Manual gearchanging

[miniyazz]

Doesn't it put more strain on the clutch?

If you've got a reasonable engine (and even if you don't sometimes, but it'll be more work) then the clutch will be designed to take far more punishment than gently pulling away in second

To pull away without labouring the engine in second gear in mine doesn't need revs of much more than 1000/min and I doubt the clutch even notices..
Pulling away more rapidly, obviously 1st gear is the tool for the job, but 2nd gear is plenty fast enough for typical stop/start driving, not that I pull away in 2nd often anyway.

 

[The_Abyss]

Because part of the fun is being skilful enough to master it yourself and having complete control over the mechanics of it.

I'm not saying a paddle shift can't be fun, and I've no doubt that it would make me much faster, but a manual shift gives a sense of involvement some of us like.

Sorry - I do understand exactly where you're coming from, but a fair while ago someone decided that decent programming could control the mechanics of an engine far more efficiently than a human. Gearboxes were next.

I understand the satisfaction of having the skill to execute this, but for most road cars in most situations a semi auto dual clutch box will simply do it far better. And there's still a great yet different sense of involvement.

 

[airwave99]

Definitely wouldn't start in 2nd in a 1.6, even with a slight downhill it feels like more strain on the clutch. Guess it would be different with a bigger engine.

 

[jamoor]

What's worst is people who seemingly refuse to use 1st gear when pulling away from a standstill, my dad does it all the time and you can sometimes feel the car struggling not to stall. WHY?!?!?

Never had this problem personally..in my e39 m5.

 

[Sin_Chase]

Smooth gear changing takes practice and is all in the balance of clutch and throttle.

Not just down shifting, but up shifting too, clutch should be going in before acceleration has been fully removed to remove the lurch of a snap removal of engine speed.

Smooth driving is an entirely different prospect on top of that. There is fast, there is smooth and there is fast and smooth. Ordered in amount of difficulty/skill required.

By smooth I mean cannot feel the gear change at all, purely transparent. It's surprising how difficult a fully smooth drive is and how much attention it requires.

 

[Antony101]

I've pulled out in 3rd in my 1.3 diesel before (accident). Not a clue how. It's got six gears though and no matter what you do pulling out in 1st is horrible.

 

[Matt82]

Nothing more pleasing than tapping the left paddle a couple of times, having the engine blip automatically and then accelerating hard through. I love the S-tronic gearboxes.

Erm, how about making all the magic happen yourself? Your input is two taps and the computers did the rest, so thats about the same enjoyment as youd get from a computer game, all you did was press a button

 

[lemonade]

Sorry - I do understand exactly where you're coming from, but a fair while ago someone decided that decent programming could control the mechanics of an engine far more efficiently than a human. Gearboxes were next.

I understand the satisfaction of having the skill to execute this, but for most road cars in most situations a semi auto dual clutch box will simply do it far better. And there's still a great yet different sense of involvement.

Thats a bit different really and its not about something doing it far better, personally there is no skill or satisfaction involved in a computer doing something for you, because at the end of the day you haven't done it yourself. But beside the point a manual gear is all about the driver involvement and control, I personally do not care if a computer is a 10th faster than me at shifting, I love the mechanical feel and the involvement of changing gears myself via a clutch and stick, pressing on some buttons for a computer to change just isn't the same, and much rather like playing a computer game with a steering wheel, of which how most modern cars feel like, not nice.

 

[alastair79]

Thats a bit different really and its not about something doing it far better, personally there is no skill or satisfaction involved in a computer doing something for you, because at the end of the day you haven't done it yourself. But beside the point a manual gear is all about the driver involvement and control, I personally do not care if a computer is a 10th faster than me at shifting, I love the mechanical feel and the involvement of changing gears myself via a clutch and stick, pressing on some buttons for a computer to change just isn't the same, and much rather like playing a computer game with a steering wheel, of which how most modern cars feel like, not nice.

Well said.

It’s my car and I want to drive it, if I wanted Microsoft to drive my car for me I’d kidnap Bill Gates.


.

 

[DXP55]

Smooth gear changing takes practice and is all in the balance of clutch and throttle.

Not just down shifting, but up shifting too, clutch should be going in before acceleration has been fully removed to remove the lurch of a snap removal of engine speed.

Smooth driving is an entirely different prospect on top of that. There is fast, there is smooth and there is fast and smooth. Ordered in amount of difficulty/skill required.

By smooth I mean cannot feel the gear change at all, purely transparent. It's surprising how difficult a fully smooth drive is and how much attention it requires.

This is exactly what I have been saying - He doesn't use clutch correctly - he dumps clutch peddle(By that I mean he just's takes his foot off instead of easing it up) up or down gears with a dunk sound and jerk of car. Not a smooth driver by any means - I have to say I find modern cars with high revving engines and light flywheels more difficult to drive smoothly through gears as the cars of earlier years - only 2 valve per cylinder engines with heavier flywheels as rev's don't instantly die.

I am a totally auto box man and always have been.

Dave

 

[Matt82]

I personally do not care if a computer is a 10th faster than me at shifting, I love the mechanical feel and the involvement of changing gears myself via a clutch and stick, pressing on some buttons for a computer to change just isn't the same, and much rather like playing a computer game with a steering wheel, of which how most modern cars feel like, not nice.

I was driving in town at the weekend, traffic wasnt gridlocked for once, you were able to drive about at a normal speed.

As you got to the slower/built up areas not only would you get a glimpse of your car in a shop window and as you got to turns you could heel n toe it down to second. Even at mundane speeds it still sounds amazing

The thrill of driving, no matter how mundane isnt about the thrill of pressing buttons

 

[iAustinMark]

Go out with him again and give him a few lessons. There is nothing more that men who drive MX5's love, than to be told they can't drive. Be sure to tell us how he takes it.

 

[The_Abyss]

Erm, how about making all the magic happen yourself? Your input is two taps and the computers did the rest, so thats about the same enjoyment as youd get from a computer game, all you did was press a button

Each to their own. I enjoy computer games and I enjoy driving. Now I'm getting the best of both worlds.

Maybe it comes with getting older - I've been driving for over 20 years and can really appreciate the technology, especially compared to when I first started to drive. Besides, if I want my manual fix I'll hop onto my Aprilia

 

[Hades]

I was driving in town at the weekend, traffic wasnt gridlocked for once, you were able to drive about at a normal speed.

As you got to the slower/built up areas not only would you get a glimpse of your car in a shop window and as you got to turns you could heel n toe it down to second. Even at mundane speeds it still sounds amazing

The thrill of driving, no matter how mundane isnt about the thrill of pressing buttons

So much this. I almost veered towards a DSG when I bought my Golf but decided to continue the search for a manual instead (try finding a manual with full leather instead of that tartan cloth - it's like hens teeth). Occasionally in traffic I'll wonder why I didn't get the DSG but most days I enjoy the feel of shifting gears and don't regret my decision. In an occasional car like my Corrado there is no question about preferring a manual. Even though the gear stick has a huuuuuuuge 90's era throw it's so enjoyable changing gear if you get it just right.

Modern cars are increasingly about gadgets and automation. Drive by wire, electric steering, etc, etc. I can see one day that I may get an auto for the family car but I hope I'll always have a manual in my life as well. While I fully appreciate what everyone wants from a car is different, personally I don't want to just ride in the car, I want to drive it. I often tell my kids that I expect by the time they learn to drive most cars will be auto however. Sadly it's inevitable that manual will be a choice offered less in the future as progress marches on.

 

[Scania]

I regularly pull away from standstill, on a flat stretch, in 4th ( truck not car! ) and regularly pull off in 2nd in my car too.

Rarely, even fully loaded, will I use 1st in the truck, it has two lower "crawler" gears that are in the main redundant.

As already said, clutches will take far worse abuse than pulling away in a gear other than first.

It's more a case of how you pull away i.e. slipping or not.

 

[Django x2]

Why not? It can be smoother and cuts a gearchange out. I sometimes do it. Car doesn't struggle.

My car only pulls away in 2nd, it never uses 1st unless I tell it to, but then, it is an auto

 

[snowdog]

I used to do this a lot in my first car, I used to shift up very aggressively trying to make the wheel slide when changing from 1 to 2 and 2 to 3. Learned not to do it in my 2nd car where I destroyed a clutch after about 20.000 km . Both the clutch plate and the bearing were knackered, result of too much burnouts and aggressive clutch dumping.

Releasing the clutch quickly when downshifting ( slowing down), why would anyone do that ? Upshifting I can understand, faster gearchange = faster acceleration, but why would you dump your clutch when changing your gear down ?

 

[[TW]Fox]

My car only pulls away in 2nd, it never uses 1st unless I tell it to, but then, it is an auto

Not quite, it uses first on a cold start as part of the warm up programme

 

[Django x2]

Hmm, not sure it does. If I drive off from cold and were to come straight up to a junction or lights, and stop, it wouldn't go to first. It might be in first from the off though (although doesn't feel like the first that S1 uses).