Media Server spec

Jed Shields · 15 Dec 2008 at 10:27

Hi guys,

I'm looking at putting together a "media server" that'll be on 24/7 and hold all my movies, tv shows, music, photos etc. It'll serve my PC, my wifes PC and my HTPC downstairs.

I'll be using an old Athlon 2600 CPU and ABIT board that has 4 SATA ports with RAID capability, plus 2 IDE ports and 2Gb RAM. I've kept this for a while as I new it would come in useful sometime

I'm looking to buy a new case that can hold a lot of drives, an energy efficient PSU, 4x 1Tb HDDs that I'll probably put into a RAID 5 array. I've also got some old IDE HDDs (ranging from 160 to 250Gb) that I can add for additional backup storage.

So , I'm looking at buying:

Antec 300 Gaming case - £47 - seems to have lots of expansion potential.
Antec Earthwatt 380 PSU - £35 - high efficiency?
4x 1Tb Western Digital Green drives @ £75 each - £300, again, low running costs?
LG BluRay HD-DVD drive - £65. I've already got one in my HTPC, but don't mind getting an additional one as a backup as I want to make sure I can still play my HD-DVDs in the future. It also means I can rip them from up in my computer room.

Does this sound okay?

RAID 5 - I'm still not sure if I should go this route as it means going from 4Tb worth of storage to 3Tb. Or should I just backup the important files to other drives? I still have 1Tb in my HTPC and 1Tb in my PC, plus another 2x 500Gb in my NAS ...

EDIT - software - I'll either be using a free educational version of Server 2003, Vista Home Premium or possibly a free copy of XP ...

PistolPete · 15 Dec 2008 at 12:14

That sounds perfectly fine for what you want.

As for the RAID5 or not question - that's a choice based on a) how important is the information to you. b) How easy do you want it to be c) how much data you need to store. I'd say that you should plan to have 50% more storage than you actually need now for expansion.

I've recently had a scare with some data loss just day before moving from an unprotected drive to mirroring. I've now got mirroring sorted which is OK, but what if the house burns down or a power spike fries everything??
I've got all my storage in RAID1 atm, but that's going to RAID5 next year as I add another 1TB disk for more space. However, there is a small amount of the data (mostly digital pics, financial data and home vids) that I simply can not afford to lose. I've got an external drive that I'll now be periodically updating all the irreplaceable data too and storing it 150 miles away!

Jed Shields · 15 Dec 2008 at 14:07

How easy is it to expand a RAID system? Is it just a case of adding additional disks, or do you need to reformat the drives and start again with the added ones?

Jed Shields · 15 Dec 2008 at 22:31

Any more opinions? Any other case recommendations?

LordSplodge · 15 Dec 2008 at 22:35

RAID5 has high overheads so maybe RAID 0+1? The 4 1TB drives would give you 2TB of striped storage + two mirrors for speed and resilience!

Jed Shields · 17 Dec 2008 at 15:49

What do you mean by high overheads? I'm not sure I want to lose 2Tb's worth of storage ... this will be for media files that I own, rather than files that are irreplaceable, so while re-ripping them will be a major PITA, it won't be the end of the world ...

I can set up a mirrored system in my NAS using 2x 500Gb files for all my irreplaceable data ie photos and home movies ...

PhillyDee · 17 Dec 2008 at 16:05

You could always look into Windows Home Server. To expand disk space, turn off Pc (Or unless you have hotswap) add disk. Boot up and tell winodws to expand onto it. Can duplicate files, can use different sized disks, Based around 2003. Get your own little domain to access your home server with so you can get to your files. Its designed for exactly what you want it for. Of course, it costs money . . . .

Jed Shields · 17 Dec 2008 at 16:21

If I manage to get Server 2008 for free then it's a big additional outlay. However, if I need to buy an OS then it's probably worth considering ...

I assume you can also add raided disks to Home Server, or does it provide it's own redundancy options?

PhillyDee · 17 Dec 2008 at 16:54

No need to use RAID. Raid is an 'unsoppurted method' in WHS due to it being geared towards home users. Its a simple as selecting what folders you want duplicated.
Heres mine:

And a disk view

The RAIDCore drivers are an 8-port Sata/SAS controller that I got for £60 (Bargain!). To add the drives it has to be a JBOD single disk array. Other cards may not work like that ofc. Originally it had just 3 500gb drives.
You can get plenty of plugins for the server itself. Also has backup facilities for your connected PC's.

