Mk4 Golf GTI - why so slow?

eidolon

eidolon

eidolon

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Been researching Mk4 Golfs and according to Parkers the ordinary 1.6 does 0-60 in 10.6secs and the 2.0 GTI does it in 10.2secs

Am I missing something or is the GTI just really, really slow?

The 1.8 turbo seems to have potential though, anyone got/driven one?
 
They standard GTIs are pretty poor, infact i'd say embarrassing slow for what is meant to be a warm hatch. I've had a couple have a go with it's just ridiculous how much they get left behind.

The 1.8T is a pretty solid engine and is used across the whole VAG range so there are a massive amount of mods are available for it. Can be taken to 200/220bhp+ for a reasonable cost too.

Although I'd be interested to know how well the golf would handle with standard/more power?
 
Waaaaaaay too much car, not enough engine. The 2.0 is 115hp if I remember right - just 15hp more than the 1.6, and not really enough to propel something like the MkIV Golf with any kind of GTi-ish vigour.
 
Ancient engine design, strangled by emissions, poor fuel economy. Only in the UK was this engine called GTI.
 
No power and lots of weight. It's an excercise in badge engineering and was designed to appeal to late 30's yuppy women who remember their boyfriends having a real GTI some 15 years previously.
 
even the 20vt sucks. it has the gheyest power delivery ive ever known. lots of shove at 2krpm like a big diesel, then it goes soft after that, no manic chase to the redline etc

all round a rather ghey car

comfy etc tho, which is great if youre ghey and like that sort of thing
 
Matt82 said:
even the 20vt sucks. it has the gheyest power delivery ive ever known. lots of shove at 2krpm like a big diesel, then it goes soft after that, no manic chase to the redline etc
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Have you driven a remapped one? Surely with 200+ BHP they must be fun?
 
200bhp+ ones are pretty quick but the Mk4 seriously lacks in the handling department from the factory, only really the R32 was pretty decent from factory and even then a couple of choice mods make it handle considerably better.

A slightly later 1.8T with the ko3s turbo so it can be mapped to around 220-230bhp (early ones have a ko3 turbo which is only good for 200bhp), coilovers and uprated ARBS make the Mk4 a descent hot hatch. It is a small turbo so a lot of low down torque but does tail off quickly after 5-5.5k

On the road the 1.6 feels as on par performance wise as the 2L one and it was only in the UK and America that the 2L ones were actually badged GTI which is joke considering they were slow and couldn't really go round corners fast. They are pretty comfy on the motorway though as the seats are good and the suspension is soft.
 
Matt82 said:
even the 20vt sucks. it has the gheyest power delivery ive ever known. lots of shove at 2krpm like a big diesel, then it goes soft after that, no manic chase to the redline etc

all round a rather ghey car
Click to expand...

The power delivery is that of a turbo'd petrol car :)

Mine peaks at 16psi @ 3kish and pulls about 14-15psi all the way up to the redline.... and it chases the redline like it's going out of fashion :p

Maybe you drove a car with some troubles?
 
Matt82 said:
even the 20vt sucks. it has the gheyest power delivery ive ever known. lots of shove at 2krpm like a big diesel, then it goes soft after that, no manic chase to the redline etc

all round a rather ghey car

comfy etc tho, which is great if youre ghey and like that sort of thing
Click to expand...

My 1.8T drives NOTHING like that, infact the torque curve shows the complete opposite story. A flat rush of torque from just under 3000 RPM right up to the redline.

EDIT: Well thats two in this thread so far...
 
It's all in the power to weight!

This is a factor so many people overlook, and is something that makes smaller cars great.

Take something like a Saxo VTS; it only has a 1.6 16v engine with 120Bhp but weighs next to nothing so it's a right little pocket rocket and will suprise a lot of bigger engine cars!

Tbh, if you did get a Mk4 Golf, get the 1.8T so you have some good foundations to build on and you could see over 200Bhp without too much hassle.
 
paradigm said:
My 1.8T drives NOTHING like that, infact the torque curve shows the complete opposite story. A flat rush of torque from just under 3000 RPM right up to the redline.

EDIT: Well thats two in this thread so far...
Click to expand...

I driven vairous 1.8Ts and the ko3 or ko3s ones torque do tail off after 5-5.5k even on remapped ones this can be seen on any rolling road graph of course they will still go to the redline with ease, not sure if I have your name wrong but think you drive a Leon Cupra R which has the bigger k04 turbo and will pull harder to the redline than a ko3 or ko3s car.
 
Dangerous Dave said:
I driven vairous 1.8Ts and the ko3 or ko3s ones torque do tail off after 5-5.5k even on remapped ones this can be seen on any rolling road graph of course they will still go to the redline with ease, not sure if I have your name wrong but think you drive a Leon Cupra R which has the bigger k04 turbo and will pull harder to the redline than a ko3 or ko3s car.
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Can you show me these graphs? Because from what i've seen they both tail off a little at the top end (k04 / k04/s).

k04 will pull harder to the redline as it's generally used on the BAM engine which will be 225bhp ish standard and can remap to 250bhp?

So are you telling me a car with more BHP will pull harder to the redline? Cool, thanks for the info.. I would have never guessed. :cool:
 
ive driven plenty of them.

ive logged the ignition advance too, the have so much response off boost becuase they timing goes to something daft like 30* advanced, then boost arrives (just short of 2krpm, like a diesel) and then after 4.5krpm it goes soft (the power delivery levels off, if youre putting it politely)

not GTI in the slightest and not what a petrol turbo car should be like at all

i drove a mk1 golf with a BAM engine at the weekend, mapped to 260+ with a ko4. much of the same, massive delivery and wheelspin at low revs then went sensible at the time

IMO... petrol turbo engine would be like an mr2 turbo. a bit of lag perhaps then it goes... and keeps on pulling harder to the redline... none of this diesel sillyness that modern cars have

oh... and remapped ko3s cars at the pod were about 4 tenths quicker up the strip than my mk3. a combination of lame delivery and galactic weight meaning that with 230bhp odd they were not that quick
 
ethos said:
Can you show me these graphs? Because from what i've seen they both tail off a little at the top end (k04 / k04/s).

k04 will pull harder to the redline as it's generally used on the BAM engine which will be 225bhp ish standard and can remap to 250bhp?

So are you telling me a car with more BHP will pull harder to the redline? Cool, thanks for the info.. I would have never guessed. :cool:
Click to expand...

Heres a rolling road graph of a friends Leon Cupra, it had the KO3s turbo replaced with a hybrid ko4. This was a quick car however still tails off at the top end, its now has a GT28RS on it though and that pulls very hard to 7k although it should with over 300bhp and 300lft.

http://www.dhossack.plus.com/csd_19 dyno.jpg

the 2nd run is another Leon Cupra with the same ko4 hybrid turbo but a different FMIC (APR, top one has a Forge FMIC)

http://www.dhossack.plus.com/dynorun.jpg

Both ceratinly pulled harder than there remapped ko3s after 5k, with the ko3s and a good start his best 1/4 mile time was 14.69, with the ko4 he struggled for traction and got around 14.4 I think. He has had a GPS'd 161mph out of the ko4 aswell. He has still to do a 1/4 run with his GT28RS

Also I am not saying a bigger BHP car pulls harder high up the revs, I am saying a bigger turbo'd car can deliver more boost high up allowing it to pull harder to the redline than with a smaller turbo on the same engine.
 
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I'd like to point out I don't own a gti here... but I do run a remapped AUQ 1.8T :D

Mine DEF doesn't go soft after 4.5k, infact i'd say it really picks up at 4k+
 
I think it all depends what you are comparing it too. I don't think mine is soft either (soft compared to what I've had) and it's not the golf, it's the Leon Cupra, which share the same runnning gear and kit etc.

What I want next is:
R32 MK4
Audi S4 (53 plate)
Audi S3

so yes it is soft compared with the above etc.

Oh and mine has been Revo'd and has had a Miltek added. Any of the above will be getting Revo too or AMD one click plus the Miltek :D
 
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