New Car Opinions ?

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:38

marcus25 said:
new fiesta zetec-S? 1.6, insurance grp 7

Just trying to think of reasons why you'd pick that when a nice 3 door 2.0 16v Focus is only one insurance group higher.

Will let you know when I find any

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:45

Corsa 1.8 SRI would be a pretty good choice, cheap to run, decent fuel economy (unlike the focus 2.0) and you would be able to get a good, low miler and pretty new for around your budget. Worth a test drive.

Or a Astra Mk4 SRI and for insurance sake a 1.8 as opposed to a 2.0 or 2.2. Stay away from ford tbh. And the clios and definately fiats. French build qulity is so poor. My 172 had enough niggles to rack up 3k in warranty claims over 2 years and what would have been 1500 in servicing this month. (only done 30k)

Oakesy2001uk · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:47

my focus with koni's and proper wheels is just a cornering marvel, if it had more waft it would be a guided missile. I think in december when I'm 21 its either RS engine and brakes in it! or a 182 trophy! If you can get one of the ltd edition focuses (like mine) then you get leather, heated everything. love it (just not fast enough)

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:47

I find it very amusing that somebody can on the one hand say 'Stay away from Ford' and then go on to recommend products from Vauxhall

Ok, the Astra in 1.8 SRi form is actually half decent, but the Corsa? Over a Focus? You'd have to be smoking unusual substances, sorry.

Concern with the Astra though would be reliability. They can have a tendancy to.... break and cost money to fix. Focus is a very reliable car indeed which should give little, if any, trouble.

Oakesy2001uk · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:53

mrk1@1 said:
Corsa 1.8 SRI would be a pretty good choice, cheap to run, decent fuel economy (unlike the focus 2.0) and you would be able to get a good, low miler and pretty new for around your budget. Worth a test drive.

Or a Astra Mk4 SRI and for insurance sake a 1.8 as opposed to a 2.0 or 2.2. Stay away from ford tbh. And the clios and definately fiats. French build qulity is so poor. My 172 had enough niggles to rack up 3k in warranty claims over 2 years and what would have been 1500 in servicing this month. (only done 30k)

and you would reccomend a vauxhall for reliability? sound like you have had a bad experience but vauxhall no better!

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:54

[TW]Fox said:
I find it very amusing that somebody can on the one hand say 'Stay away from Ford' and then go on to recommend products from Vauxhall Ok, the Astra in 1.8 SRi form is actually half decent, but the Corsa? Over a Focus? You'd have to be smoking unusual substances, sorry.

I would chose vauxhall over ford as a personal choice, but the focus 2.0 isn't cheap to run and from experience of friends, as the mileage goes up there can quite a few £££ service bills. Ok if you can get a good low miler < 30k miles, but the chances are for the money you would get a corsa 1.8 with 2 years warranty left.

Generally the pecking order as I would see it for Hot hatches

1st Japanese
2nd = Ford-Vauxhall
3rd = VW
100th = Citroen-Pug (bar 205 1.9 GTI)-Renault-
101th = Fiat

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:57

Oakesy2001uk said:
and you would reccomend a vauxhall for reliability? sound like you have had a bad experience but vauxhall no better!

Nope, reliability no better from experience, just more likely to get a newer (VX) one with warranty left.

As far as reliability goes I have found vx and ford to be the same with niggley type probs. The french cars I have had have all had serious electric and mechanical faults

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 16:57

mrk1@1 said:
I would chose vauxhall over ford as a personal choice, but the focus 2.0 isn't cheap to run and from experience of friends, as the mileage goes up there can quite a few £££ service bills. Ok if you can get a good low miler < 30k miles, but the chances are for the money you would get a corsa 1.8 with 2 years warranty left.

Unless the Focus has an unusual 'wallet extraction module' fitted to the engine, it is most certainly cheap to run. I have the same engine in my car, and costs very little to keep on the road. There is nothing on it that costs a load to service, even the cambelt only needs changing at 100,000 miles - in the time it takes a Focus to reach its first cambelt change a Vauxhall would be half way to its third.

A major service at a main dealer is under 100 quid or less than 40 quid in parts to do it yourself. They are reliable, cheap to run cars.

I find your 'pecking order' for hot hatches amusing - anyone who knows hot hatches knows that nobody makes a hot hatch like the French, yes bits fall off of them but in terms of pure ability Pug/Cit/Renault are RIGHT up there.

And MILES above Vag who seem more adept at blue dials, damped grab handles and kidding the world into thinking they never break down

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:01

[TW]Fox said:
Unless the Focus has an unusual 'wallet extraction module' fitted to the engine, snip

Fair point, but you have to find a good one, which can be hard. Finding an ex demo/vx corsa 1.8 from a dealer is a lot easier.

In terms of hot hatch pecking order, I was refering to reliability not ability. Ability is a totally different order.

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:02

mrk1@1 said:
Fair point, but you have to find a good one, which can be hard.

No it isn't, there are millions of them around and most of them are 'good ones'. It's a well built, proprely reliable car.

Finding an ex demo/vx corsa 1.8 from a dealer is a lot easier.

Wouldn't buy a car from a dealer anyway, rather not pay somebody elses profit margin. Plus sure, you get a 'warranty' but you also unfortunately have to have a Corsa as well, not that great a deal when you think about it like that

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:07

[TW]Fox said:
No it isn't, there are millions of them around and most of them are 'good ones'. It's a well built, proprely reliable car.

Wouldn't buy a car from a dealer anyway, rather not pay somebody elses profit margin. Plus sure, you get a 'warranty' but you also unfortunately have to have a Corsa as well, not that great a deal when you think about it like that

Class, made me laugh. Too true. In this situation, I would say the corsa over focus but the OP needs to try them. Totally differnt sorts of cars.

big_white_dog84 · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:10

After reading this thread I am off to find a 2.0 16v Focus. No NCB though

but I have been driving for 3 years so it might be down a bit.

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:11

Pfft you'll be fine, had no NCB when I insured my Mondeo at 19 and that's Group 12.

(and better and half the price but hey

)

big_white_dog84 · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:14

I haven't ever really looked a fords before - what's the difference between the Ghias / Zetecs etc?

Scrutinize · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:16

[TW]Fox said:
Pfft you'll be fine, had no NCB when I insured my Mondeo at 19 and that's Group 12.

(and better and half the price but hey )

He speaketh the truth, the mondeo is a good choice.

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:41

big_white_dog84 said:
I haven't ever really looked a fords before - what's the difference between the Ghias / Zetecs etc?

I'll Focus (hahahhahahaha etc lol bbq sorry) on the 2.0 trim levels for you.

You'll be finding cars in three forms - Ghia, Zetec and Zetec ESP. Ghia is the 'luxury' model although we'll use that with a bit of salt with the Focus. It has velour seats, fake plastic wood, a CD changer, alloys, air conditioning.

Zetec is the 'sporty' model - you get 16" alloys on the 2.0 and 15mm lower suspension, but with the earlier models at least you don't get air conditioning - it was an option and came with the 'climate pack' which included heated mirrors and a heated front windscreen as well.

Later Zetec's had AC and heated screen as standard, later Ghia's had rear electric windows and climate control.

Zetec ESP is a Zetec with Electronic Stability Package - they made a song and dance about it and gave it its own little model designation.

Performance etc is the same in both models BUT only the Zetec is available as a 3 door.

tzang · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:50

mrk1@1 said:
Corsa 1.8 SRI would be a pretty good choice, cheap to run, decent fuel economy (unlike the focus 2.0) and you would be able to get a good, low miler and pretty new for around your budget. Worth a test drive.

I fail to agree as I own a 55-reg Corsa myself. I've driven a Focus for nearly a year for my driving lessons.... stick a Corsa side-by-side with a Focus, the Focus wins it in every sector but fuel economy and security:
Reliability
Spacious
Comfortable
Boot load
Safety
Long-term value (Corsa depreciates like mad, lost £5000 on my Corsa after 5 months and 7700 miles from new)
Quiet & refined

Pick up a Focus Ghia model and you get quite a few goodies unlike a Corsa SRi. Focus are known for their reliability and so is the Corsa, both cars are easy to drive (otherwise BSM and AA wouldn't use them) though small niggly problems do exist in the Corsa (I've had plenty of problems, about to take car in for the 9th time this coming Monday

). From experience, if it was a choice between Ford and Vauxhall, Ford wins every time. Dealer services are average but when it comes to Customer Care, Vauxhall is horrible, and I'm referring to Vauxhall as a whole, not the dealer.

However, you need to consider what you are using the car for. If it is for motorways or high mileage use, a Focus would be better (it is built for that purpose). For town driving, a Corsa would be more suited if you are worried about economy though the Focus would do an equally good job.

Just don't buy a Mondeo RSAP

[TW]Fox said:
There is nothing on it that costs a load to service, even the cambelt only needs changing at 100,000 miles - in the time it takes a Focus to reach its first cambelt change a Vauxhall would be half way to its third.

Corsas are chain driven (not 100% sure if the 1.8 is though)

[TW]Fox · 3 Mar 2006 at 17:52

Well the 1.8 has a cambelt with a hilariously low 40k mile change interval

Demon · 3 Mar 2006 at 19:42

Out of all the cars mentioned, the Focus makes the most sense.. 2.0 engine with good insurance..

I'd also look at something like the Vauxhall Astra Coupe, 1.8, Insurance group 9, and looks very nice in 2d coupe form,

Performance wise, they are identical..

And ignore the Ford Vs Vauxhall banter.. just unfounded opinion.. but we are all entitled to them..

Kitchster_uk · 3 Mar 2006 at 19:54

Xsara VTR? Not ree bad but t s good asthe focus tbh. How about spendig £500 less and getting a higher group car? Group 12 will open up a lot of cars that are a) more fun, b) have lower depreciation (in some cases anyway) and that take you into the 'sports' coupe market. MX-5 1.8i is great fun - I have an R-plate soft top only and leave it parked on-street all day without a single problem thus far (touch wood). It isn't even parked near work and it is a quiet steet. Hard tops are around the £500 mark. Toyota Celica would be in your budget - the old 1.8i is a group 12 but am not too sure about the more modern ones.