You can get a free trial im sure . . . I would recommend trying it first before buying it. Might not be what you want.

Edit: You can also get to it via a remote desktop session, but it warns you can break it. Personally, I use TwonkyMedia to serve my DVD's and photos etc around my house. 100000000% better than the Media player version they use.

Jed Shields · 17 Dec 2008 at 17:22

Ahh ... so with RAID 5 with 4x 1Tb drives I'd have 3 Tb worth of data with redundancy, but with WHS I'd have 2Tb of data and 2Tb of duplicate files?

PhillyDee · 17 Dec 2008 at 17:39

Yes, but how do you add another disk into a Raid 5 array, and it stops you adding different capacities. Obviously WHS is meant for a home user, where Raid5 requires more technical knowledge. But you only duplicate what you want to. I have enough storage to duplicate everything, intentionally of course! If one of my 1tb drives fails, WHS will automatically ensure that there is a duplcate of everything I want there to be by copying the files onto another hard drive again. I have no idea if RAID5 does this. With WHS I can just clag in another/replacement disk of any capacity and it does it business in the background.
Its simple, requires no thought, and does exactly as required for the market its aimed at.

Jed Shields · 17 Dec 2008 at 19:37

How does WHS duplicate from a failed drive? WHS sounds like it might be worth the investment ...

Jed Shields · 17 Dec 2008 at 19:51

One more question ... if I set up the system with Server 2008 with the 4x 1Tb drives as individual drives ie not raided, could I convert to WHS in the future and join all the disks together without losing the data, or does it need to be set up from the start?

PhillyDee · 17 Dec 2008 at 20:04

It just makes sure it copies the data so it has a duplicate. On the bottom of one of the screen shots it says Storage Balanced then date/time.
It uses 1 hard drive formats and partitions 20Gb for the system, and the rest as a landing zone. When you copy to the server it all gets dumped onto that zone and then WHS copies it off there and onto an appropriate disk. Thats why you must use your largest hard drive. You wouldnt be able to pull out a hard drive and use the data on another machine due to the way it is stored. When you add a drive to 'the pool' (Available drives for storage) it formats it (After asking you). You could do it gradually by adding a drive, copying data from it to the pool, then adding that drive to the pool, but thats the only way.

http://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/category/windowshomeserver/

Microsoft forums. You will be able to get much more info in there.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/windowshomeserver/demo.mspx

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/windowshomeserver/eval.mspx

And the demo discs.

Install it and have a play. Then you can find out if its what you want/need.

Jed Shields · 18 Dec 2008 at 18:49

Right, I'm convinced about WHS ...

Next problem, the old mobo I was going to use has no SATA ports, and a 4 port SATA card costs £70. It's probably better to buy a new mobo, CPU and RAM. Any suggestions for low cost, energy efficient kit that's good enough for server duties?

decto · 18 Dec 2008 at 19:34

I think AMD are ideal for these type of applications

Mainboard, decent audio, HDMI out, 1080p capable and AM2+ / AM3 compatable for future upgrades if needed or you decide to turn it into a media centre. No real price disadvantage.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...ATX (Socket AM2) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard

CPU, any dual core.... buy cheap. AMD use very little power when cool and quiet throttles back. My server s939 opty 165 with 3 x 1TB uses 55W at idle, stepping up to around 100W if it's encoding .... That's with 4 drives spinning accounting for about 20w of power. Serving files it never steps up above 1Ghz idle.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...X2 Dual Core 4200+ 2.20GHz (Socket AM2) - OEM

You could easily spend more but it isn't needed.

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Edit

I also like this case, worth a look on Antecs site

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...wer Case - Black/Silver (430W Earth Watts PSU)

though I use the smaller 4480 version.

