Multiculturalism in England

A balance between multiculturalism and assimilation needs to be struck. Social unrest in both Britain (multiculturalism) and France (assimilation) indicate that a hard stance in either direction isn't the answer.

These threads just end up in a fight for the moral high ground and people getting branded as racists.
 
It is disgusting that you insult our current troops like that, you should be more appreciative of our boys. I for one think that they to would send Hitler running, despite some people in this thread possibly wanting his form of rule over this country.

Its actually directed at politicians lack of balls, not the military, they simply carry out their orders to the best of their ability , and for that I salute them.
 
I am just saying there is a tendency for the Native population to roll over a bit too much in the name of political correctness. This is coming from someone whose parents aren't even native to the UK although I was born here. So save me your usual racist rhetoric crap.

I didn't label you a racist in my comment, the only thing referring to you was that question.
 
Its actually directed at politicians lack of balls, not the military, they simply carry out their orders to the best of their ability , and for that I salute them.

Oh, so you mean Politicians like Neville Chamberlain....

Because last I heard we helped out in Syria and Lybia, where Libyans worship David Cameron now, and also invaded Iraq and Afghanistan, which took a fair bit of balls.
 
What does the term English mean anymore?

Nothing, if you are proud to be it, you are racist - its that simple.

To be white and born in England is the worst thing in the world, im not sure how people cope with it.
 
Oh, so you mean Politicians like Neville Chamberlain....

Because last I heard we helped out in Syria and Lybia, where Libyans worship David Cameron now, and also invaded Iraq and Afghanistan, which took a fair bit of balls.

That's easy and takes no real balls as its under cover of a UN mandate. If they are so testicularly gifted why don't they show the same amount of zeal back home with regards to valid concerns regarding immigration issues and 'ghetofication' in certain cities making certain neighbourhoods virtually no go areas unless you are from the incumbent ethnicity ?

Going to war for monetary and resource gain is not the same as protecting your citizens rights in their country of birth
 
A balance between multiculturalism and assimilation needs to be struck. Social unrest in both Britain (multiculturalism) and France (assimilation) indicate that a hard stance in either direction isn't the answer.

These threads just end up in a fight for the moral high ground and people getting branded as racists.

Sensible except for multiculturalism is not a policy (which most people generally assume) it is a description of society its self. No state in the world is completely homogenous but many can be horribly xenophobic and force people to be "the same".

Multiculturalism is more of a description that people don't conform naturally to large identities that over arch the world, so it's not the states role to go about and angrily stamp its feet that everyone should be "the same" for the sake of society.
 
I am just saying there is a tendency for the Native population to roll over a bit too much in the name of political correctness. This is coming from someone whose parents aren't even native to the UK although I was born here. So save me your usual racist rhetoric crap.

This is very true in a lot of ways - i.e. for a given value of 'true'. On the whole, I support this statement.

thats the sad truth. If England in the late 1930's and 40's was as is England is today we'd all be speaking German and eating bockwurst for breakfast !!!

This is ********. Excessive PC-induced legislation has little or nothing to do with international warfare.
 
Sensible except for multiculturalism is not a policy (which most people generally assume) it is a description of society its self. No state in the world is completely homogenous but many can be horribly xenophobic and force people to be "the same".

Multiculturalism is more of a description that people don't conform naturally to large identities that over arch the world, so it's not the states role to go about and angrily stamp its feet that everyone should be "the same" for the sake of society.

Fair point, I realise it isn't a policy per se, but does a lack of an assimilation policy not come very close to a multicultural policy by default? I think some countries do, but admittedly not Britain as far as I'm aware, adopt actual multiculturalism policies. Canada would be the primary example with the longstanding Canadian/French Canadian society that is protected by law. I agree that an extreme assimilation policy would be a horribly xenophobic, but at it's heart I think it has some good points. People must, not to any significant detriment of their own cultural identity, be expected to respect the traditions, culture and history of their adopted country - however that may be defined. The lack of cohesion between different cultures leads to different rules and traditions being adopted by subsections of society and, as these threads continually show, under tense social conditions any challenge to these rules and traditions leads to the racism card being played. Without any sort of assimilation, society becomes segregated, cultural tension increases and will inevitably reach a tipping point of violence, hate crimes, and racism; in both directions.
 
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It's an interesting point though. A lot of cultures are still steeped in ritual and tradition whereas the 'English' culture seems to have very little. (Historically England is a mixed pot of various cultures anyway) As such, these stronger cultures in which people can identify with are going to overpower the weaker cultures, such as English.

