New mid-range desktop c. £1100

InKursion

InKursion

InKursion

Associate
Joined
20 Oct 2005
Posts
1,921
Location
Cheltenham/London.
Hello OCUK! A long long time indeed ... must be about a decade since my last OCUK custom build! What with the next few months/year being what they are, I think it's time to re-discover some games and staying-home pleasures. Please can you help spec me a build? I am hopelessly out of date (my current desktop, gathering dust, is an i5 760!)

I would like a decent mid-range machine. I'll outline a few use points that might be helpful. I'd really appreciate your advice!

  • I am going to be WFH full-time on it. Nothing strenuous, just typical office work via vApps/virtual machine. Office Suite, Adobe, a browser with 5–10 tabs, 4–5 PDFs and Word docs open at once, etc, on top of the normal machine's media player/browser/etc. As far as I understand it, a lot of the responsiveness of the vApps comes from the host server (correct me if I'm wrong), but I'm unsure whether I'll need to push 32gb of RAM (I just agonised over the same decision with a 16" MBP all of 2 months ago, but OSX uses RAM in such a different way that the more you can put in, the more it'll earmark ... etc)
  • I purchased a 34-inch ultra wide a while back, mostly for my WFH rota, but I'd like to put it to some use with gaming now, too, if possible. It's a BenQ EX3501R, decent I think, and goes up to 100Hz. I've never seen above 60Hz as my GPU is ancient (!) So I'm prepared to spend out for a decent 3440x1440p capable GPU.
  • I spend a lot of time on conference calls, I use a Zoom H5 microphone that I have handy, and loud case fans drive it nuts. I'm willing to spend some extra dosh on a nice case/cooler/fans to keep it quiet. Not sure I need the performance temps of water-cooling, but it's come a long way I understand from 2010, when it was strictly for enthusiasts.
  • I'd also be interested in doing a smaller form factor build. I can't stand the giant/midi tower thing with lots of plastic, grilles, see through doors, RGB, bells and whistles. It's going to be sharing a desk or cabinet with a MBP, some nice DACs, some Adam A7X speakers, etc. So a small brushed aluminium case would be ideal and in keeping with the 'aesthetique' ;)
  • I am currently moving all of my media and files to a Synology NAS, so I don't want oodles of internal storage. Possibly one of the current-gen SSDs and that's it. The caveat with the NAS is that it eats my only available wallplug-Ethernet cable. As such, I need to accommodate for Wifi/Bluetooth. Is this better done right in the mobo or using dongles/expansion cards?
That's probably enough rambling. Here's what I have in my basket, being fairly clueless.

Mobo

MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX (Socket AM4) DDR4 ATX Motherboard
or
MSI B450 GAMING PRO CARBON AC (Socket AM4) DDR4 ATX Motherboard

No surprises for my choices here? I guess it comes down to whether it's better to get the integrated WiFi or seek alternatives. B450 seem fine as, so far I understand, I can drop bigger, better Ryzen cores in it at a later date? (Possibly with a RAM upgrade in +2 years time?)

What are the smaller form factor alternatives? MicroATX with Wifi? Worth it?

CPU

Here I'm pretty stuck and can't figure out what will get the best use in a combined 1440p gaming/work/media machine.

AMD Ryzen 5 3600 Six Core 4.2GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail
or
AMD Ryzen 5 3600X Six Core 4.4GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail
or
AMD Ryzen 7 3700X Eight Core 4.4GHz (Socket AM4) Processor - Retail

I guess what this comes down to is: do I go for the 3700X now and enjoy it for the full life of the machine, 4–5 years or whatever, or do I save now and then buy an older, higher-end processor in 2 years time? What actually ends up saving money or making sense? Would it make sense to buy a 6-core CPU now to then conceivably bin it for an 8-core+ machine later?

Are coolers necessary for these Ryzens? Are the stock coolers loud? I'm willing to spend £50 or so on a Noctua if it'll shush the machine.

GPU

As my screen is a BenQ Free-Sync screen, and as my MBP uses AMD-ATI drivers for its own onboard 5500M graphics (and considering any future potential in an eGPU set-up), I think this is fairly straightforward, of all my choices.

Aorus Radeon RX 5700 XT 8GB GDDR6 PCI-Express Graphics Card

RAM

3200Mhz or 3600Mhz? 4000Mhz? Is it even measured in Mhz? Questions questions ...

Patriot Viper Steel 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4 PC4-28800C17 3600MHz Dual Channel Kit (PVS416G360C7K)
or
∞

Don't even get me started on 16 Gb vs 32Gb. What's the general consensus in Windows10 now? See my above comments about replacing CPUs: does it even make sense to buy 16 now and intend to buy again 32 in 2 years' time?

Storage

This looks fine?

