Li, Akasa etc meaning they have to use 80mm or smaller fans. The iMac is massive at the back meaning it can get larger fans in.

Phnom_Penh said:
But you quoted the Belina, not the BenQ (which incidentally goes for about £220 on most places)

The point was that the cheapest 20.1 is £50 more than the 20", which brings your interesting little system there down to less than the Apple.
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Then explain why the Dell's are exactly the same price when a 20.1 costs more to make? Either way paying extra for the looks, OS is fine for me.

dirtydog said:
That is what I said... the Dells with similar spec to the iMac are not noisy because we have them where I work. The high end ones, okay you've got me there because I've never seen (heard) one in the flesh.
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Ahh, at work. Well the Packard Bell ones at uni are quiet in a room with people and other noise. Listen to one in a silent bedroom and you'll see the difference.

From Wikipedia (source not perfect, I know):

Apple is considered a leader in the production of retail quiet PCs. The Apple G4 Cube had few moving parts and would be near-silent in operation if the old ball bearing hard drive was replaced and decoupled, and the Mac mini has only one fan and uses a laptop hard drive to achieve low noise emissions. Dell is considered to produce some quiet PCs by the standards of normal PC builders, however not of the standard of enthusiast silencer builds.

Ok I accept Dell may be better than most. They obviously put more effort in than others.

Apple are still better though :).
 
Al Vallario said:
I can see you've deliberately gone for the cheapest parts possible, have thrown together a spec very similar to that of the iMac configuration you quoted, and you only managed to save £300.
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No I haven't.

Al Vallario said:
But more importantly, you're comparing a full computer system with separate monitor to a computer which fits, in its entirety, into the size of 52.3 x 57.4 x 20.7 cm (bare in mind the depth includes the stand; the actual screen is razor-thin). With that in mind, it's downright daft to complain that the latter is £300 more expensive.
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I wasn't comparing them, someone asked for a spec to see what you could get for your money. But yes, they are comparable because they do the same damn thing.

Al Vallario said:
A mac may not be suited to your individual needs, but bare in mind that you are in the minority. 99% of computer users in the UK have no idea what overclocking is, couldn't care less if they have the latest graphics card and have never even thought about upgrading their computer. It would be stupid of Apple to down all tools and cater to your obscure needs and ignore 99% of the market for their products.
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Again, they asked for a comparable spec so I gave them one. I personally would like a Mac book but I can't afford one (the laptops are actually good value, too). And, like most people I want the fastest I can get for the least money. I am in the majority, if I had not specced that using fairly decent parts capable of overclocking I could have taken another £100 off the price.
 
Phnom_Penh said:
It's an OcUK screw up, both screens are 20.1". The FP costs more than the WFP on Dell's site.
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There's also a 20" NEC for £434 and a 20" Samsung for £240. The 20.1's don't cost loads more to make.

Why couldn't I have specced the PC with the NEC and said the iMac was £300 cheaper. Because I was trying to be fair about it.
 
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