Mobile operates lose $13.9bn

All it means is prices will rise.
Still need SMS for the time being, so operators will just rise cost to claw back some money. I can see basic minimum contract and payg going up. More like a standing order than for actual minutes/data/SMS.

0800 are now free, decline in SMS. They're just going to up the price of minimum contracts.
 
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They have not lost anything according to the article. Their profits are down by that, they are still making a massive profit. Expect to see higher charges for using data though.
 
The 13.9Billion loss is just a loss of SMS revenue. The revenue from SMS was still 154Billion (13.9Billion was 9% of total SMS revenue) :).
 
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sven256 said:
They have not lost anything according to the article. Their profits are down by that, they are still making a massive profit. Expect to see higher charges for using data though.
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SMS costs nothing for the network operators, I'm surprised they get away with charging as much as they do!
 
This is a little bit like saying video cassette sales have been lower since DVD's were introduced. Less people texting now, more people using data...
 
Generally Data costs far less than texts though.
So I expect it's still an over loss of profits. But more people using mobiles so probably still overall up.
 
I'll be glad when they are merely dumb pipes.

I don't need most of the rubbish they offer.

It's like BT. I was looking at getting a telephone line for broadband. BT told me that they do not offer any telephone lines with a call package.

What good is a calls package to someone who wants a line for broadband only?
 
Every since the 3G licences were won, the operators were desperate to avoid becoming "dumb bit pipes", picture messaging and video calls were attempts at generating higher margins on data. The operators have failed.
 
The amount of sympathy that I have for the mobile operators on this issue could be fitted in the following punctation mark -> .

SMS is obscenely expensive for what it is, with Apple competing with iMessage, smartphones becoming way more prevalent and apps like WhatsApp etc I can easily see this trend continuing downwards.
 
Rich_L said:
The amount of sympathy that I have for the mobile operators on this issue could be fitted in the following punctation mark -> .

SMS is obscenely expensive for what it is, with Apple competing with iMessage, smartphones becoming way more prevalent and apps like WhatsApp etc I can easily see this trend continuing downwards.
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Well if you actually knew what goes into running, maintaining and upgrading a mobile network, you may have a different outlook ;)

SMS, its actually quite a complex system, it has to handle and forward millions upon millions of text messages at the same time, no mean feat.

Cell sites... the costs of putting these out increase the further they are away from any type of SDH hub, fibre optics cost a small fortune to run in initially, they dont take the most direct route, it leaves cell sites a little isolated as the more data people want, the more SDH equipment needs to go in, which brings us onto...

Transmisson.
We have several types, TDM, ATM and now IP are the more common, it costs to put this kit in, you need it for data as they are capable of carrying large ammounts of information and are far more reliable than cat switches.
The infrastructure that needs to go in to accommodate an increase in transmission is quite massive tbh.

Core. Well your cells have to be attached to something, 2G use BTS/BSC's, 3G use RNC's, LTE is pure data and uses a totally different method.
The use of Media Gateways, reliable blade servers, HLR's, MSC's. MSCS's, and the way that calls are connected (its far more complex over a fixed line system), and the fact that mobile technology is actually being upgraded on a yearly basis compared to fixed line, shows you how expensive it is to run mobile networks.

If you remove your mobile networks from the equasion, you wouldnt be able to do anything, you actually need them, so as much as you may not like them, they are necessary ;)
 
All good..then you read stuff like this:

http://gthing.net/the-true-price-of-sms-messages

US-centric as they refer to the ridiculous practice over here of charging you to receive calls and messages, so even less symnpathy for the US operators!

Don't get me wrong, I love the way cellular technolgy is evolving, 4G LTE is epic etc - but that doesn't change the the profit/cost ratio on SMS messages is just ridiculous and hence the idea of it being replaced with instant IP-based messaging does not fill me with sadness and misery :p
 
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Fundamentally, it should cost roughly £6-£10 per month for an allowance of say 300 mins, unlimited texts and 500mb data. I feel that due to the fact the infrastructure is well established already, they are really making money from text messages and calls and less so with data. I think on the pay and go market 10p a text is a complete joke!
 
englishpremier said:
I'll be glad when they are merely dumb pipes.

I don't need most of the rubbish they offer.

It's like BT. I was looking at getting a telephone line for broadband. BT told me that they do not offer any telephone lines with a call package.

What good is a calls package to someone who wants a line for broadband only?
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Virgin will run you a broadband-only pipe. When I get to the stage in my life where I look at buying a house I doubt i'll bother with a landline - so if BT's obstinance makes them expensive they won't get my custom.
 
anyon said:
SMS might be dying, but with smartphone usage increasing I bet they make loads on data.
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Data is not profitable today - the networks only work because of the far far higher margins they are able to charge for voice and SMS. They are in effect cross-subsidising one part of the business with another, not a smart long term strategy. I worked for an operator for 10 years, did I a lot of the early work on 3G network design - I left a few years ago when it became clear that the exciting, hi-tech industry had become just another low margin utility.
 
Rich_L said:
All good..then you read stuff like this:

http://gthing.net/the-true-price-of-sms-messages

US-centric as they refer to the ridiculous practice over here of charging you to receive calls and messages, so even less symnpathy for the US operators!

Don't get me wrong, I love the way cellular technolgy is evolving, 4G LTE is epic etc - but that doesn't change the the profit/cost ratio on SMS messages is just ridiculous and hence the idea of it being replaced with instant IP-based messaging does not fill me with sadness and misery :p
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Most of that is BS, yanks for you :p
We in the UK do not get charged for receiving sms's from other UK operators, abroad you may be charged because you are using someone elses network, but even if the SMS is moving towards its twilight period, its still a more efficient system than an instant IP system like BB messenger.
The biggest thing that makes people in the telecoms industry laugh, is that people will send shed loads of sms's instead of making a single call which would last no more than a couple of minutes, in 99% of cases it is more than possible to do so, and MMS, thats going the way of 3G video calls, charged a packet for sending an MMS or just add to an email as an attachment for nothing, hmmm......

Most things are going packet network over switched network, its a nightmare scenario as packet brings more problems than it solves, but its cheaper, a major factor when you have to replace half your kit every few years.
 
clv101 said:
Data is not profitable today - the networks only work because of the far far higher margins they are able to charge for voice and SMS. They are in effect cross-subsidising one part of the business with another, not a smart long term strategy.
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I don't want to call this out but you must know this is crap if you have experience in the industry, data is a good source of revenue and is far from loss making.
SMS costs nothing for the network operators, I'm surprised they get away with charging as much as they do!
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RIP termination charges :( TB you forgot the most important thing in PSS - it's the easiest to outsource the fixing with ;) The report is largely a huge "you don't say" type thing but it's not like the writing was on the wall since day dot. Networks have tried a few experiments over the years to see what works from loyalty enhancement to add value services and we know a lot more these days, LTE will be a nice expansion and if the second gen gets up to speed then it will be an easy sell for ground links.
 
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