"Most only have £500 of savings ",says Lloyds boss ,really ?

Status
Not open for further replies.
it’s sad that those earning minimum wage can’t enjoy a few luxuries and put some money away, even a small amount. Let alone those earning the median (£30k).
Instead of mocking those who don’t earn much, one member was mocking someone for living in a mid terrace!!, we need to look at our systems that have allowed such a thing to happen.

You should definitely be able to afford a few luxuries if you are in work.
 
After reading this thread, I'm going to try a little experiment.

I'm going to cash only spend (no contactless/ card) payments for all my shop/ going out spend for the next month or two.

I think that might be an eye opener.

Edit: just realised that recently, my wallet has often had no more than £10 cash in it.

What would be the difference? You need to go to the hole in the wall to get the cash out to spend. Except.... transactions would be less since in theory when you take out it would show only 1x transaction instead of many.
(unless you keep getting cash out ofc).
 
What would be the difference? You need to go to the hole in the wall to get the cash out to spend. Except.... transactions would be less since in theory when you take out it would show only 1x transaction instead of many.
(unless you keep getting cash out ofc).

I just think that seeing money physically might mean I manage that discretionary spend better.

If I have to go to the cashpoint a lot, I get free exercise, too!
 
it’s sad that those earning minimum wage can’t enjoy a few luxuries and put some money away, even a small amount. Let alone those earning the median (£30k).
Instead of mocking those who don’t earn much, one member was mocking someone for living in a mid terrace!!, we need to look at our systems that have allowed such a thing to happen.

You should definitely be able to afford a few luxuries if you are in work.
This is a fairly modern thing though. For most of history people just worked to put food on the table and a roof over their head (if they were lucky)
'Things' let alone luxuries were for the rich people.
It just seems like we're going back to those days with a rather vicious bump.
 
I just think that seeing money physically might mean I manage that discretionary spend better.

If I have to go to the cashpoint a lot, I get free exercise, too!
You'll end up spending more if you ignore contactless and go cash only. Say you draw a tenner out for a few bits and bobs at Sainsburys, you'll come away with a pocket full shrapnel which you'll spend without thinking because it's annoying - that money would still be in the bank if you used contactless, When I started to use contactless over cash I found I had quite a surprising amount of extra money at the end of a month.
 
it’s sad that those earning minimum wage can’t enjoy a few luxuries and put some money away, even a small amount. Let alone those earning the median (£30k).
Instead of mocking those who don’t earn much, one member was mocking someone for living in a mid terrace!!, we need to look at our systems that have allowed such a thing to happen.

You should definitely be able to afford a few luxuries if you are in work.

Most can...if they are sensible. Thats the crux of the issue. The question is "what is an acceptable amount of your income to spend on luxury items".

In my world the following things are a luxury:

A flagship smartphone bought near release
A car that was bought when less than 4 years old
Eating out/takeaway more than a few times a month
Going out and spending a lot of money on booze
Buying expensive clothes
Spending more than £50 on tv/broadband a month
Not planning your washing around the weather as much as possible
Driving everywhere when you could walk plenty of places

This is just what I would consider luxuries in my life if I did them and I earn good money. The only one I have done recently is getting a 2018 car but the missus paid for a lot of that because its for her and she wanted that car. We earn over £100k/year between us and I still think the above is wasting money. We need to get away from the idea that material possessions define us and make us happy because they don't. A lot of people could save a lot of money with no reduction in their quality of life if they were willing to put in a little more effort. Some people can't cut back in many areas but when I see people saying they can't cook and eat takeaway regularly it does my head in. When I see people complaining about money and they are holding a new £1000 iPhone I have little sympathy.
 
You'll end up spending more if you ignore contactless and go cash only. Say you draw a tenner out for a few bits and bobs at Sainsburys, you'll come away with a pocket full shrapnel which you'll spend without thinking because it's annoying - that money would still be in the bank if you used contactless, When I started to use contactless over cash I found I had quite a surprising amount of extra money at the end of a month.

I'll see.

I can't see me blowing my change on rubbish, just to empty my pockets, that would be silly.
 
one member was mocking someone for living in a mid terrace!!

If that was a reference to my post it wasn't mocking - a commentary on commensuration between income and what you can afford in different categories of lifestyle vs how it used to be.
 
This is why I couldn't get on with any of the apps. Ended up building an epic excel over the last 7 years that does everything I can ever want.

Me too. It got bigger the larger my screen got, evolved in to a monster. If I have to make a crucial large purchase in say, February I can see what impact it has the rest of the year to December. Mortgage overpayments are tracked to a plan to see the impact of them. Credit cards are managed to their statement date to utilise the maximum interest free period before clearing them. Others can do it as well, just a little knowledge to start off basic and get in to the habit of it, but many won't.

After reading this thread, I'm going to try a little experiment.

I'm going to cash only spend (no contactless/ card) payments for all my shop/ going out spend for the next month or two.

I think that might be an eye opener.

Edit: just realised that recently, my wallet has often had no more than £10 cash in it.

The kids will love you when they raid your pockets for shrapnel :D. I used to use cash all the time but changed to contactless when my previous work's canteen introduced it. My statement was a horror show of so many transactions; early coffee, lunch and sometimes something later. My spending habit hadn't changed between cash and contactless but it was laid out bare in front of me how much I actually spent at work. Probably spent more using cash because of the shrapnel rounding effect. It was a real eye opener and I soon changed my ways.
 
I feel a lot on this forum don't really know what it's like being on low wages

All this "they shouldnt have bought that pcp car" etc is hardly the majority. Its quite patronising too.

I would bet many would struggle at or near minimum wage.

Throw in a responsibility like kids or a elderly parent and even a middling wage can be a struggle.


Lack of empathy seems to be growing. I guess that's an effect of everyone having a bit of pressure or something?
 
Those who are up to their eyeballs in debt with PCP cars, high mortgages in big houses are not poor. They have the means to get the credit to sustain that lifestyle. As long as they can sustain it without going bankrupt (even then it's questionable whether they will be poor afterwards..if they know how to work the system), they will be fine.

They are using their resources, making a conscious choice to live that lifestyle, if they had to, providing their earnings don't drop, assuming that stays the same. They could CHOOSE to get a £500 banger and live in a 1 bed flat in a rough area of town. Then within a few months they would easily have £500 of savings.

Some people are so poor that they couldn't get credit to get a phone, those who go to food bank or shop at closing time for anything with the yellow discount sticker at supermarkets.
 
Last edited:
Most can...if they are sensible. Thats the crux of the issue. The question is "what is an acceptable amount of your income to spend on luxury items".

In my world the following things are a luxury:

A flagship smartphone bought near release
A car that was bought when less than 4 years old
Eating out/takeaway more than a few times a month
Going out and spending a lot of money on booze
Buying expensive clothes
Spending more than £50 on tv/broadband a month
Not planning your washing around the weather as much as possible
Driving everywhere when you could walk plenty of places

This is just what I would consider luxuries in my life if I did them and I earn good money. The only one I have done recently is getting a 2018 car but the missus paid for a lot of that because its for her and she wanted that car. We earn over £100k/year between us and I still think the above is wasting money. We need to get away from the idea that material possessions define us and make us happy because they don't. A lot of people could save a lot of money with no reduction in their quality of life if they were willing to put in a little more effort. Some people can't cut back in many areas but when I see people saying they can't cook and eat takeaway regularly it does my head in. When I see people complaining about money and they are holding a new £1000 iPhone I have little sympathy.

Surely the crux of the issue is nothing to do with "luxury items" at all.

The question should be.. "what is an acceptable amount of your income that you have to spend on essentials like a roof over your head, electricity, water, fuel and so on."

We are not in a cost of living crisis because people are spending too much on luxury items.
 
Surely the crux of the issue is nothing to do with "luxury items" at all.

The question should be.. "what is an acceptable amount of your income that you have to spend on essentials like a roof over your head, electricity, water, fuel and so on."

We are not in a cost of living crisis because people are spending too much on luxury items.

Money is money. In theory the cost of living should drop again somewhat once the world gets back to normal. This should be transient up to a point. If people have been living on the edge of their means due to spending any spare cash they had on luxuries for years and have no reserves then it very much is to do with luxury items.

People who have mortgaged themselves up to their eyeballs due to long term low interest rates and low cost of living have to look at themselves for some of the blame.

I'm not arguing that some parts of society would likely have been screwed unless they had been spending the absolute bare minimum for years and saving every penny they could. The issue will be that plenty of people will really struggle who should not. They will struggle because they have always pushed their finances to the limit every month. They will struggle because instead of saving money at the end of every month they have just seen that as money to spend on luxury items with no thought for the future or "what if".
 
Good to see some gaslighting is alive and well in here.

The cost of living crisis is not the fault of the low paid. Some in here seem to think it's acceptable for people to exist rather than live - work your 40 hours a week, come home to your beans on toast and stare at 4 walls the rest of the time and, if the person doesn't like it, then it's their own fault.

They have to use Elec/gas, they have to use fuel to get to work, they have to eat food to live.

For clarity - I am referring to the people who have cut back as much as possible.
 
Money is money. In theory the cost of living should drop again somewhat once the world gets back to normal. This should be transient up to a point. If people have been living on the edge of their means due to spending any spare cash they had on luxuries for years and have no reserves then it very much is to do with luxury items.

People who have mortgaged themselves up to their eyeballs due to long term low interest rates and low cost of living have to look at themselves for some of the blame.

I'm not arguing that some parts of society would likely have been screwed unless they had been spending the absolute bare minimum for years and saving every penny they could. The issue will be that plenty of people will really struggle who should not. They will struggle because they have always pushed their finances to the limit every month. They will struggle because instead of saving money at the end of every month they have just seen that as money to spend on luxury items with no thought for the future or "what if".

"In theory" is a nice idea, but reality is often much different... In this greed driven capitalistic world, the prices are highly unlikely to drop much at all. As has been witnessed time and time again, for most people who are on minimum wage / stuck in the rent trap (or both) any "spare cash" they may gain from an increase to the NMW gets immediately "eaten up" by an increase in rent, an increase in fuel costs, an increase in food costs, absurd increases in electricity costs.

People who have mortgaged themselves up to their eyeballs due to long term low interest rates and low cost of living have to look at themselves for some of the blame.

The flip-side of this argument is again the deliberate manipulation of the "free market" to limit housing stock to keep driving prices higher and higher, forcing people to "mortgage themselves up to their eyeballs" just to have any chance to step on the property ladder. Just imagine if the social housing stock that was sold-off under Thatcher's "Right-To-Buy" scheme had actually been replaced? The government(s) (Both Tory and Labour) are seeming unwilling to actually regulate the housing / rental market, but they're sure willing to manipulate it.

I'm not arguing that some parts of society would likely have been screwed unless they had been spending the absolute bare minimum for years and saving every penny they could. The issue will be that plenty of people will really struggle who should not. They will struggle because they have always pushed their finances to the limit every month. They will struggle because instead of saving money at the end of every month they have just seen that as money to spend on luxury items with no thought for the future or "what if".

The issue fundamentally is just how large the section of society has become who are struggling.. Food banks at an all time high etc.. For many people they will always strive to have what they don't have, it's human nature. While I agree there are some people out there that are terrible with finances regardless, but they are a small minority. For most the desire for a new car or a new phone (or dare I say it... a house they can own :O ) is a perfectly normal, natural and understandable one and to be entirely expected. What is not acceptable however, is for people to have the vast majority of their monthly income eaten up by price hikes, suffer exploitative rental practices and borderline illegal price-fixing of the housing market while companies are continually making billions in profit every year.
The solution to this is not to point your finger and blame those who have a new Iphone (probably on a 2 year contract overall so what's that. £10 a month?) but to start to raise serious questions as to why such a large percentage of the wage of those least-well off is allowed to be "consumed" in this manner by greedy landlords and businesses.

Good to see some gaslighting is alive and well in here.

The cost of living crisis is not the fault of the low paid. Some in here seem to think it's acceptable for people to exist rather than live - work your 40 hours a week, come home to your beans on toast and stare at 4 walls the rest of the time and, if the person doesn't like it, then it's their own fault.

They have to use Elec/gas, they have to use fuel to get to work, they have to eat food to live.

For clarity - I am referring to the people who have cut back as much as possible.

I agree, this constant attempt to "blame" those less-well off for being in the situation they are as the fault of "poor finance management" is as out-of-touch as a Tory MP saying "people just need to work a 2nd job" or "they need to learn how to cook".

People (should) have a right to do more than just "exist". It's perfectly acceptable for someone to want a new Iphone, or a new car.. this is normal but some people really seem to want to deny others the chance to aspire for better things and not just "exist".
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom