Need Advice on Radiators

Jacknm2

Jacknm2

Jacknm2

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7 Jul 2019
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137
Hey guys,

Looking to upgrade my loop and system in time for Zen 3 with RTX 3080 / 3090 (undecided) and dual loop - I'm going full enthusiast as much as I can this time round, so saving money isnt a priority but I dont want to overspend where I dont have to.

I had my heart set on buying 2x XSPC RX480mm Rads 56mm thick and sticking 4 120MM Noctua NF F12 fans on each, I have already bought the gargantuan Thermatake Super Tower 900 for this project, still not my favourite design but the only case that came close to fitting a dual loop that wasnt too tight or stupidly priced. Back to the rads....

Those rads have since gone discontinued, smaller RX variants are still available so I'm guesing that Rad wasnt selling or they have a replacement lined up, however that still leaves me with a choice to make. I currently have EK Slim line rads in my current loop that are not going to be re-used. Do I go with as thick as I can get EK rads or is there a better option(s) I've been looking at fin density and thickness as recommended to do so and I'm not entirely sure. I'm going to continue looking at whats available but I thought I'd post here to get some insight from any others who have been doing this longer than me or have better access.

Appreciate any input guys cheers :)
 
Undesirable said:
If you're getting thick rads, it's best to use push / pull configuration to get the most out of it, otherwise you need to work the 4 fans you already have harder to be able to push the air through them and even then they won't reach max efficiency if things get toasty. That's why I stick to thin rads, because it's less weight of the rad, fluid and fans as well as a much lower profile. Then again I must admit my water temps reach 35 - 38 degrees (maybe lower in winter) when gaming with 780mm total rad space on a Threadripper 1950x @1.25v and GeForce 1080 @ stock as I run the fans at 900 RPM max in a glass case. If my Threadripper were really being pushed to the limit, it would probably break 40 degrees.
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I want to do a push pull system but the fans Ive selected are costly as is, £22.99 each but they are industrial fans that can do 3000rpm and high CFM Noctua NF-F12s and I need 8, I was thinking that since each rad is a single loop that at least for the time being a single push config will suffice with thise fans for at least a couple months until I can replenish the hobby fund. Placing the fans on the front of each rad would mean I wouldnt have to redo any tubing and I can buy a second fan hub for the extra 8 fans to connect to the controller.

Unless those fans wont do?

Edit: I should add I'm going to have ton's of space for these rads in the back of the case along with the fans even if I do a push/pull config. I think the main issue is deciding on if thefans on the opposite rad should pull or push, if they both pull in I'll have a hot spot in the middle where I only have 2x140mm fans on the rear and 1x140mm at the top, plus the hot air from the bottom of each rad hitting the PSU in the middle at the back of the case, so i need to make some choices on airflow here lol.
 
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https://www.overclockers.co.uk/thermaltake-the-tower-900-super-tower-showcase-ca-18f-tt.html

This is the case I am building in which is not your typical design. It will allow me to have the 2x 480mm rads in the back which will have fans on the front of them, but having the fans set to pull will draw air at eachother into the middle where the PSU is. To counter that above the PSU will be 2 rear mounted 140mm fans pulling the air out and 1 x140mm at the top also pulling out, but there is nothing to help drive the air up from the bottom otber tham convection, I will mount the rads as High up as I can to help with this but since I should have the radiator ports at the top so the pumps dont have to work as hard then I will be limited here.

There will be another 140mm at the bottom of the front compartment and 1 at the top but I know this wont provide too much airflow in a case this size which is why the motherboard will have a monoblock and chipset block included in the CPU loop. So that most of the air draw in into that section will be for the M.2s and Ram, thats the theory any way.

Thught id put all this in as your last reply sounded geared towards a conventional case. My current case is more conventional, corsair crystal 680x with a 360mm on the front and a 240mm on the top in a pull config, the rads are all slimline because I couldnt fit anything else, I wanted a 280 on top but again case limitations forced me into this config. It has 8 fans in total 6 corsair ML120s and 2 ML 140s, 3 front, 2 top 2 bottom and 1 rear, had to do a 140mm and 120mm on the bottom otherwise I would not have had access to the rad ports, couldnt put rad ports at the top as it would have been blocked by the fans on the 240mm at the top. Also the res/pump for this is in the rear secondary compartment not being shown.

Edit: Got rid of some typos, typing on my phone and added info about my current build.
 
