Managing 2 (potential) job offers.

[ninjabib]

Hello all,

Around 7 weeks ago i was made redundant by JLR. I have been looking for work since then but no joy however i have finally had 2 interviews within the last week. I feel both went well. Both jobs are entry level jobs in new areas for me.

1 is within a local accounting firm. Essentially i will start of the bottom of the accountancy chain and over time work my way up whilst becoming qualified but by bit. This is around a 20k paycut to start with as i was on just over 40k at JLR but i can afford to do it and i also did accountancy during my college days but that was 20 years ago but i did enjoy it all things considered so have been giving a lot of thought as to self studing and doing AATor ACCA anyway.

The 2nd job is working for a water company, entry level technician. Start by doing maintenance on the water systems in designated areas and then working your up through the engineering ranks as you receive more training. This is around a 15k paycut to start with, again i can afford to take the hit. I have 0 experience in this field but all relevant training will be provided.

The water company have just rang me and left me a voicemail basically saying the jobs mine and can i give them a call back to discuss and confirm details. When i left the interview for the Accountancy firm last night the managing director said the job is as good as mine he just needs to work out the logistics of where to put me ,as someone who is currently doing the entry level stuff is now dying to tackle some juicier work. He said he will come back to me on Monday 1st April.

I liked all the people at both companies and am interested in both jobs but as of this time i only have 1 firm offer. I know that until the MD from the accounting company actually offers me a contract to take whatever is said lightly.

SO i guess my question is what do i say to the water company for now? I don't want to leave them hanging with no reply for 2 working days, that would be strange but also i would like to give the other firm till Monday. Although the accountancy job is less money to start with it doesn't involve night working which the water company does. Having just left night shifts after years and years i have no desire to return to it at 38 years old. As a career i also have a preference for accountancy as i do not know what the water technicains work will be like.

What is the best way to handle this wise people of OCUK?

Thanks in advance.

 

[ninjabib]

If it helps any: neither are firm offers until you get something in writing.

If you can't stall talking to the water company until after monday then at least try avoid accepting anything over the phone until you see a written offer of employment - that should give you enough time to find out whether the accountancy firm is really serious or not.

That's very good advice, i could verbally accept an offer and then a contract comes with terms different to the ones stated in the job advert and discussed at interview. Plus it gives me some time. Thank you.

Accountancy is more at risk from the threat of automation in the future, yes, you're already experienced in it but that's also a big pay cut from your old job.

The water company job sounds like it could end up being quite cushy, plus you'd get engineering experience. That can lead to a lot of other things and is highly sought after in terms of immigration if you ever wanted to do that. Also you'd likely get to travel a bit or at least not be stuck in a office, likely a lot less risk of outsourcing happening too than accountancy as you'd be dealing with physical elements rather than just numbers.

Good position to be in with two offers and a genuinely tough call, but I think I'd go with the water company for more money at the very least. Either way, best of luck.

I have wondered how much impact automation would have the accounts industry and how far away from that happening we are. Do you have any solid knowledge of this or just an expectancy?

Do you have any experience within the water network area? Just wondered why you think it will be cushy is all. If it is then that would be great haha but also I wouldn't mind being stuck in an office. It's been a decade since i did 'normal' hours. I am loathe to return to nights for an extra £40 per week take home after tax/pension/NI/student loan.

You have to act on the facts. At the moment you have no commitments because you've not received (and signed) a new contract.

If water company have left you a voicemail just call up and thank them, then let them know that you're considering the offer and you will let them know on Monday. This isn't unreasonable.

First thing Monday, give the accountancy job a call and tell them the score i.e. you have had an offer from another company but you'd prefer to work for them. Ask if they are willing to give you a formal offer as per the discussion with the MD.

I'd be wary though... why is the entry level guy bored? has he been there long? are you taking a massive pay cut to do boring work? where is the progression for you?

Likewise, could you ask the water company about flexibility regarding the shift pattern? If they want you and they have a policy about flexible working then you could negotiate something which suits you.

I'd look to get more from the water company than to jump in to a new career with such a big drop in wages but that is me.