WD Blue SN550 500GB NVME M.2 2280 PCIe Gen3 Solid State Drive (WDS500G2B0C)

I assume the above mobos can support it, and that I can transfer a Windows install from an old SSD to this thing.

PSU

The PSU was the most crapulous part in my last build, and it showed. The machine only POSTs half the time now. I'm thinking it's best to get a modular 650W. I have no idea what the ratings mean. Gold sounds good. Who doesn't want gold?

Seasonic Core Gold GM-650 650W 80+ Gold Modular Power Supply

I suppose I might need a smaller factor PSU if I get a small case. Which, finally ...

Case

I do like the aesthetic of this Meshify, for a regular Midi tower.

Fractal Design Meshify C Blackout Midi Tower Case - Black Tempered Glass
or
Fractal Design Meshify C Mini Dark TG Micro-ATX Case - Black
The mini version? or A mini-ITX?
Fractal Design Define Nano S Mini-ITX Case - Black


Total budget is around £1100-1200. I will stretch a little more if a certain combo of CPU/GPU/RAM etc require it for maximum tie-in.

Thanks so much guys. Sorry for the wall of text!
 
Last edited:
@InKursion

Aorus B450 has vastly superior VRM to both ATX boards mentioned above

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/giga...ocket-am4-mini-itx-motherboard-mb-57h-gi.html

MSI does have the better VRM in its ITX version but Aorus leads in better Audio and WiFi - specially if you have BT/Virgin/Sky & talk talk latest MIMO routers !
Also UK RMA center for the mobo which the others don't have .

Some reason ITX boards are just built better . And the space saving is huge !

Small, console style build. Good WiFi and 32GB to boot as it only has 2 ram slots Vs normal sized boards 4 .
Gigabyte Gaming brand Vs their Aorus RX card. Has 3 yes Vs the Aorus 4 but main reason for selection is it's 2.5 slots Vs Aorus 3 slot cooler. The case has two slim 15mm fans mounted directly underneath the GPU. Use the Aorus and they have to be removed I believe . Using the Gaming OC with low profile fans would offer better thermals

My basket at Overclockers UK:
Total: £1,088.18 (includes shipping: £12.30)​
​
 
Thanks for the fast response! That's a lot of kit for £1,088! Impressed to see 1Tb storage and 32gb RAM! Thanks a lot.

I've not looked into mini-ITX before. For some reason ITX always struck the fear of God into me as 'small and fiddly to build'. Ditto the HTPC/console-style cases! Do you know if they'll be able to accommodate an extra 2.5" SSD or a 1Tb SATA drive, as carry-overs from my old PC?

I should add with regards to onboard audio that I'm not bothered in the slightest. I have a Universal Audio Apollo Twin on my desk for creative work/processing and a Topping DX7 Pro DAC/headphone amp for listening. All my audio is outside the box, so to speak.

I notice that you've gone with the 3600 rather than the 3600X/3700X. The base processor is good enough for high-resolution gaming? I haven't the foggiest!

I'll do some further digging on the above this lunch. Ta!
 
Last edited:
InKursion said:
Thanks for the fast response! That's a lot of kit for £1,088! Impressed to see 1Tb storage and 32gb RAM! Thanks a lot.

I've not looked into mini-ITX before. For some reason ITX always struck the fear of God into me as 'small and fiddly to build'. Ditto the HTPC/console-style cases! Do you know if they'll be able to accommodate an extra 2.5" SSD or a 1Tb SATA drive, as carry-overs from my old PC?

I should add with regards to onboard audio that I'm not bothered in the slightest. I have a Universal Audio Apollo Twin on my desk for creative work/processing and a Topping DX7 Pro DAC/headphone amp for listening. All my audio is outside the box, so to speak.

I notice that you've gone with the 3600 rather than the 3600X/3700X. The base processor is good enough for high-resolution gaming? I haven't the foggiest!

I'll do some further digging on the above this lunch. Ta!
Click to expand...

no real difference with 3600x over 3600 - booth can be manually Overclocked too 4.2ghz all cores anyways. Ryzen is a lot better at Intel for being pushed hard without having to mess around with it.

could easily get 3700x and 32GB of Ram in there, Just means dropping to RX 5700 - ideally you'd want the extra grunt of the XT version due to Extra wide 1440p vs standard 1440p monitor.

getting larger possible ssd at the start is great! specially with windows eating up a lot of space if you dont delete older versions along with games getting 60GB plus in size!

The case can hold 2x 2.5" SSD/HDD above /back of the GPU holder as well as the board being able to house dual m.2 slots for SSD!