Smurfin · 18 Dec 2008 at 19:47

decto said:
I think AMD are ideal for these type of applications

Mainboard, decent audio, HDMI out, 1080p capable and AM2+ / AM3 compatable for future upgrades if needed or you decide to turn it into a media centre. No real price disadvantage.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...ATX (Socket AM2) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard

CPU, any dual core.... buy cheap. AMD use very little power when cool and quiet throttles back. My server s939 opty 165 with 3 x 1TB uses 55W at idle, stepping up to around 100W if it's encoding .... That's with 4 drives spinning accounting for about 20w of power. Serving files it never steps up above 1Ghz idle.

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...X2 Dual Core 4200+ 2.20GHz (Socket AM2) - OEM

You could easily spend more but it isn't needed.

AD

Edit

I also like this case, worth a look on Antecs site

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...wer Case - Black/Silver (430W Earth Watts PSU)

though I use the smaller 4480 version.

Decto

You mention the mobo and a similar processor I was going for on my build, but I've been told that ripping/re-encoding blu-rays will take a loooong time (see my thread in this forum for the new spec I'm looking at)....it's been suggested that I look at quad core with 8MB RAM instead. It bothers me that blurays (I have a big collection) could take 15+ hours to rip and re-encode.

I want to re-encode them where possible to get rid of extras/unnecessary audio streams, and apparently this is quite processor/RAM intensive?

Any advice from your experience would be appreciated

Cheers
Matt

Jed Shields · 18 Dec 2008 at 20:12

I was more interested in this mobo:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...H AMD 740G (AM2) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard

Basically because it's got 6 SATA ports ... I'll probably be using all 6 for HDDs, then some older HDDs that are IDE together with an old IDE DVD drive. My HD encoding will be done on my Q6600 PC ... I guess the server will mainly be used for storage and streaming of music, dvds and some HD content.

CPU - that was the one I was looking at ...

Case - I was looking at the Antec 300 Gamer as it has 6 internal HDD bays, together with an Antect 380W Earthwatts PSU. This come in at just over the price of the one you mention ... I'll have a think about that one ...

decto · 18 Dec 2008 at 20:23

Smurfin said:
Decto

You mention the mobo and a similar processor I was going for on my build, but I've been told that ripping/re-encoding blu-rays will take a loooong time (see my thread in this forum for the new spec I'm looking at)....it's been suggested that I look at quad core with 8MB RAM instead. It bothers me that blurays (I have a big collection) could take 15+ hours to rip and re-encode.

I want to re-encode them where possible to get rid of extras/unnecessary audio streams, and apparently this is quite processor/RAM intensive?

Any advice from your experience would be appreciated

Cheers
Matt

Talk of such misdeeds in not allowed on OCUK so I'll generalise

A high clocked quad would be 3-4 times faster than a low end AMD at encoding, so for large file sizes it's probably worth investing in a mulicore machine though I'm not convinced huge amounts of ram are required as it's a linear operation. You'd also want source and target drives.

My server box is only used for files and encoding so time isn't a critical factor. I just line them up and they're done when they're done.

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decto · 18 Dec 2008 at 20:33

Jed Shields said:
I was more interested in this mobo:

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showp...H AMD 740G (AM2) PCI-Express DDR2 Motherboard

Basically because it's got 6 SATA ports ... I'll probably be using all 6 for HDDs, then some older HDDs that are IDE together with an old IDE DVD drive. My HD encoding will be done on my Q6600 PC ... I guess the server will mainly be used for storage and streaming of music, dvds and some HD content.

CPU - that was the one I was looking at ...

Case - I was looking at the Antec 300 Gamer as it has 6 internal HDD bays, together with an Antect 380W Earthwatts PSU. This come in at just over the price of the one you mention ... I'll have a think about that one ...

The other Antec case comes with a 430W earthwatts supply, 5 quick remove bays and you can install HDD's in the 5.25 bays with brackets that cost about £2 delivered so there are a few options.

Get a USB DVDRW, a drive will use power (5-10W idle) when plugged in so you may as well keep the internal connectors for HDD's and just plug in the DVD when you need it.

The mobo you're looking at is fine, it just has a lower spec HDMI output and lacks future AM2+ AM3 capability. I'm going to drop an HDMI capable card in mine at some point then drop a line down to a bedroom TV for another user point.... shame to waste hardware!

The other boards have 6 SATA's they just have one on the back panel so you'd need to imaginatively route the cable back inside if you want to use it.

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