Solid advice again, thank you. The MD stated that there are a lot of new rules and regulations that have come in recently and as a result most parts of most processes within accounting are now more labour intensive and less automated actually he said.The lady who is currently the junior had nearly finished her AAT BEFORE starting with this company and now she's pracitcally qualified and there is the opportunity for roles to be moved the MD said that she is constantly asking to move onto a more challenging role within the company. I *think* he said she has been there just under a year. The water board will not go above 25k, that has been discussed already when my last salary came up.

Pros/Cons i guess :

Accountacy role
:- Better Hours
:- Less than a mile from my home, can walk there every day in less than 15 mins. Next door to my gym too.
:- Can pick my working hours as long as i start between 8am-930am and do the 8 hour shift.
:- Personal preference work-wise as at least somewhat familiar with what to expect.
:- Chance to earn good money in a few years time. (I will also self study at home outside of work to get certified ASAP)

Cons - Less money to start, potential impact of automation?

Water company
:- Approx £160 per month take home better off.
:- Good chance of learning valuable skills.
:- Good chance of progression within a large company.

Cons - night shifts every other week, that takes it's toll, unsure of environment, told will get company van but my neighbour said if i park it outside my house i have to pay tax on it

 

[ninjabib]

Thanks for your input guys. My current problem is that when JLR notified me of redundancy i'd already committed too and begun 15k of home improvements with the builders which i have paid off now but i'm down to the last few grand in savings and the mortgage payments are biting hard.

I have tried with other Accountancy/junior type roles but got nowhere but this seems ideal. The people were very decent. Time/money is no longer on my side. If i don't have any suitable work in 4 weeks time i'm going to have to take a pub type job, casual work just to keep a roof over my head. I can't sit here waiting for other accountancy opportunities. I am continuing to look and apply of course. I can't even commit to paying for the first 2 modules of AAT or i'd have to get a min wage job right now.

I do find the Water technician job interesting don't get me wrong or i wouldn't have applied, i just REALLY don't want to do nights anymore, i've served my time.

 

[ninjabib]

What were you doing at JLR?

Stuck on production. Mainly vehicle assembly but also worked in quality control and vehicle launch. Nothing special but the pay is around 43.5k and most people are happy to sit on that and don't want to move up or take on more responsibility.

This seems a bit contradictory - if savings are dwindling and mortgage payments biting hard, is ~£20k going to cut it?

Had a couple of spare double rooms so have taken in 2 lodgers but I do know them personally so it's no biggie. That's covering the majority of the mortgage to be fair. I still need to find bills, credit card repayments etc etc. Perhaps I should have rephrased it too monthly outgoings.

 

[ninjabib]

Thanks for the info PC777 regarding interviews, i thought that but ive only had these 2 in the same week!!

Rang the water board back and the HR guy text me back as my call went to voicemail. Just out of courtesy to let me know he was on a days holiday today and we will chat Monday.

The MD of the accountancy also rang me today and asked me to pop in again Monday for an informal chat and to meet the person whose job I will be having so they can explain the job in more detail to me.

 

[ninjabib]

Spoke to both firms again. Water company first they have offered me the job and sending out a contract later this week..Just been to the accountancy firm for a 2nd time and he offfered me the trainee role there too.

Decision time!

 

[ninjabib]

Yep, thimking Accountancy as i have *some* idea of what i'm letting myself in, is within walking distance and no night shifts which is the main thing. Less starting money but within a few years i can be back on good money with relevant experience behind me.

 

[ninjabib]

Hmmm, had the offer from the accountancy firm and it is 2k below what we agreed. In the first interview he mentioned the x+ Y figures and i said i could go no lower than Y figure and he said ok but now he has offered me the X figure which i said i cannot afford in the interview. I could take the job but it would impact my take home by about £40 p/w from the Y figure and now there is a £100 difference between his firm and the water company.

Will email him and say i agree based on Y which is what discussed, if he won't budge i will have to go to the water board.

 

[ninjabib]

The water job sounds interesting to me, it really does, i believe it has a lot of potential to other areas/skills too, it just has night shifts which i have done plenty of and have no real burning desire to get back too. I also found out earlier that my best friends brother works there in the same area but a level or 2 higher and i've picked his brain this evening and said it's a good company to work for and the work is not intense like at JLR so he thinks i'll find the night shifts at ST a doddle in comparison.