Higher the Res, more work and focus on the GPU. personally would go 3600 + 5700XT then 3700x +5700 Non XT for gaming. can always slap ryzen 4*** in 2/3 years time if CPU is left wanting

@tamzzy has this case in stock form ! not to sure if he can comment if triple slot GPU will fit in with slim 15mm fans underneath it

using B-Grade 3700X (check if stock cooler comes with box via customer service) gets you just over your £1100 budget with RX 5700XT card!!!

you get free shipping so £1129

My basket at Overclockers UK:
Total: £1,141.18 (includes shipping: £12.30)
​
 
Last edited:
Thanks again for all your help with this -- explanation of CPU vs GPU makes a lot of sense to me. I don't suppose I'll immediately get much benefit out of having 8-cores simmering away doing standard office tasks and the occasional game, as opposed to 6 (I went with an i7 over i9 on my MBP with the same rationale, plus a lot of fussing over thermals). I don't do any rendering or heavy CPU work, and my music stuff is bounced to a DAC with DSP, so ... 3600 it is!

With regards to noise and temps, would it reward an after-market cooler? I understand the Ryzen default cooler is pretty decent.

Not to be difficult, but what about a mini-ITX 'standard' profile case? I'm lead more in this direction because of my current desk set-up. I have rectangular cabinet/shelf style spaces on either side of the desk, and a miniaturized (< 35cm height) mini case would fit in nicely on one shelf (with my NAS on the other :) )

Something like Define Nano S or similar? It's out of stock and I'm keen to order away asap so I'm not fixed on this exact one. But would this form factor also allow me to worry less about space constraints/GPU size/etc? That's the part where I start to get nervous due to inexperience!
 
InKursion said:
Thanks again for all your help with this -- explanation of CPU vs GPU makes a lot of sense to me. I don't suppose I'll immediately get much benefit out of having 8-cores simmering away doing standard office tasks and the occasional game, as opposed to 6 (I went with an i7 over i9 on my MBP with the same rationale, plus a lot of fussing over thermals). I don't do any rendering or heavy CPU work, and my music stuff is bounced to a DAC with DSP, so ... 3600 it is!

With regards to noise and temps, would it reward an after-market cooler? I understand the Ryzen default cooler is pretty decent.

Not to be difficult, but what about a mini-ITX 'standard' profile case? I'm lead more in this direction because of my current desk set-up. I have rectangular cabinet/shelf style spaces on either side of the desk, and a miniaturized (< 35cm height) mini case would fit in nicely on one shelf (with my NAS on the other :) )

Something like Define Nano S or similar? It's out of stock and I'm keen to order away asap so I'm not fixed on this exact one. But would this form factor also allow me to worry less about space constraints/GPU size/etc? That's the part where I start to get nervous due to inexperience!
Click to expand...

ITX cases still a little behind with space for 2.5/3 slot GPUs... which is good as ITX components are mostly more expensive ! and run higher rated Components

In Win tasty Number with PSU included

BB CODE
My basket at Overclockers UK:

Vertical case
My basket at Overclockers UK:
Total: £1,102.15 (includes shipping: £12.30)
​

and then Neo G-Mini which would allow you to add in the Aoorus RX 5700 XT for extra £10 with 4 yr warranty and triple slot cooler !
Would allow you to use a Cheaper ATX sized PSU and if you wanted to add in a 240mm CLC/AIO at a later date

http://metallicgear.com/products/Neo-G-Mini-V2
 
Last edited:
Brilliant, thanks so much for your help orbital!

Looking forward to taking this lot to the Checkout after work tonight :)
 
orbitalwalsh said:
My basket at Overclockers UK:
Total: £1,158.15 (includes shipping: £12.30)
Click to expand...


Having spent a good hour mulling it over and looking at the (very nice) Neo G-Mini, I think this build is the one!

I might possibly swap out the WD Blue 1Tb for the original 500Gb, simply because I have a 1tb SATA for raw data and could put the £70 towards a 3600Mhz 2x16Gb set? Am I right in thinking those lead to maximal happiness for Ryzen processors? Or won't it matter much because I don't have an 'X' version? The extra space would be very welcome, you're right, but I'm not the sort to hoard lots of AAA titles, especially if they're single player.

With regards to future mods to bring any case noise down (thinking of that glass panel in the Lian Li): I assume my options will be throwing 120mm fans in the bottom and a mid-size CPU cooler?

I will wait to see how the stock CPU/GPU thermals are first, in any case.

Let me know where to send the crate of beer ;)
 
Rather have higher storage then ram speed. Makes more of a diff with 12/16 cores Ryzen or 1080p high Hz gaming.
Can just overclock the 3200hz kit slightly faster :)
Glass panel is better then metal panel as it cuts sound better. If the metal panel had sound damp material then fare enough but doesn't
 
I did not know that! I think I was assuming about the black metal panel because the Fractal designs I was looking at previously had sound dampening on their non-glass versions.

In terms of overclocking the 3600 and the first RAM kit, and with regards to the AORUS mobo/BIOS, how difficult is it to OC them? I suppose I can find some guides ...