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oldbanana said:
there is no need to spend 20£ on a fan these days when a 5£ fan will. do the same or better job (arctic p12) unless you absolutely need rgb.
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Its not for RGB, its for high static pressure and RPM, the noctua NF-F12 has no rgb and comes highly recommended.

Ive got to say as well, I've gone the route of "cheap & cheerful" before and you always end up with what you pay for. I'm after solidreliability to push a decent amount of air through fair thick rads hence why the noctuas are on point which unparralelled quality according the many others who have recommended them.

The Noctua's I have selected does: 3000 RPM / 109.8 CFM / 7.63mm Static pressure at 43 DB noise
Artic P12 does : 1800RPM / 56 CFM / 2.20mm statix pressure at 24 DB.

Reference: https://www.overclockers.co.uk/noct...12v-120mm-high-performance-fan-fg-022-nc.html

Any way its radiators I'm after advice for, not the fans.

Are there any Radiators recommended in particular compared to those say offered by EK, I'm running slowly out of options for rads in the size of 480mm it seems.
 
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oldbanana said:
Have you checked HWL rads ?
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I'm not deaf no lol and I wouldnt using the fans at 3000rpm 100% of the time but the amount of air those things can move and the static pressure produced is what I am looking for, pushing air through 40mm or more rads is asking a lot from those P12s doing a 3rd of that of the noctuas. Besides I use over ear closed cup headphones, so for me the fan noise is a zero issue. Sorry everyone else :P the people who have recommended the fans state they are not that much noiser than the average fan whilst having better build quality and afformentioned performance. I wasnt stating any of the above to be rude or anything so apologies if it came across that way, its just I've been over the fans quite a lot in detail offsite and my current loop utiling corsair ML120s leaves a lot to be desired in terms of air pushed through them.

The case can fit a single 560mm rad on one side and a 480 on the other, my original plan was to get 2x 560mm rads as you suggest but now I've bought the case and looked through the manual it states only a single 560mm rad can be fitted though I'm going to look at this in more detail today when I get the chance by removing the extra HDD cages at the rear and making sure 560mms can be mounted. I only had a breif look at the case and manual before I moved it out of the way before my dog or kid got view of it.

Hardware labs is something I was going to look at today but never got round to it, too busy looking into water blocks for 3000 cards. Do you have any experience with their rads? Any quality issues etc? I doubt I need to worry about fin density when getting large + thick radiators lol.

Thanks.
 
oldbanana said:
I personally never used HWL since im a bit of a cheapskate, always used alphacool.
But Ive only ever read good things about hwl, their gtr rads are designed for high speed fans and should outperform even their gtx range, only problem is lack of ports on gtr and gtx range. If u need more than 2 ports per rad they also have sr2 range. They might be a bit on the pricier side and perhaps not the easiest to find but performance and build quality should be the best u can buy.
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I get where you are coming from, I've nornally been on the same team when it comes to that too. Believe it or not you got me reconsidering the fans any way so I have taken your advice on board, perhaps I can find some cheaper noctuas that can move air and oressure between the NF-F12 & P12.

I dont plan on going overboard with the rads by buying the ultra top end, maybe if I was building a 3090 system but I'm not any more.... wallet pretty much said hold it there cowboy, so I do have my limits lol.

Will take a look at those rads today and do a comparison, maybe get some more opinions on them?

Cheers Oldbanana.
 
hlennie said:
That rad looks like it means business. I mean I went for the cheap option and build quality and cooling is great so their premium stuff must be really good.

hate to think of the price but think they will do a great job. What fans u thinking about fitting?
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Im thinking 4x Noctua NF-A12s, they go up to 3000rpm but its not that I am after, their CFM and static pressure numbers are great, 109.8 and 7.63mm respectively so at mid range rpm 1000-1500 I should be getting good airflow over the rads, I'll be using thermal takes rgb rans for inside the front of the case and noctuas in the back doing the heavy duty stuff.

The rads are on the pricey side but I did get told they are like the lambos of the rad world lol and this build is all about that flashy stuff. The main problem will be finding them! Have messaged OCUK to see if they can source them.

Will have some substance like, plan on outting a zen 3 4900x and an aorus 3080 waterforce in it, could technically afford a 3090 with the money I'm spending on cooling but that would be pushing my budget for the unjcorn build, besides, theres always next year :p
 
So I just bought 2 of those Nemesis GTR Radiators, should be Here Sunday/Monday - can test fit them and make sure i got enough space, should do in that case lmao.

I'm guessing the D5 pumps should be sufficient with these?
 