I will email the MD back and if he doesn't budge i will have to pass. I like to think it's simply a slip and he basically says "oh yes, i remember you saying" if he doesn't then i'd feel like i'm being lowballed. I would study for AAT regardless of whatever job i take next. My preference would be to have some accountancy experience when i've completed it though.

 

[ninjabib]

In the first interview the MD said pay range would be from x-y. I said i can drop to Y but not lower he said ok then the discussion moved on. Salary wasn't broguht up today, it was very informal and mainly to meet the person who i would be taking over from. He said he would email the offer by the end of the week and the email came through a few hours later but with X figure on which i stated i cannot drop down too in the first interview.

 

[ninjabib]

He initiates contact by email on every occasion so i've gone along with it, plus i woud have a 'paper trail' so to speak. Anyway had a massive argument with my dad tonight so thought best to leave it till things cooled down. Will ring in the AM.

Water company is days/nights 50-50 they said. Not flexible outside of that.

 

[ninjabib]

I know I was silly to state my minimum salary requirements but I thought if I lay my cards on the table and say I cannot go lower than Y then they won't try and offer me X and as he said ok and changed subject I thought that was that but now he's offered me X.

I could take X and pay my outgoings but I'd be around another 200 a month worse off than under Y which would make any kind of social life hard.

The difference between X and the water board is now £100 a week. Myself I am just a bit wary too now. I stated Y, he said ok,moved on and 4/5 days later offers X. When I clearly said I can't take X so now it feels like the trust has taken a hit before I start.

My problem is that I own a house worth 300k that I got for half of that but it needed a lot of work. Stripped out from top to bottom. Doing that work has cost me 50k over 2 years. Half of which I took out my savings half personal.loans.My outgoings are 1500 per month which is a lot. That doesn't include anything socially. Mortgage/loans/credit card/bills and food. I only owe 140k inclusive so I have a lot of equity but not much cash now I'm gone from JLR.

I never expect a company to pay for all my training I like to self study out of work too. If I took the water board job I would still start AAT regardless. If the water board job turned out to be amazing then maybe id stop the self study.


Spoke to my friends brother again today and he said it really is a good place to work and the job is fairly chilled out. Everyone starts on shifts he said but he was off nights after a year as he moved up.

My dad isn't trying to help, he never has. He has mental health issues. It's draining when he makes contact as you know he's going to start an argument.

 

[ninjabib]

Good advice. Will let them know I cannot accept X as I have already stated.

 

[ninjabib]

Well the owner/MD just came back to me and said he understands my position and offered me an increase of £500 on X which is still well short of Y. He said that no one has entered the company on Y figure before even at the bottom.

He's also said he will give me another £500 in 6 months. Then put me onto Y figure from 1st Jan 2020 in 8 months.

Essentially he is saying if he gives me Y and other staff find out i started on Y not X they won't be happy but why agree to Y in our interview then?

Not sure how i feel about this. Opinions please?

 

[ninjabib]

I am thinking along the same lines as you Peter.

If he said that at the time there would have been no problem, i could have taken it or left it. No hard feelings. Now i'm thinking is it going to be like this everytime i ask for something especially if it's deserved. It is still my slight preference as not only will i have certs in 2/3 years time but i will have relevant experience. Whilst working with the water board i would only have the certs.

I hate the fact this is no longer straight forward when the point of me stating my lowest acceptable salary was Y figure was to avoid this kind of thing.

 

[ninjabib]

Spoke to him again and he's said he is happy to put everything down in writing and signed. Also said will include me in the company bonus scheme starting from day 1 which is normally only offered after a years service. This is paid out twice a year so I've accepted

The water board have put my start date back nearly a month as well on top of the original start date which is no use.

 

[ninjabib]

Yes it is a possibility i must admit. I just need to get in, do well and trust he will see it through. He said he will put it in writing within the contract. If it is my new contract that he is drafting up how can he legally avoid it?

 

[ninjabib]

Oh i will definitely do that. I was planning on asking him how i was doing as i complete my 5th month and remind him of his obligation.