Soldato
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After 7 months, I'd not be offering any sort of refund. Sod that!
Mobile phone sale problem (another forum)
- Thread starter Ben Cole
- Start date
Caporegime
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The timing does seem odd....
Soldato
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It's an inherent risk with buying a 2nd hand phone, the reason I won't do it.
I think if you were clear in your sale about the origins of the phone, then the person buying has to take some responsibility for due diligence on their part. They knew the history (or should have checked) and that's a risk they chose to take. I think the offer to split 3 ways is a very reasonable one, and probably quite fair given the circumstances. However, should the current owner choose to file a police report, then perhaps the person responsible for reporting it stolen can be traced and made to pay. Though I doubt it'll ever get that far.
Soldato
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- 23 Dec 2009
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You do not know why it has been blacklisted, it could be lost or stolen, or obtained fraudulently.
Sometime it can take some time for these issues to come to light, especially fraudulently obtained equipment, hence why it may have taken so long for the phone to be blacklisted.
You have likely handled stolen goods regardless.
Sometime it can take some time for these issues to come to light, especially fraudulently obtained equipment, hence why it may have taken so long for the phone to be blacklisted.
You have likely handled stolen goods regardless.
They're not linked I assure you but there are parallels. From my point of view, as I mentioned earlier I have proof and admission of both buying and selling. I've not reported anything lost or stolen so have nothing to gain.
In the last 10 minutes the buyer has sent a message threatening reporting to a moderator as the "rules are clear". Of course there are no such rules and I've already contacted the mods myself. I've pointed him to the dispute thread, it depends on his attitude from now on how much money I give him if anything at all.
It was a reply to his wanted thread. I offered it, answered his questions honestly and the transaction went without a hitch. I didn't say I was not the original owner because I wasn't asked. A mistake both he and I made on purchasing, probably because of the good feedback of the respective sellers.
I disagree. Given that it was both bought and sold with the correct box and all original accessories I'd say it has more than likely been bought and sold legally.
The crime here is fraud on the part of (probably) the original owner reporting it lost or stolen although it could have been stolen all nicely boxed up, then reported stolen and it's taken well over a year to get it blocked.
I think the latter is unlikely though.
Just because it's got the box and accessories doesn't mean it's not stolen. It's fairly common for new mobile phones to be ordered fraudulently and then intercepted en route.
Associate
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Surly if the original owner had reported it stolen wouldn't the mobile operator wonder why the phone was connected to a cell tower in another part of the country?
Soldato
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I disagree and I am probably best suited to answer you here as I work in fraud for a Mobile telco.
The original owner would gain nothing for reporting it lost. If it has taken a year to blacklist it is likely that it has been obtained by theft or deception and took a while to come to light.
That was my thought too. Ordered and intercepted en route, hence the lengthy delay in coming to light.
Also work for a telco, but in security not fraud
Fair points gentlemen. Although I still think the most likely scenario is the original owner now reporting it lost or stolen.
Of course he does, he got cash when he sold it and now perhaps he'll get a replacement handset from his insurer. Obvious gain and motive.
Anyway. Mods have ruled in my favour. Not heard back from the original seller about chipping in with compensation. Admittedly as you point out, the original seller could just be lying. He claims to have no paper trail at all which is a red flag for me. He could be the thief or fraudster. We'll never know.
All this drama over an ageing BlackBerry worth about £60....LOL
Of course he does, he got cash when he sold it and now perhaps he'll get a replacement handset from his insurer. Obvious gain and motive.
Anyway. Mods have ruled in my favour. Not heard back from the original seller about chipping in with compensation. Admittedly as you point out, the original seller could just be lying. He claims to have no paper trail at all which is a red flag for me. He could be the thief or fraudster. We'll never know.
All this drama over an ageing BlackBerry worth about £60....LOL
You're making the assumption that the original owner knows as much about how these things work as you do however. While I agree that there are plenty of fraudsters out there who understand that the network will check to see what IMEI recent calls have been made from, there are plenty of chances that haven't a clue.
Associate
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So when the owner reports it stolen and gets asked when did you last use it and where, what do you think his response will be?
I agree with Rids above:The point is, he may well have not thought about that. He could lie and say last week and then perhaps get found out.
Who knows?
What I didn't realise, that could make my assumptions erroneous is that it could take over a year for blacklisted phone to be blocked. Amazed that the process is so slow in this day and age. That's something to bear in mind. Thanks PapaLazaru.
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Just to add... the process for blacklisting an IMEI isn't slow. It can be (and often is) done very quickly when needed. It's usually the steps involved in confirming that fraud has taken place that slows the process down.
Wish there was a "like" button. Thanks.
Fraud can be especially difficult to pick up, especially if it is internal fraud involving an employee of the company.
During my stint with Vodafone we had a store employee running through upgrades on peoples accounts without their knowledge. The "sale" would go through, he would pocket the handset (fully boxed, etc) and nobody would be any the wiser until the customer attempted an upgrade months later.
That couldn't happen now as there are letters sent out with every upgrade, and there are automated customer service phonecalls that go along with every sale, but there will be other ways to cheat the system I'm sure.
During my stint with Vodafone we had a store employee running through upgrades on peoples accounts without their knowledge. The "sale" would go through, he would pocket the handset (fully boxed, etc) and nobody would be any the wiser until the customer attempted an upgrade months later.
That couldn't happen now as there are letters sent out with every upgrade, and there are automated customer service phonecalls that go along with every sale, but there will be other ways to cheat the system I'm sure.
Sneaky. Opportunities for crime are everywhere for the unscrupulous.
For me as a serial gadget buyer and seller the tricky things are mobile phones. If its a tablet or laptop, in a material sense...if you have it in your possession you are pretty much ok.
With a phone, the original owner will always have a connection to it. Its a gamble I take and why I steer clear of eBay. If I'd known the phone was bought like it was I wouldn't have bothered.
That makes zero sense