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hlennie said:
Have u thought about the d5 next pumps to control fans and pump speed through software works pretty good in built temp and flow calculations. Cost a bit more bit more but well impressed with mine. Google it your paying premium money for ur loops so might as well go all out.
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I hadnt though they look great. What I haf though about doing was using the EK 240mm Res plates, 1 for each loop that have a D5 pump on the back and mounting them vertically and using an aquacomputer controller that I can mount in the drive bay at the front of the case, then use 2 small fan hubs to control each of the x4 140mms on seperate channels. I'd have to buy seperate temp sensors to get the same effect but there would be an Oled display on the controller and physical controls for the fan speeds.

Looking at.my wishlist I have put the Lamptron CW611 Watercooling controller and the Lamptron SP901 ARGB PWM fan & RGb controller on there.

The Res plates were just an Idea I was going to try and play around with, either mounting them where the traditional resevoirs should go or modding the case to have them fit up by the glass.
 
Haha nope its not me! Lol I havent gotten my rads yet and mine are the Nemesis GTR rads not GTS. I went for the Lambos instead of the porcshes :p

I'm still waiting on my order being processed but they are on express delivery whenever they get around to shipping it. Any way I'd post here first before reddit lol

Edit: just got my DPD notification saying the rads will be here tomorrow, will take the same pic as the one you linked.
 
The res plates I've got my eye on have a D5 built into the back, not sure If I'm going with them yet as it would only look good from the front unless I angle them.

Regardless I hadnt thought of adding another pump to each loop but its something to consider especially for the redundancy side of it.

Quiet isnt going to be a priority with those beasty fans running at a minimum of 1000rpm most of the time, or even when idle they are 800rpm min so not to bothered about noise though I was going to stick with EK D5's whatever the setup I do.
 
Might be a while off yet as waiting on zen 3 and tempted to wait for 20GB RTX 3080 or suoer or ti whatever they call it lmao, or even RDNA2. But I'm looking foward to it myself haha, a bit of a passion prohect really. Going all in on my Darth Vader theme, thinking along the lines of Project Fortress, due to its size lol. Really taking my time on it, will start a build log when I know what I'm doing CPU/MoBo wise.

The only reason I brought up ramping speeds up is those radiators is they perform better at higher speeds (1500rpm+) past those speeds they out perform any other rad but under that they under perform, but like you say I'm only really going to push the fans/rads when I'm stress testing or benchmarking.

Thats what I get though for buying the buggatti of radiators lol I'm quoting someone there hahaha
 
MikeTimbers said:
Thick rads actually don't need much airflow. They're so big their surface area is enormous and any airflow at all moves a lot of heat away.
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It was more to do with density and the static oressure required to push through them from my research and advice given on a discord channel and reddit.

Here is the review for these rads :
http://thermalbench.com/2017/02/07/hardware-labs-black-ice-nemesis-gtr-560-radiator/5/

Its not going to to affect it massively, I understand that as long as there is airflow over such a large area its going to keep it pretty close to ambient as can be lol, especially seperating the loops.

I dont wanna be the know it all, especially given that I asked for advice here and that I have no experience with rads these size. I do appreciate all the answers and further advice i've been getting, I'm just going off advice I was given at the time and what i can remember from thermo and fluid dynamics when doing my engineering studies but I'll admit that was a fair few years ago now and not really put to use in my current engineering setting haha.

Can't wait to see the culmination of it all, just wish October would hurry up! xD
 
The loop I currently have now was a hell of a journey of triumph and stupidity on my part haha, I wont argue that the joy is in the building, took me 3 days and I went hardline right off the bat. A primary reason for doing another loop is my son turned 5 and has expressed considerable interest in computers so I'm hoping he wants to learn from it.

I know I went overboard on the fans, My original plan was to get something like the LL120 corsair fans so I could keep the RGB unified (have a mix of ML and LL fans now and the ML are louder and look worse than the LL fans). Everytime I brought it up it was, get the noctuas/you need noctuas, admitedely the 2000rpm ones but they are the same price, it was hard to choose which advice to follow. My initial research found that 1600rpm fans pushing around 3mmH20 static pressure would have been fine but I got lambasted with that review when I presented that research, the review which I didnt find myself by the way lol, and told I would get worse results at lower speeds than literally every other rad.

So I got the 3krpm fans but they run at minimum 800rpm which is likely where they will stay unlewant a 60Decibel PC lol my current system has the fans at about 1600rpm under load with slim rads and weak fans so I agree with your assessment, I just wanted to lay all the info out there and I of course appreciate more insight from someone who actually as the equipment running lol.
 
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