Can you describe what it means to be English, that is significantly different and unique from other cultures?

Its the lack of being steeped in ritual and traditions that makes the English culture what it is. Its a case of less being more.
 
Fair point, I realise it isn't a policy per se, but does a lack of an assimilation policy not come very close to a multicultural policy by default? I think some countries do, but admittedly not Britain as far as I'm aware, adopt actual multiculturalism policies. Canada would be the primary example with the longstanding Canadian/French Canadian society that is protected by law. I agree that an extreme assimilation policy would be a horribly xenophobic, but at it's heart I think it has some good points. People must, not to any significant detriment of their own cultural identity, be expected to respect the traditions, culture and history of their adopted country - however that may be defined. The lack of cohesion between different cultures leads to different rules and traditions being adopted by subsections of society and, as these threads continually show, under tense social conditions any challenge to these rules and traditions leads to the racism card being played. Without any sort of assimilation, society becomes segregated, cultural tension increases and will inevitably reach a tipping point of violence, hate crimes, and racism; in both directions.

Well multiculturalism isn't the lack of an assimilation policy as such, it is the description of a state that accepts that the state is made up of multiple cultures so it is not the states responsibility to dictate this. An assimilation policy is firmly against multiculturalism, because in this view its the roles and rights of the state, but multiculturalism is not anti assimilation as such.

The USA is the best example of this, at a cultural level, it is a multicultural state, but at a citizenship level is has one overriding civic identity (being an American). Being strongly assimilationist (culturally) blurs the lines between these two identities to a point where the state becomes just of one cultural/ethnic group, which most democracies aren't (or shouldn't be).

Playing the race card (and crying about racism to white people or what not) is where the difference between civic and cultural identities have become intertwined for the determent of society as a whole, so where over the last 10 years the UK as been declared "more segregated" it is not because of rising cultural differences, but of civic identity attempting to become culturally lead (which in my view is the height of not being British at all).

Sorry that's slightly incoherent but its for my masters dissertation that's only just getting started.
 
I won't quote that all, but safe to say you're far more informed than I am on the subject! What's the title of your thesis? It seems like it would be an interesting read once it's done, especially an expansion on this:

Over the last 10 years the UK has been declared "more segregated" it is not because of rising cultural differences, but of civic identity attempting to become culturally lead.
 
A lot of ignorant people on this forum.
If you look at research on halal vs non-halal, it shows that halal is actually less painful on the animal as it dies instantly as apposed to being stunned which causes the animal pain, the halal way is an instant procedure.
Some people are saying that they want to be warned that they are eating halal food, how is it any different to non halal meat? Halal means permissible, it just needs to be slaughtered differently and with a prayer said before the slaughter, so how could it taste any different?
There are some halal subways or places that get rid of pork, but why are people complaining? the owners obviously want to get the most money out of their shop, its a franchise so they can do what they want, open your own non halal one if its such a big deal!

Did you know (and I'm sure you do, just don't like to admit) most halal meat is stunned before killing anyway, just like non Halal meat. Did you know a bolt through the head is regularly unsuccessful and can cause an animal massive distress (if the stunning hasn't caused that already...

If so, then it is not considered halal!

One of the local ASDAs have even opened Halal World, so naturally there is a market for it. My only grievance with that is it has replaced a non-halal butchery, but obviously, given the area, it made economic sense. Although I do find it a little discriminatory that only muslim butchers can work the counter there (if true!).

It is not true, it doesn't matter who works there, as long as it is Halal, that is only true for Judaism, that once a non jewish person touches their food it is not kosher anymore, or in the process of making it I think.

I remember reading somewhere that a Muslim community in London were trying to ban anyone flying the English flag on a street where the Muslim community thrive.
well it has nothing to do with Islam, so those people who want the ban are idiots and you should judge them as the person not the religion!

Really?
You may want to try living near one of the Pakistani/Bangladeshi self enforced ghettos near where I live!
Certainly no go areas after sundown, my Pakistani mate wont let me walk to town from his house on my own. Most times we've walked through this area he's had to tell groups of Pakistani lads to back off 'cos I'm his mate.
We're talking an area that's almost exclusively Pakistani. Maybe 4% nationally but before you scoff at "Islamic zones" you might want to try living in the real world!

Such a stupid thing to say, these "Pakistani/Bangledeshi" are obviously thugs, they do not represent muslims at all, do you really not understand that? if it was a 'islamic zone' then anyone can do what they want in that area as it is not an Islamic country so muslims are meant to respect it! you shouldn't judge a religion based on some thugs!
 
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