McLaren and Honda set to reunite?

MarcLister

MarcLister

MarcLister

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Two F1 journos (James Allen and Joe Saward) have articles on their blogs that McLaren are interested in Honda engines from 2014 onwards, thus potentially resurrecting the glory days of Senna, Prost and Honda powered McLarens.

Mercedes do have a contract with McLaren until 2015 but apparently McLaren are working towards buying the last 16% of the company that Mercedes own. Then McLaren could conceivably bring forward the end of their contract with Mercedes by a couple of years so that they can use Honda engines from 2014 when the new engine rules take effect.

As James Allen says, with Williams powered by Renault again from 2012 onwards, retro partnerships are all the rage now. We just need McLaren and Honda to work together again and use the classic red and white livery. Of course they won't be using Marlboro on the cars. :(

Initially I thought this Honda and McLaren deal could be quite hard to pull off but reading through both the articles it does seem possible. If Mercedes and McLaren are going to split, surely Mercedes would prefer McLaren not to have two years worth of knowledge of their 2014 engine so Mercedes could be quite happy to end their deal with McLaren after 2013 so that only the works Mercedes team gets the 2014 Mercedes engine. And whilst Honda has many issues in Japan, the high exchange rates mean that any European based project Honda work on would be 40% cheaper than it was in 2008. They ran an entire team then so perhaps they could be tempted to resurrect a legendary partnership and power McLaren as their engine partner.

So who else wants this to happen? I'm not old enough to know/remember the halcyon days of McLaren, Honda, Marlboro, Senna and Prost but I'd love to see a classic team and engine pairing back together again. McLaren will lose out if they don't find themselves an engine partner as Renault now consider Red Bull their main team, Ferrari have their own engines and Mercedes the same. If McLaren want to stay competitive it looks as if they need to tempt Honda back into F1. When I first heard of the 2015 split between McLaren and Mercedes I assumed that McLaren would do a Ferrari and make their own engines, using their expertise gained from their road cars project. Perhaps they've decided that they need an experienced engine partner and can't do a Ferrari just yet.

James Allen says that the McLaren Honda partnership won 44 races between 1988 and 1992. Having a quick check on Wikipedia shows that of the five seasons between 1988 and 1992 inclusive there were 16 races in each season so for McLaren to win 44 of those 80 races is quite a stunning achievement, 55% of the races between '88 and '92 were won by McLaren!

James Allen's blog

Joe Saward's blog

The Auto Motor und Sport article (in German) that both Allen and Saward seem to be getting their knowledge of this potential deal from.

The English translation of the Auto Motor und Sport article.
 
Just read that on twitter.

Doesn't sound that positive tbh, more of some one said something so we'll write an article.

Still I'm always wrong so we'll see.
 
Why do people get nostalgic about engine manufacturers (with regards to this and the Williams-Renault deal)? There's absolutely no guarantee it will yield any success. For all I care, McLaren could team up with Skoda, as long as the engine was good enough.
 
Glaucus said:
Just read that on twitter.

Doesn't sound that positive tbh, more of some one said something so we'll write an article.

Still I'm always wrong so we'll see.
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Yeah I admit its only a possibility but its one option for 2014 I didn't think McLaren could take when the 2015 end of the McLaren Mercedes partnership was announced, which was pretty much due to Mercedes buying out Brawn wasn't it? Mercedes wanted a greater say in McLaren's operations but despite being part owned by Mercedes, McLaren were hesitant to do this. So Mercedes bought Brawn and decided to concentrate their efforts on their own team.

Weebull said:
Why do people get nostalgic about engine manufacturers (with regards to this and the Williams-Renault deal)? There's absolutely no guarantee it will yield any success. For all I care, McLaren could team up with Skoda, as long as the engine was good enough.
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It's not much the engine manufacturers as the actual partnership between McLaren and Honda between 1988 and 1992. I think its the nostalgia and history and the iconic livery McLaren ran when they had Prost and Senna battling it out. When Williams unveil their new car in pre-season testing they often run it in a dark blue livery that hints at a similar livery for the coming season as the Rothmans Williams Renault ran in the mid to late 90s. Eventually Williams go for a livery with more white than dark blue but its the same thing. Williams dominated the sport for a few years with a Rothmans livery and a Renault engine so when Williams and Renault get back together it means a lot to many F1 fans as they remember the 'glory days'.
 
It will be all change come 2014, so there is no reason why McLaren would want to change.

I think the bigger story in all this, that has been somewhat overlooked, is Honda are coming back to F1.
 
I would Love to see Honda back in the capacity they should be, an engine supplier. I've read lots suggesting they failed the last time because they didn't as expected rejoin with Mclaren.

I doubt Mclaren would allow anything but the cream at Honda to get involved with their team, unlike BAR.
 
F1 needs more engines and Honda would be a pretty good move, provided they made a decent one.

I'd like it to happen. I'd also like Williams to use retro livery but thats less likely, which is a shame as the bright colours make the sport nicer to watch.
 
I don't think there's ever been a problem with the honda engines. It was regarded as one of the lightest and had good power when they were involved. The problem was the car was absolutely crap for the last few years.
 
MissChief said:
I don't think there's ever been a problem with the honda engines. It was regarded as one of the lightest and had good power when they were involved. The problem was the car was absolutely crap for the last few years.
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Regarded as lightest and had good power by who? I always read and was under the impression it was heavier and down on power on the top 3 by upto 50bhp. The only time they got close was before the reliability rules came in. When that came in they have to wind the engine down a bit or they would never have lasted more than a race.

I still highly doubt had the Honda been in the brawn that it would have won the title that year.
 
The Brawn might have been even faster with it though. Cause the Mercedes retrofit screwed up weight distribution and centre of gravity also, apparently. I daresay they would have had a few more engine failures through the season though.
 
I thought of this possibility when commenting on the Super Car program - glad it wasnt such an "out there" comment :)

Another possible view point from all concerned is that BECAUSE the McLaren-Honda partnership was SO good years ago, there is a big risk to expecting anything like that same success (It would be interesting to know if Honda engines were in f1 previous to teh partnership so they had current experience at the time)

With such drastic changes currently expected in 2014 engine wise - is there any value in knowledge built up from winning races prior to 2014 with a different type of engine?

I would love to see McLaren - Honda back again, but it would also be (possible more) interesting to see what McLaren can do themselves , rather than buy in a unit other teams potentially have access to


Although its hard to know I always understood that Brawn lost out more from retrofitting the Merc unit than they would have from using the Honda (even though it was heavier and down on power)
 
No reason why McLaren couldn't work in partnership with Honda to develop an engine that is then branded as a McLaren... and then sold to other teams?

With their engine deal with Merc ending next year, McLaren effectively have a completely free choice of what to do for the 2014 regulations. I would imagine that Honda engines are just one of many possible plans they have in mind.
 
Skeeter said:
:confused:

That statement could be applied equally to any current or proposed engine manufacturer when it comes to 2014 spec engines...?
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its a japanese company we all know what happens when they dont end up with what they expected...

you cant apply it to all current engine manufactures either...
 
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