I'm noticing the build is quite handily blacked-out. Perhaps some upgraded black case fans to come ... :) Would you know what would work best in the 150? I assume some bottom fans giving more air to the GPU rather than changing the front/back with better diameters.
 
Last edited:
InKursion said:
I did not know that! I think I was assuming about the black metal panel because the Fractal designs I was looking at previously had sound dampening on their non-glass versions.

In terms of overclocking the 3600 and the first RAM kit, and with regards to the AORUS mobo/BIOS, how difficult is it to OC them? I suppose I can find some guides ...

I'm noticing the build is quite handily blacked-out. Perhaps some upgraded black case fans to come ... :) Would you know what would work best in the 150? I assume some bottom fans giving more air to the GPU rather than changing the front/back with better diameters.
Click to expand...

 
Me again -- the Lian Li does not ship with fans, I think.

Therefore which front/rear fans should I get? Black if possible :)

Am I right in thinking I can just throw any sort of Noctua 120mm in there? The higher the RPM, the better? Or does it make more sense to have higher RPM in the front or back, specifically? So many questions!
 
Last edited:
After spending way longer than is sane reading about case fans (had no idea it would be such a deep dive, woah), I settled for 2 of the generic air-flow/static pressure Noctua black 120mms.

I would have liked to get one of their big thick 25mm ones for the rear exhaust but it only comes in Noctua's trademark brown!

(The benefit of adding a front-panel intake to the main rear exhaust on the Lian Li seems to be not great, but I want to keep the fan RPM down so sharing the load between 2 makes sense, I think.)

I'm not sure if I can utilise the bottom radiator tray with the big boy 3-slot GPU, so I'll leave it for now. Ditto a CPU cooler.
 
Last edited:
InKursion said:
After spending way longer than is sane reading about case fans (had no idea it would be such a deep dive, woah), I settled for 2 of the generic air-flow/static pressure Noctua black 120mms.

I would have liked to get one of their big thick 25mm ones for the rear exhaust but it only comes in Noctua's trademark brown!

(The benefit of adding a front-panel intake to the main rear exhaust on the Lian Li seems to be not great, but I want to keep the fan RPM down so sharing the load between 2 makes sense, I think.)

I'm not sure if I can utilise the bottom radiator tray with the big boy 3-slot GPU, so I'll leave it for now. Ditto a CPU cooler.
Click to expand...

In Win has fans installed at the bottom of the chassis then had that plastic covering around it allowing for thick GPUs and air flow .

Personally my fav is Neo G mini V2 as it makes for a better layout

https://www.reddit.com/r/sffpc/comm...amp&utm_medium=&utm_content=comments_view_all

Not sure if a 12mm would fit at the bottom ..

15mm
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/silverstone-sst-fn123-fn-series-fan-1215-white-black-fg-051-sv.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/silverstone-sst-fn124b-fn-series-slim-120mm-fg-05l-sv.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/silverstone-sst-fw124-argb-fw-series-pwm-120mm-fg-05m-sv.html
 
InKursion said:
After spending way longer than is sane reading about case fans (had no idea it would be such a deep dive, woah), I settled for 2 of the generic air-flow/static pressure Noctua black 120mms.

I would have liked to get one of their big thick 25mm ones for the rear exhaust but it only comes in Noctua's trademark brown!

(The benefit of adding a front-panel intake to the main rear exhaust on the Lian Li seems to be not great, but I want to keep the fan RPM down so sharing the load between 2 makes sense, I think.)

I'm not sure if I can utilise the bottom radiator tray with the big boy 3-slot GPU, so I'll leave it for now. Ditto a CPU cooler.
Click to expand...

In Win has fans installed at the bottom of the chassis then had that plastic covering around it allowing for thick GPUs and air flow .

Personally my fav is Neo G mini V2 as it makes for a better layout

https://www.reddit.com/r/sffpc/comm...amp&utm_medium=&utm_content=comments_view_all

Not sure if a 12mm would fit at the bottom ..

15mm
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/silverstone-sst-fn123-fn-series-fan-1215-white-black-fg-051-sv.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/silverstone-sst-fn124b-fn-series-slim-120mm-fg-05l-sv.html

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/silverstone-sst-fw124-argb-fw-series-pwm-120mm-fg-05m-sv.html
 
Thanks -- I think I've got a grip on it (I'm sure I'll come unstuck when the assembly begins!)

Order processing, awaiting payment :)
 
InKursion said:
Thanks -- I think I've got a grip on it (I'm sure I'll come unstuck when the assembly begins!)

Order processing, awaiting payment :)
Click to expand...

its a shame you didn't buy yesterday before 12.... prices have shifted up.

Personally, give OCUK a call... point out this thread and say you were going to pull the trigger but wasn't informed that Deals change over at 12pm every wednesday ! Dont ask you dont get !

thats actually quite a bit of money ! Honestly push it or half way , Aorus GPU is up aboout £40!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom