Discussion in 'Biker's Cafe' started by FeFiDoh, Apr 3, 2011.
middle of the race was boring. Other than that is was ok. BBC coverage shocking as ever.
Why do you say that? I watched all 3 races without interruption... And the little end of season edit was nice.
Interesting final race. Nice tribute to Marco.
Gutted for Spies. I don't know why, but every time Casey wins, I just think he's that little bit more of a ****.
Good tribute to Marco and a fantastic ride by Casey, deserved winner.
I would not say fantastic lol he lost a massive lead in about 3 laps the power of the Honda on the straights is the only thing that won him that race, and I'm not a Stoner hater just boring when the same person wins over and over on a bike bought to win the championship, Spies deserved to win that, to keep with the Honda's all race, catch Stoner and overtake!
Racing should be about being pushed to the limit and in most of the top level racing currently that's not happening, Vettel buggers off comfortably and Stoner does the same...ZZZZzzzzzzzz, sure they are awesome racers but its boring as hell to watch, I would rather watch Cal and Abraham battle it out down the field than watch the front runners any day
I agree. He's a great rider but I just don't like him
He just doesn't have the same lovability as someone like Rossi
It was a very fitting tribute to Marco for sure, still cant quite get over the fact he is gone and there will be no more super sic!!.
For me Casey moaner is one hell of a **** and he steeped even lower when he dared to accuse Rossi of running out of talent, The gaul of the bloke is something else, He knows on equal machinery and both fit, then Rossi would hand him another beating! Cant take nothing away from him this year though as he deserved the title, Though we need to see more competition from the likes of Yamaha and Ducati, I felt on too many times, Lorenzo had to ride the Yamaha too hard to offer a challenge to the Hondas.
You mean as long as the same bike isn't a Ducati?
Been a Rossi fan since he was in 125's, but you can't argue with the fact that rossi is running round on a bike casey was able to win races on, and he's finishing no better than 6th.
Obviously you put rossi on the honda and he'll be more competitive, but i don't think rossi would beat casey over a full season.
I think Rossi as already won his last championship title, he'll win racers again if this new Ducati with jap style aluminum frame works. But the likes of Casey and Lorenzo are now just a level above.
Rossi is still the best RACER out there IMO. Put everyone on equal bikes and he'd win. Stoner is certainly the fastest and has the best package (oo-er) but I don't believe he has the racer ability that Rossi does.
Yes quite, The 800 Duke, suited Stoner more than any other rider before or after him, You need to be aggressive with the bike to command any sort of pace from it, hence why Casey had so many front end drops on it and tbh I dont think any Moto gp fan would argue that the bike just dont suit Rossi, Though there is a lot more to why it does`nt here http://www.motomatters.com/analysis/2011/08/08/the_trouble_with_the_ducati_desmosedici_.html
I think it is acknowledged that the carbon frame is too stiff for motorcycle racing.
I simply dont think for one moment that Lorenzo and Stoner are another level up than Rossi, He has a torrid time by his own standards this year and last year and thinking back prior to his leg break accident, he was still in the title hunt and sporting a shoulder injury, that affected him far worse than his leg break did, as was widely reported, take those injuries out of the equation then a fit Rossi would of been bang in there for the title hunt in 2010 and probably would of won it Imo.
Whether or not Rossi`s 2012 campaign is a success with a new frame, only time will tell on that one, Is he fininshed as a competitive force in Moto gp, Then I think not, But the Duke has to raise it`s game and change it`s focus on design...Tradition is hard to dump by the wayside, but if success depends on it, then it is a no brainer.
Agree with this, Though would like to add that Stoner has improved his race craft somewhat and though he has had the best package, he has not been tested enough this year to really confirm if he is the best out there at this moment in time, We have all seen how well or not he copes with pressure and if you chuck the likes of Lorenzo, pedrosa and Rossi (assuming bike is a race winner) into a injury free season then the end result may be a different story.
To be fair to Stoner, he made the Honda work better than Dani and the bike has been the class of the field, Yamaha could be on the verge of the post-Rossi era and we shall see just how good Lorenzo is on developing a bike, I have my doubts that he can develop it further and think he might want to jump ship if the 1000 is not up to it.
Your point still stands though, Rossi has the best racecraft of anybody and on equal machinery across the field, Then Rossi would surely be favourite.
Not trying to put Rossi down, i just think his best has come and gone. 2 bad seasons on the bounce, yeah fair enough he was injured in 2010, But why was he injured? he was pushing to keep up with Lorenzo on the same bike. 2009 it was Lorenzo crashing to keep up with Rossi, it was Lorenzo who got injured that season, who's to say Lorenzo wouldn't have won that year too if not for the injury and crashes. At the end of the day you've got to stop on the bike (Rossi has always been good at that). Stoner has obviously got the best bike this year and i think Lorenzo did well to push for the title. But as has been mentioned he's not really been challenged this year very often, i suspect he was riding well within himself alot of the time.
Also he's not been the fastest Ducati, he has raced better than the others, but championship positions does not lie.
Hopefully the Duc will be more suited next year, because it would be good to see him challenging again.
I'm a big Rossi fan, but I think Stoner and Lorenzo (in that order) would both be faster on the same bikes now. Time catches up with everyone
Actually Rossi was already injured with his shoulder, that he injured when the jap gp was post-poned, his results upto the crash at Mugello were 1st,3rd & 2nd, Both he and Lorenzo had injuries in the early part of 2010, though Lorenzo had healed by the time of the spanish grand prix rnd 2 and Rossi had been struggling with his since before the postponed Jap gp.
Being a great late braker has as much to do with the bike as it does the rider, having no faith in the front end of the bike as notorious as the duke, would assume that even Rossi would struggle to stop the thing in the corner, The Yamaha presented none of these problems and was regarded as the best bike for handling.
Would only suggest that Rossi lost heart in the Duke as to why his results were bettered by Hayden, I think the table shows more of Rossi`s bike woes as opposed to him being on the downhill spiral, Yes Rossi has faced the toughest challenges of his reign in recent times, though one would have to be brave to suggest he is fininshed in terms of being at the top....I remember people saying similar things when he got beat by Hayden...Time will tell.
Oh i'm not trying to say he's finished, just that i can't see him winning another championship while the likes of Stoner and Lorenzo are riding for Honda and Yamaha. Obviously with the new rules and ducati's change in direction with the frame. They may come out early 2012 with a great bike. They have some of the best development riders in rossi and hayden and with the technical staff they should be able to turn it around with technology they know. Rossi was about 1.5 seconds back yesterday in testing, not bad for the first time they've riden the new frame, and no prior data from the 800 bike to help, compared to honda who have test a few times already and will be transferring tech from the 800cc bike.
you may be right about the rossi lorenzo crashes, was just going from memory.
Been a huge rossi fan since he started in 125s. I really dont think we have seen his last title. He just needs to jump ship from Ducati, its pretty clear he just doesnt get on with the bike and im not sure what he can do other then buying a Honda or Yam and sticking on a Ducati sticker on the thing.
Cant stand Stoner as a person but there is no denying the guys skills. He can ride anything and ride it like he stole thge thing. The various slo mo's they have showed of his this season have just been amazing to watch. He is by far the most exciting rider on the track (apart from Sic RIP). Pair him to such an amwesome all round bike as this years Honda and this seasons winner was a formality from the start.
Rossi's race craft is second to none, not to mention his pure skill and throttle control. He has called for electronics to be paired right back to put the control and skill back in the riders hands like it was on the 500s. Problem is, if he continues on a non competitive bike he will lose his will to win, when he loses that he might as well hang up his leathers.
I really hope Rossi and Jerry are able to sort the Duke but if they dont then he needs to jump ship so he can win another title or 2. His legacy deserves to finish on a high.
Can't forget that Rossi really hasn't been in the title hunt this season as they basically wrote this season off to develop the 1000 didn't they?
They took an engine penalty didn't they? They have had bits and bobs of new frames and god knows what else all basically for testing purposes. So although Stoner was more successful on the Ducati he was only developing an 800 bike without the need to develop a new model/frame basically.
As for Stoner don't like him so much as a person just something about him his kinda smugness at times and his moaning about "being tired because of the travel" they all have it.
Lorenzo pushed him when he could on a bike clearly not as fast and Honda threw everything at this championship to win it.
Pedrosa if he stays fit for a season stands a good chance of splitting it up as well he is capable of some very quick times he's just as fragile as bone china.
Don't forget when Stoner won in 2007 on the Ducati, he was on the Bridgestones and Rossi was on the fledging Michelins. Stoner had a distinctive advantage. The following yr, he went onto the Bridgestones and Lorenzo stuck with the Michelins. It wasn't just the bike.
Rossi has proven himself, traditionally he's always used one yr to adjust and the next yr to take it to them. Hopefully next yr is that yr. Ducati has Burgess on board and better listen to what he and Rossi has to say. They don't want the whole of Italy turning up at the Bologna factory welding pitch forks !
To quote Spalders , Honda has gone through over 40 variations of it chassis and has had to wait until now for a 800cc Championship. Looking at HRC's budget versus Ducati's I think the guys from Bologna havent done too bad.
Kind of puts it in perspective ??
The £500k Gearbox for the Honda's on its own seems crazy to me!
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